Posted on 02/09/2011 3:42:15 PM PST by central_va
Davis was informed the next day.
“So you believe we’re living under a dictatorship?”
Your the one who believes the Federal Employees in black robes have the final word on “supreme law of the land” not I.
I hold no such foolish beleive, I support State nullification, interposition, as well as the inalienable right of secession.
But do answer my question, how is to that we “revolutionize ourselves” as apposes to simply break the bonds that previously blinded us together?(Secede)
Thank you for confirming that you do not respect the recognized rule of law. That makes the rest easier.
Conservatives live by the rule of law - even when they disagree with it (see: Row v. Wade). We don't ignore laws we find inconvenient. Rather, we work to change and amend them.
But do answer my question, how is to that we “revolutionize ourselves” as apposes(sic) to simply break the bonds that previously blinded(sic) us together?(Secede)
I can't figure out what you're asking here.
“Conservatives live by the rule of law - even when they disagree with it (see: Row v. Wade). We don’t ignore laws we find inconvenient. Rather, we work to change and amend them.”
If that be what an American Conservative is one who bows before lawless and clearly arbitrary oppression, then I want nothing to do with it.
It’s been 38 years sense Roe V. Wade and still the only way to overturn that evil arbitrary is to either get Conservatives to break the same rules of presidence that liberals broke in creating it, or to convince all but 11 States and less then 1/3rd of each house of congress to overturn this evil.
Simply put assuming the same lawless Federal court doesn’t decide to ignore whatever amendment we pass, your talking about Absolute(Non-constitutional) tyranny of the minority.(never mind the majority).
“”But do answer my question, how is to that we “revolutionize ourselves” as apposes(sic) to simply break the bonds that previously blinded(sic) us together?(Secede)”
I can’t figure out what you’re asking here.”
What do we have to do to secede from this union as the 13 colonies seceded from their union with the British Empire?
Is that simply enough for you?
If you say there is a different between a Revolution and Secession then explain that difference! More the point tell us southerns what we must do to convene you that we have carried out “a revolution” as to entitled us to peacefully leave our union with you Yankees?
The colonies didn't secede from Great Britain - they rebelled against British rule.
If a state wishes to leave the union they should approach it the samy way they got in - by a vote of all the states.
“”What do we have to do to secede from this union as the 13 colonies seceded from their union with the British Empire?”
The colonies didn’t secede from Great Britain - they rebelled against British rule.”
Ok... Then how did they become independent if they never seceded from the British Empire?
Or are you contending that they were always independent LoL.
“If a state wishes to leave the union they should approach it the same way they got in - by a vote of all the states.”
You mean we have to get the permission of the same oppressive majority that has usurped our rights in the first place just to reassert the same rights??
Are you nuts, or simply fatalistic?
Tell me where in the Federal Constitution is the clause requiring us to get permission?
There is not even a structure in the federal Constitution for the rest of the States to give their permission. Does not that mean that the right of withdraw is reserved to States and their people respectively?
PS: The way we entered the union is by individual convention of the of all 13 states one by one.
Such as was called for in article 7 of the Federal Constitution:
“The Ratification of the Conventions of nine States, shall be sufficient for the Establishment of this Constitution between the States so ratifying the Same.”
From: http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_transcript.html
This is insolently this is also exactly the same way each of the 11 southern states left the union by convention forming the confederacy.
So clearly your terms for our exit was not honored by the tyrant Lincoln.
I already told you - they rebelled.
You mean we have to get the permission of the same oppressive majority that has usurped our rights in the first place just to reassert the same rights??
Yes.
“”Ok... Then how did they become independent if they never seceded from the British Empire?”
I already told you - they rebelled.”
Well many states today are rebelling against Federal clams of authority why are they not now independent nations of the world?
“”You mean we have to get the permission of the same oppressive majority that has usurped our rights in the first place just to reassert the same rights??”
Yes.”
Why? That is not the same way they entered the union...
Article 7 describes how they entered the union by convention of individual States:
“The Ratification of the Conventions of nine States, shall be sufficient for the Establishment of this Constitution between the States so ratifying the Same.”
Insolently the exact same method by which the 11 southern States in 1860-1861 left the union.
Where is this elaborate and abusive bar to exit authorizes in the Federal Constitution?
http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/constitution_transcript.html
Don’t blame me. I didn’t vote for him.
None
...why are they not now independent nations of the world?
Because.
Insolently(sic) the exact same method by which the 11 southern States in 1860-1861 left the union.
I would agree that they left in an insolent manner, but not in a legal one.
By winning a war of independence, rather than by simply saying it's so and getting all huffy when the Brits didn't accept it.
“I would agree that they left in an insolent manner, but not in a legal one.”
Then how does one leave in a “legal” manner if it is not by the same method they entered?
Also where was this method of exit ceded in the Federal Constitution?
“”Then how did they become independent if they never seceded from the British Empire?”
By winning a war of independence, rather than by simply saying it’s so and getting all huffy when the Brits didn’t accept it.”
So all we need to do is win a war to reassert that our independents and sovereignty comes not from Washington D.C. but from our people...
You will forgive me when I say I find that a bit ridicules. Why would we have fought a war to assert our natural rights only to plunge ourselves right back into a situation in which we must do the same all over again.
By a vote of the states - all the states. And it wasn't ceded because it wasn't defined.
“”Then how does one leave in a “legal” manner if it is not by the same method they entered?”
By a vote of the states - all the states. And it wasn’t ceded because it wasn’t defined.”
If it wasn’t defined then how is it that you know yu need a vote of all the States?
How do you even know what kind of vote, does 1/3rd of the States have to approve? 50%+1, 2/3rds, 3/4ths? Perhaps just 9 States?
Where is it written that we must be chained to each-other until such time that any arbitrary(undefined) number of us approve of letting us go free?
You may find that ridicules(sic) but most of the rest of us do not. We forged our nation on a compact called the US Constitution. It laid out the basic rules of how we would conduct ourselves as a Republic. It was designed to be perpetual.
The confeds had no good reason for what they attempted. The strength of that charge is that, had they truly believed the legality of their cause they would have sued for secession. They would have put their case to the test of law. They could have still turned to rebellion as a last resort. Instead they turned to rebellion as a first resort.
What they did was divisive and illegal and history and the law has proven that out.
And I find your grammar and spelling ridiculous, but never mind. To answer your question, though, (it was a question, even though not punctuated as one, right?), the answer is that it was because they wanted to. They felt that the government no longer served them and resorted to their natural right of revolution. And in the time since the US had militarily won its independence from Britain, much of the civilized western world had undergone political revolutions, from France to Haiti to the Bolivarian revolutions, Mexico, Italy, Greece, all the 1848 stuff. Iit was an age of revolutions, of rebellions, of the birth of modern nationalism. It was in the wind.
Hell, Thomas Jefferson thought 20 years was too long.
I noticed that TJ didn’t think much about that when he was the prez...
Yeah, Jefferson is definitely a guy whose opinions on some subjects changed when he was no longer outside the tent pissing in.
“You may find that ridicules(sic) but most of the rest of us do not. We forged our nation on a compact called the US Constitution. It laid out the basic rules of how we would conduct ourselves as a Republic. It was designed to be perpetual.”
I know more then a few folk that also find it ridicules, particularity sense the same compact explicitly reserves all rights not ceded in it to the individual members, and the compact does not mention exit.
Nor does this compact even mention the word perpetual unlike the previous compact.
Your reasons for forcing this abusive union upon people is entirely reprehensible.
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