Posted on 04/17/2016 6:27:48 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
Thank you for the ping
The Essenes and the Nazarites did wear their hair long, . . . and there is evidence that Jeshua bar Josef. called the Christ was both. Just because Saul, later called Paul, had a thing about applying arbitrary rules, which Jesus said he came to replace, does not mean that Jesus did.
When people seek perfection in others, I remind them that Jesus blew one out of twelve.
“Jesus said we have to have faith. Yet relics are tools used to prove His power?”
Yep. Just like Jesus used His own risen body as proof of His power. Relics were used to show God’s power even in the Old Testament. It makes sense since we are corporeal beings.
Use a camera obscura with a photoreactive compound. Multiple overlapping exposures explains why one image is larger that the other and why the head on the shroud is out of proportion to the body.
Does anyone here know if DNA comparisons can be made between the two samples?
Jesus was not a Nazarite because he drank wine. He was not an Essene — won’t find it.
Judas was hired to identify Jesus; there was nothing different in his appearance.
The Jews, when they prepared a body, wrapped it around with cloth, etc., and did that with Jesus, except his face, for lack of time. His body was covered up.
If you will notice, that shroud imprint has his hands on his knees, which meant the body was kind of in a seating position to accomplish that.
What Genes denotes a particular religion?
Some researchers claim that both the Shroud and Sudarium have AB negative blood type which is a minority blood type (only 1% of the world's population is AB negative), but it is almost 15% of the population of the population of the Semitic population of the area that comprised the Holy Land.
That theory depends on some unknown 14th century genius (at least 100 years before Leonardo) who invented a completely new technique with the sole purpose of duping a credulous medieval population. And then completely abandoning photography after taking one photo. It also ignores the huge number of details within the shroud that no forger could have known about, or would have needed to include, to fool the public - things like pollen from thorn bushes.
I want to know why this guy can tell us blood type but doesn’t tell us about the DNA.
It did not need to be invented. The principle of camera obscura was known and written about nearly 1000 years before DaVinci who also know about it.
In addition to resolving the issues of image size diffences between the front and back and the head/body it resolves the negative image issue.
I also explains why the physical anomaly of the hands being crossed over the groin appears on the shroud, which the human body can't do lying on it's back with it's shoulder blades touching the ground.
They aren't. The eyes are shut, and it has been shown in some computer enhancements that there are coins on the eyes. The coins have even been identified as a Pontius Pilate Lepton with a misspelling of "TIBEPIOY CAICOPOC" which would normally have appeared on a roman struck coin as "TIBEPIOY KAICOPOC" and the coin a denarius. . . on one of the coins and on the other a spiral coil. At the time the misspelled coin was identified, no such coin was known and it was claimed the misspelling was proof it was a fake.
However, several years later a couple of the Pontius Pilate Leptons with the misspelling were uncovered in a archaeological dig, and another was found in the British Museum collection proving the misspelled coin was authentic. There have now been six Pontius Pilate Leptons discovered in various digs and have been attributed to the 16th year of his Tiberius reign. . . which would have been about 30-31AD.
Another researcher claims it is a Pontius Pilate Lepton on both eyes, but the spelling is correct:
Never the less, the eyes are closed, and under computer enhancement of the image, it can be seen that there are coins there.
Yeah, it did. The camera obscure is a way of projecting the image. Great. Now fix that image on the linen cloth - that had to be invented... and then abandoned until 1840.
The head isn't out of proportion to the body. That is a claim of the skeptics that doesn't hold up to their claims. It is perfectly proportioned according to artists and scientists working in their fields of expertise. The skeptics are not working in their fields of expertise. They are measuring from a water stain, claiming it is the top of the head, not the actual top of the head to get their claimed size of the head. That's also how they get their strange body lengths and claim that the image hinges with no space between the fontal and dorsal images.
Try this. Lay down on the ground, like a body in repose with your shoulders flat against the floor. Now, keeping your shoulders against the floor, cross your palms over your groin.
It doesn’t explain why no one can replicate the Shroud..even in modern era with crazy technology that most back then
would have never dreamed possible
Catholic ping
There is no residue of a "photo reactive compound" which must be present for the image to be still visible. That is what any photograph is made of. . . the residue of the photo reactive compound. The Shroud has been studied with very sensitive instruments down to a Xray micro-spectrometer and there simply are no such compounds or chemicals present. That device was so sensitive it measured the chemicals residue of the special inert vinyl baggies the samples were carried inside so accurately they could tell what company made the baggies. That is how sensitive that test was. . . and they found NO CHEMICAL RESIDUE that was photo reactive to carry an image.
In addition, it is known for a fact that the image does not exist underneath the blood stains. That means the blood stains existed BEFORE the image was placed. Registration of the image after placing the blood would be extremely difficult if not impossible using the camera obscure technique you postulate.
In addition, all such chemical photo sensitive approaches that have been proposed would fade with exposure to sunlight over time. . . and it is known that the Shroud was exposed to sunlight frequently in the past, far more than would be necessary to fade any such image by those means to complete invisibility. Obviously that has not occurred.
Finally we do KNOW what the image is compose of, and the very thin starch coating on the top most fibers is not in any way photo reactive. This is all what the science has lead us to know. . . not skeptics' opinion and musing based on desperate grasping for an explanation based on nothing but speculation.
You’re assuming the body was perfectly flat. There is one theory that rigor had begun to set in the body, after having hung on the cross for hours.
The DNA on both are too old, too degraded, and too contaminated to do much of anything in that vein.
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