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Say It Ain't So, Dubya
boblonsberry.com ^ | 1/7/04 | Bob Lonsberrry

Posted on 01/07/2004 6:06:39 AM PST by shortstop

In politics, it’s good to be up for grabs. And it’s miserable to be a sure thing.

As President Bush will prove today. In an expected announcement of sweeping amnesty and Social Security benefits for illegal Mexican aliens, the president will kick conservatives in the teeth in order to woo Latino voters.

It’s clear proof that the adage “Dance with the one what brung ya” doesn’t apply in the GOP.

In the GOP, conservatives exist to donate money and vote a straight ticket, and then be ignored. At least in this Administration and by this Congress. Time after time, the principles of those who put George W. Bush in office have been compromised and rejected. And now, on an issue that could forever alter the nature of the United States, conservatives are being betrayed by their president.

And, you could argue, so is the country.

What are the details? We won’t learn until today. But it is expected that a new “adjusted work status” will be announced for most of the eight million Mexicans currently in this country illegally. Also, lifetime Social Security benefits will be guaranteed illegal Mexican aliens – even after they leave the United States – if they pay Social Security tax for as little as 18 months.

Lawbreakers will be rewarded, and the American taxpayer will become the primary funder of the Mexican retirement system.

And billions of dollars of wages earned by illegal aliens will continue to be sent back to Mexico – bleeding our prosperity and continuing as the second largest cash source for the Mexican economy.

Why is this happening?

Why is the Republican president selling out everything you would think his party stands for?

Because the Latino vote is in play.

Simply put, the large number of Latinos in America have not yet clearly identified with a political party. And the Republicans want them. The Democratic Party owns the black vote lock, stock and barrel and the Republican Party wants to do the same with the Latino vote.

Democrats hope to draw Latino voters by convincing them – as they have African-Americans – that they are an underprivileged minority which needs the Democratic Party to avenge it against the larger American culture.

Republicans hope to draw Latino voters by convincing them – as they have American moderates and conservatives – that they are part of the larger American culture.

Democrats want people identified as minorities; Republicans want people identified as the mainstream.

Apparently President Bush believes that the Republican Party can win the heart of Latinos by rewarding millions of illegal Mexican aliens and by creating a welfare entitlement for people who aren’t even Americans.

Specifically, by caving in to a demand by Mexican President Vicente Fox – the author of the policy President Bush will announce today.

Latinos are powerful because they are up for grabs. Conservatives are powerless because they are a sure thing.

Honestly, if conservatives get ticked off at George W. Bush, what are they going to do? Who are they going to vote for?

Howard Dean? Hillary Clinton?

No way.

After being walked on and ignored, conservatives will dutifully come out this fall to support not just President Bush but the Republican Congress. Why?

Because we want judges and cabinet secretaries and protections for guns and free enterprise and property rights – things we didn’t really get this go round but hope to get in the next.

Conservatives are patsies to the Republican Party, just like blacks are patsies to the Democratic Party. Both get stroked at election time, and both get some very pretty speeches, but when it comes time to make laws and keep promises, both groups are roundly ignored by their parties.

Critics of this policy – as comments from the White House spokesman already indicate – are going to be labeled xenophobes and bigots. There will be syrupy quotes about this being a nation of immigrants and how new people coming to America make it a better nation.

Well, it used to be that way. When our foreign forefathers came to America to be Americans.

But those days have passed. Overwhelmingly, Mexicans come to America to be Mexicans. The melting pot is broken. The language is not learned, the culture is not adopted, the customs and values are not acquired.

And in a couple of generations the Latin Quarter is going to refer to that part of America west of Louisiana and south of Oregon and Idaho. There is a broad-based Latinization of the United States underway, a cultural conquest that the Mexican army could not win but the American government is willing to surrender.

We are growing our own Quebec, and it speaks Spanish. Latino immigrants, and specifically Mexicans, are wonderful people. Yet their success in this country – and the continued integrity of this country – are dependant on obeying the law and acquiring the culture and values of the American Constitution and heritage.

And that is not done by rewarding those whose first act on American soil was an immigration crime.

Instead of granting amnesty and rewarding lawbreakers, we should make a guest-worker program that lets Mexican immigrants walk honorably through the front door instead of illegally through the back door. We have the jobs, they want the work, let us bring order to putting the two together.

