But what about LYING about your salary? You know darn well the HR goons are lying to you. If they wanna know your income - then throw them a number that benefits you.
Never lie on an application. Instead, respond by saying “I am prepared to discuss my salary expectation.”
I had one interview where the director of QA was interviewing me and asked me my salary. I told him and he closed his notebook and said, “This interview is over”. He told me he was making only 1k more than I was. LMAO!
I’ve always just given my desired salary. There have been plenty of instances where I never got a call back, but some have come back to say, “While we can’t match your current salary, we can offer...”
It’s just like he says, it’s an unfair bargaining tactic. Just don’t play the game or beat them at it.
As an employer I ask for this information for two reasons. First to know whether I can afford you, secondly to know what you might find enticing if I decide to hire you.
As the employer I am the buyer. Lie to me or refuse to answer and I’ll go the next candidate in a heartbeat.
This is the whole game, right here. Nothing else matters.
As has been the case with retailers, the Internet has reduced much of HR to strict price-shopping.
Searches and screens are conducted strictly on salary numbers by many.
HR departments have long been government-like bureaucratic puddles of inefficiency but their refusal to go beyond the numbers renders them even less useful.
HR folks are non-technical Himmlers who DESERVE to be lied to.
Their core mission is firing you in a way that prevents lawsuits.
If you HAVE a current salary, and you are looking, then the best thing to do (to save your time and theirs) is not to interview for jobs that do not meet some expected level higher than what you have.
For example, if you are getting 45/hr then you just tell recruiters you are looking for 55/hr
This may cut you out of the chance they were willing to go to 65/ hr, but that’s the trouble with negotiations... you never know what cards the other guy is holding.
So... Your best benefit is to tell them what you are looking for (I have done it that way for the last 20 years)
btw, how was the move for you? Is everything ok for you?
It’s part of a filter when searching for prosective employees. If your previous salary is above or below a specific range, your application is automatically discarded. Regardless of what a prosective employer tells you, they want to get you for as cheap as possible, within the accepted window of pay for that particular industry standard. The current job market is an employer’s market, and they can cherry pick employees for the best (lowest) wages for the work required. Any prosective employer who tells you otherwise, is lying through their teeth. The new business paradigm is to treat labor as a commodity, to be used and disposed of as required. If they don’t, then they will be crushed by their competition.
If I was looking for a job and decided to use one of these forms, I might fill in my current salary as an outrageous $999,999,999 for the same reason. It's not dishonest if there is no risk that they would believe me or think that I expected to be believed, and no intent to deceive or appearance of such intent. It does get around the software or secretary requirement that everything be filled in.
before companies extend an offer to you most do a background check and during that process they confirm you current or last employment information and VERIFY it. If you lie about your salary this is when it will reveal that to the employer.....they will consider your application to be fraudulent and you will be put on a list.
Most larger companies have front door HR policies that require online forms to be filled out. Finding the hiring managers and being friendly actually costs the candidate the job as the rule is that a candidate doing backdoor handshaking is banned and the manager can be terminated.
P4L
Early in my programming career, I fell for that one time. Thereafter I added $5,000 to what I was currently making. Three times the (standard) reply was "Well, that's about what we are offering and can't really top that. However, there is plenty of upward growth here (no), so you will soon be making more." After that, I got into contracting and soon made REAL money.
I live in a major metropolitain area, and make a better than average salary for my position (my company is generous, plus I work pretty hard for them and they know it).
We have property in a neighboring state with a much lower cost of living, and I’d be willing to take a significant pay cut (on the order of $20-30k, maybe even a bit more for the right job) to relocate.
When an employer doesn’t list a salary range, then they’re practically begging for people to apply who are not going to be happy with the compensation. Most job descriptions are so vague as to make guessing the compensation all but impossible.
When an employer requires my salary up front, and online, I suspect I’m immmediately rejected as being out of their range, even though I’d accept a lot less. But they’re the ones setting the rules to the game. I’m in the fortunate position to be highly valued by my current employer so, it’s their loss.
I really don’t understand the thought process of employers who expect the interested candidate to provide a salary expectation from a minimal job description. The employer knows all the details and is going to be setting the compensation (and the benefits, if any, which can have a huge effect on a salary negotiation) - the onus should be on them to define the salary, or deal with having to sift through a few extra hundred or thousand applications they otherwise could have avoided.
This isn’t new. This question was on paper applications 30-40 years ago.
A position will always have some sort of salary band, a range of x to y that the employer is targeting.
I’d be inquiring about that band, I’d say, because I want us both to be happy. Which is true, because I don’t want to leave money on the table, but I also don’t want to come in to a position where I’m really squeezing what the position pays, but I was hired because the interviewers loved me so much. That can be a source of problems, where the management above me always has a bit of a burr in their saddle because they think I’m too expensive. Perhaps that can be rectified by a promotion down the road, perhaps it may get me axed in the first budget cut, since they might keep two others that are “cheap” and just let me go.
That’s why “fit for the position” is so important, like some have said here, and why it’s best for both sides to get all those cards on the table first.
Just how much do I like this position ? How good of a fit is it ? If it’s a bad fit, I may not want it even though the pay would be great. Perhaps it’s right up my alley; then I’d perhaps take less than I hope for because it would be so easy, location what I like, etc.
How much do they like what I bring to the table for this position ?
Once we both know who wants who and how much they want them, then there’s a good framework for price discovery.
Having had employee and consulting jobs, I simply say a “variety of factors” influence rates, and every situation is unique (the market at the time, whether I was independent or not, and what type of work was being done (skillset in high or low demand)). Of course, I need to know going in what ballpark they’re in, so I can decide when I hear the details where I want to start my side of the negotiations from.
Etc., and so forth.
If I’m doing the hiring, I simply get an idea of where the person is at paywise, which has always been easy to do without pressuring in any way. If I had an applicant that really did not want to divulge that, all I can do is float out a lower salary range and leave open an option to increase it in the conversation IF I think the candidate is great. Of course, one assumes that some people will puff their salary history a little, some a lot. But at the end of the day, the answer is pretty obvious because of the interest they show in the salary you propose. Mostly today jobs are advertised with a salary or range, and the candidate showed up, so either it’s worth their consideration or they’re desperate. The employee always should remember the one doing the hiring has a choice between candidates, so it comes down to how much they want you versus what do you want, and the same for every other candidate. It’s not a yes/no question, it’s a multiple choice.
I may want them to be not too happy with their payscale, but begrudginly accept because I’ve come across well; this will make the job a “try and buy” for both of us. If I wind up liking them, I can always boost their pay. If not, that’s a hint to them, they will go away soon, and I’m getting them cheap if they stay longer than they’re wanted.
If they work out very well, I know they have to have a pay they are ok with and promotions or job changes according to what they like. (some people get uncomfortable from a huge jump in salary and don’t want a lot of unfamiliar responsibilities thrown at them; some love the same exact job year in and year out. others are very impatient to learn. Some just want to earn. etc.)
If the position is for a consultant, of course, the raise idea does not come into play. You’re really putting the candidates in order of who can get your project done, then making sure that you’re not lowballing them so much that the minute a higher-paying client comes along they just disappear - and your project is left hanging while you look for another consultant. You’re seeking reliable completion.
No, don’t “lie.” That’s grounds for dismissal after you land the job and you’ve left your old one.