And then secure the borders, with troops if need be, so that illegal immigration stops.

Reward those who do right, not those who do wrong. Quicker, more efficient legal immigration is right. Amnesty is wrong.

And this fool idea of opening the empty Social Security coffers to Mexican nationals in Mexico is insane.

But if insanity buys votes, in an election year it becomes law.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2004; aliens; bush; buyingvotes; camejo; cheney; dubya; edwards; election; gwb; illegalmexicans; invasion; kerry; lonsberry; mexico; nader; pandering; plunderamericans; theft; thenannystate; thewelfarestate; welfarestate
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To: Dane
"They're obviously working and helping business and they are taking jobs most Americans don't want. I just don't see a person cleaning toilets everyday as somebody evil as you are wont to."

Do you really believe that business cant find workers? Or is it more likely that they dont pay wages that are sufficient to live on. By allowing illegals to work these jobs then wages are kept artifically low and the middle and poor are hurt. Moreover many of the jobs by illegals are for cash and they do not pay taxes but recieve healthcare, education, ect.... all for free. Dont buy the line that Americans dont want these jobs or at least research it before you repeat what the liberals and Republican elitists want you to think. Remember it is business pushing this lie so that they can keep profits high and overhead low.
81 posted on 01/07/2004 6:58:17 AM PST by sasafras (sasafras (The road to hell is paved with good intentions))
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To: rushmom
Exactly.
82 posted on 01/07/2004 6:59:06 AM PST by Lady Eileen
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To: shortstop
If Bush can get a million Mexican's to voluntarily buy into the worlds biggest Ponzi scheme (Social Security), he will go down as the greatest salesman on earth.

Sometimes some conservatives have no clue about finances and react to emotionally.

83 posted on 01/07/2004 6:59:28 AM PST by VRWC_minion (Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and most are right)
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To: SheLion
Conservatives must stand strong and uphold the values that make this country great. Voting for Bush no matter what he does is no different than the blacks voting for democrats eventhough they continue to be ignored. If you want real change then you have to make a stand. Anybody but Bush04
84 posted on 01/07/2004 7:00:54 AM PST by sasafras (sasafras (The road to hell is paved with good intentions))
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To: shortstop
"..the president will kick conservatives in the teeth in order to woo Latino voters."

Bush is not a conservative, never was, never will be. Like his father, Bush I, he is a "moderate".

His attempts to woo Hispanic voters in this fashion will fail. He is obviously being directed by that evil Carville clone Karl Rove (we should start calling him Karville Rove).
Those Hispanics here already who are legal residents, along with all legal foreign residents should be, and are outraged by this pandering to criminals by the Bush Administration. They actually have filed a suit against the current administration under the equal protection clause of the Constitution.

Those Hispanics here legally who vote have more important concerns than the issue of amensty for illegals. Illegals can't vote until they become citizens. Most Hispanics vote Democratic, but they are a potential source of Republican votes as they have a strong family structure and family values, are generally religious, are social conservatives and a great many of them are hard workers, working long hours, frequently at several jobs, and also become involved in estbalishing their own businesses. The fact that most vote Demcoratic is due to poor salesmanship on the part of Republicans, the fact that a large precentage of them live in urban ares which are controlled by Democratic political machines, and, frankly, prejudice on the part of many Anglo Republicans.

But granting amnesty to illegal invaders will not secure more Hispanic votes. MY suspicion is this agenda is ALSO tied with the Administration's need to pander to the interests of American businesses which supported Bush and want cheap foreign laborers.
85 posted on 01/07/2004 7:01:04 AM PST by ZULU (Remember the Alamo!!!!!)
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To: Dane
Nope,it's not right up there with murder.

My point is that there are many people waitng for permission to enter this country legally and yet we give the ones that enter illegally a break.

It's not fair.

Why bother with any immigration laws at all? Just open the borders and let them all in.

As far as the sarcasm about cleaning toilets etc. Many LEGAL immigrants did those jobs for years and some of my predecessors were among them.I would feel the same way about illegal professionals.
86 posted on 01/07/2004 7:01:44 AM PST by Mears
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To: Dane; kinghorse; shortstop; bullpup; futureceo31; P.O.E.; RiflemanSharpe; expat_panama; ...
"Wow crossing the border to have a life making beds or cleaning toilets is right up there with murder to you isn't it."

Speaking of crossing the border, jobs, and murder, America has NOBODY to blame for this mess but those who inherited the greatest economic prospertiy in the histor of the world - THE BABY BOOMERS!

Q: Why does the United States Government permit wholesale illegal Mexican immigration?

A: For the workers.

Q: Why does the United States Government need foreign workers (not just Mexicans)?

A: It does not have enough labor force to meet the service sector and other blue collar work sector demands and growth within it's economy.

Q: Why does the United States Government not have enough workers to meet economic demand?

A: Over TWENTY MILLION AMERICAN WORKERS HAVE BEEN ABORTED OVER THE PAST TWENTY YEARS.

Q: If over twenty million American workers have been aborted over the past twenty years, who is going to pay for (read: generate taxes) the Social Security of the baby-boomer generation (now reaching critical mass)? (NOTE: BABY BOOMERS have killed as many Americans as Lenin and Stalin did Russians.)

A: Mexican workers.

Final Question: If they had survived, who would they have to thank for it and WHO WOULD THE TWENTY MILLION ABORTED AMERICANS HAVE VOTED MOST FOR?

Any questions?

87 posted on 01/07/2004 7:01:44 AM PST by Happy2BMe (2004 - Who WILL the TERRORISTS vote for? - - Not George W. Bush, THAT'S for sure!)
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To: Lady Eileen
"Rush needs to provide evidence for this or stop saying it."

YUP! It's easy for him to sit in his ivory tower and make this stupid assertion. I too am tired of hearing it.

RUSH is always touting how it's hard-working Americans rolling up their sleeves every day that make this country work and he's dead on, but then turns around and makes this smarmy comment how we are all so fat and happy and won't do certain jobs because they are beneath our dignity. It's all contradictory.
88 posted on 01/07/2004 7:02:11 AM PST by Prolifeconservative (If there is another terrorist attack, the womb is a very unsafe place to hide.)
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To: Lady Eileen
We hear this a lot-- Rush was spouting this crock yesterday.

Rush needs to provide evidence for this or stop saying it.

LOL! Yes NO American is willing to do masonry, nor roofing, nor framing, nor sheetrocking, nor any of those jobs that my unemployed friends are trying to do as startups - and with the added burden of obtaining a journeyman's certificate (a requirement which illegal mexican's, under Bush's ongoing amnesty (lookin' the other way) are waived.)

89 posted on 01/07/2004 7:02:19 AM PST by Jim Cane
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To: thiscouldbemoreconfusing
I'm going to get massive flames on this, but so what.

Here I go:

I plan on voting a straight R ticket for everything except the President.

I intend on either leaving it blank or writing somebody in.

I won't vote for a D, but I won't vote for a liberal either. I think he's a good man, but I also believe he's a weak man. You don't win friends by giving away your lunch everyday, or giving away somebody elses lunch for that matter.

If Dean wins, he'll face a very conservative House and Senate, and we'll have deadlock again. I'm not going to have a gun put to my head and told that either my vote or my brains are going to be on that ballot.

I sincerely wish we had a little deadlock now. Every year that goes by makes the framers of the Constitution that much smarter.

GWB is so far past the line at this point that for me seeing a D in the WH, and 60 R Senators and an R majority in the House would be acceptible. We may even have two parties again.

Go ahead and launch now.
90 posted on 01/07/2004 7:02:48 AM PST by RinaseaofDs (Only those who dare truly live - CGA 88 Class Motto)
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To: Lady Eileen
I don't think anyone would be too proud to do menial work if it paid decent wages! The Mexicans will work for little of nothing to just be here and get our services.
91 posted on 01/07/2004 7:03:41 AM PST by Marysecretary (,)
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To: Dane
Nice try - but maybe you havent looked at my previous posts for the last 4 years. I am probably much more conservative than you my friend. But I am fed up with this two faced president. He is no different than Clinton when he says whatever it takes to get elected and then once there does all he can to screw the American public. Anybody but Bush04
92 posted on 01/07/2004 7:04:03 AM PST by sasafras (sasafras (The road to hell is paved with good intentions))
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To: futureceo31
What are we going to do about the 8 million illegal immigrants.

How about not rewarding them for illegal actions.

93 posted on 01/07/2004 7:04:24 AM PST by af_vet_rr
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To: alloysteel
What you say is probably quite true, in many more instances than anyone here would find comfortable. It is troubling, also, that the persons who consider themselves to be conservative, are taken for granted by the Republican party, much as persons of minority status are taken for granted by the Democrat party.

We talk so much about Arabs hating this country but I feel that people that are sitting on their porch with their hand out had the country just as much. The bible says that someone who is lazy is the cousin to a great destroyer. I think I have that one right. I also agree with you about conservatives but I feel that it is also the Christians who are taken for granted in the Republican party and then forgotten. My new big issue is gay marriages. I suppose that the government will let this go just as it did abortion and I will feel as if I have no party. It may be time to start throwing my vote to some ultra conservative 3rd party to send a signal to the Republican party.

I like George W. Bush. I really do. But on several things, he is well deserving of criticism, and I do hope that the criticism is received on a constructive basis.

It tool a lot of nards in today's one world government to go against the UN and simply open a can of whoopass on a nation that needed a beat'n. I respect him for that. Now I am wondering what he is doing with 87 billion dollars of our money going over there. We are a generous and rich nation but thhis may not be the best thing to do with our generosity.

94 posted on 01/07/2004 7:04:56 AM PST by biblewonk (I must try to answer all bible questions.)
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To: shortstop
No, I won't vote for Howard Dean or Hitlery Clinton, but I am ready to sit this election out.

The single most valuable thing in this world is US Citizenship. The second most valuable thing in this world is legal US Residency. This Admoinistration is selling both for Votes.

So9

95 posted on 01/07/2004 7:06:26 AM PST by Servant of the 9 (Goldwater Republican)
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To: shortstop
This is America...get it right

Will we still be the Country of choice and still be America if we continue to make the changes forced on us by the people from other countries that came to live in America because it is the Country of Choice??????

Think about it . . .

All I have to say is, when will they do something about MY RIGHTS?  I celebrate Christmas, but because it isn't celebrated by everyone, we can no longer say Merry Christmas. Now it has to be Season's Greetings.  It's not Christmas vacation,
it's Winter Break.  Isn't it amazing how this winter break ALWAYS occurs over the Christmas holiday?  We've gone so far the other way, bent over backwards to not offend anyone, that I am now being offended.  But it seems that no one has a
problem with that.

 This says it all !

IMMIGRANTS, NOT AMERICANS, MUST ADAPT.

I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture.  Since the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Americans.  However, the dust from the attacks had
barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about  the possibility that our patriotism was offending others.

I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to America.  Our population is almost entirely made up of descendants of immigrants. However, there are a few things that those who have
recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand. This idea of America being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity.  As Americans, we have our own culture, our
own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.  This culture has been developed over centuries of struggles, trials, and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom.

We speak ENGLISH, not Spanish, Portuguese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language.  Therefore, if you wish to become part  of our society, learn the language !

"In God We Trust" is our national motto.  This is not some Christian, right wing, political slogan.  We adopted this motto because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented.  It is
certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools.  If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture !

If Stars and Stripes offend you, or you don't like Uncle Sam, then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.  We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things
where you came from.  This is OUR COUNTRY, our land, and our lifestyle.  Our First Amendment gives every citizen the right to express his opinion and we will allow you every opportunity to do so.  But once you are done complaining, whining,
and griping about our flag, our pledge, our national motto, or our way of life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great American freedom...
THE RIGHT TO LEAVE.

96 posted on 01/07/2004 7:06:28 AM PST by SheLion (Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
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To: RinaseaofDs
I believe that Im with you - however I will not vote for McCain or Kolbe - both of which continue to shove this crap down our throats - telling us that we have to like this or else. Well its time for them to go - if this is what the RNC is supporting then no more donations from me. We need more like Tancredo - a man who is willing to stand for what he believes - but we also need a public who is willing to sacrifice for the good.
97 posted on 01/07/2004 7:07:40 AM PST by sasafras (sasafras (The road to hell is paved with good intentions))
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To: Servant of the 9
No, I won't vote for Howard Dean or Hitlery Clinton, but I am ready to sit this election out.

But..........if we sit this election out, that will just open it up for the DemocRATS!

98 posted on 01/07/2004 7:08:12 AM PST by SheLion (Curiosity killed the cat BUT satisfaction brought her back!!!)
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To: shortstop
I don't support this plan, but I have to say that almost all of the voiced opposition I have seen to it here on FR has been misguided, I think.

His proposal is brilliant except for one flaw.

The brilliance? The part that says anyone wanting to take part in this must get their employer to show no Americans wanted the job.

That will cause the cost of those involved significantly higher. Companies will be forced to show that they tried to find Americans for the job. They will have to be prepared to defend lawsuits from out of work Americans and the ever rabid trial lawyers if they want to rely on these workers. This cost will make it so that the jobs which the people are coming across the border to get won't be there, which removes the incentive for crossing the border, particularly if the benefits only go to those who have jobs and are paying taxes.

Further, for those who do manage to get their employer to vouch that no American wanted the job, so that they can get into the program, we now know who they are and where they are, two things we don't now know, all in exchange for involvement in a program which could be legislated away at any time. Some would be skeptical that it ever would be, but in an economic downturn, ending a guest worker program so Americans could get the jobs would be very politically doable.

And of all the illegals who are out there now, there are some who are harmless and those who are not. Those who sign up for this would more often than not be in the harmless side; they are the ones who really would rather not be hiding and don't mind us knowing they are here. This would make the pool of those who are here completely illegally smaller, which would lessen the burden on our security agencies.

As specified, the proposal is worlds, worlds, worlds better than I had feared based on the initial reports and the initial debate here.

So it is brilliant in that it would put a damper on further illegal immigration, pressure companies to not hire illegals, would get many illegals to tell us who and where they are. I am pretty sure that as this debate rolls on, almost all of the leftist leaning immigration groups are going to come out hot and heavy against these proposals. That should tell us something.

But it has a fatal flaw which means that we really should be opposing it anyway- namely that the courts would very likely find some reason to strike down that one very provision, stating that it is an impossible standard to meet (you know liberal judges). And if that one aspect of the plan is removed, then the whole thing is garbage.

Relying on a single beam of support in a very large structure when there are sledgehammer weilding Judges all over the place is a very bad idea.

99 posted on 01/07/2004 7:10:56 AM PST by William McKinley
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To: shortstop
'Social Security Administration officials estimate that about 50,000 Mexicans would collect $78 million in the first year of a U.S.-Mexican agreement. They predict that by 2050, 300,000 Mexicans would collect $650 million in benefits a year.

But a recent General Accounting Office report said those numbers failed to account for the presence of many potentially eligible, undocumented Mexican immigrants and their families.

Census figures show that the United States is home to 9 million Mexican citizens. More than half, about 5 million, reportedly are in the United States illegally, according to federal estimates.

Barnhart assured lawmakers that undocumented immigrants do not get Social Security benefits.

"That's a myth," she said. "As is the case with our existing agreements, a totalization agreement with Mexico would not alter current law on this issue."

...That's true, but a provision in the Social Security Act allows undocumented immigrants to get Social Security benefits if the United States and another country have a totalization agreement. Those immigrants would have to prove they had paid into the U.S. system.

Former undocumented immigrants also could become eligible if they later become legal residents. A recent investigation ...[only showed TWO cases of that ever happening]

BUT:

'One indication of how large the problem is, experts say, is the ballooning size of the Social Security Administration's suspense fund, money collected from payroll taxes tied either to fake numbers or numbers not matching government records.

In 1990, the fund totaled $1.2 billion. By the end of a decade during which America's undocumented immigrant population doubled and the circulation of fake identity documents surged, that fund topped $6 billion. Since illegal immigrants have no right to SSA benefits, the government will pocket most of the money, experts say.'


So Social Security money is not a problem- we win either way.
Besides real enforcement, any immigration deal should include allowing Americans to own land in Mexico. With telecommuting there are a lot of Americans that would take their dough to Mexico and still keep their US jobs. Providing the middle class that Mexico needs.

100 posted on 01/07/2004 7:11:51 AM PST by mrsmith
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