Posted on 11/07/2008 10:40:35 AM PST by Traviswf
Hi there. I voted for Obama, but have been reading a lot of Freerepublic lately to see how the other side is reacting. I'm not trying to troll here - honestly - but if you feel I am, that's understandable. I just wanted to offer a perspective on this that I think may be interesting to some of you. Oh, and this is much longer than I intended. And I'm fairly certain I'm not posting this the right way...for which I apologize.
When Bush was elected in 2000, I was upset. And yes, I whined about him "stealing" the election. I don't really think that's true anymore - it was just a painful way to lose. Sure, we can whine about the popular vote vs. the electoral vote, but you can't change the rules in the middle of the game. Then I watched the movie Recount and realized just how awful the democrats were at trying to win the damn thing. Gore seemed like he didn't really want it.
When Bush won in 2004, I was absolutely devastated. I thought the world was going to end. I didn't think we should be in Iraq, I agreed with Kerry that we had to finish the fight in Afganistan. I was worried about the courts. And frankly - I just didn't like Bush. I didn't like the way he governed, the way he spoke, and the way he talked as if we on the left were less American.
On 9/11 I happened to be in Toronto on business. When the towers fell, I knew I had to get home. A colleague and I wanted to go to New York, to help in some way. But we were told nobody was getting anywhere close. Our next instinct was to get home - to California. We didn't just want to be with our families, we desperately wanted to be in our country. That day was rough because my colleague thought his wife might have been on one of the planes - her travel plans were very similar. It took hours of agony before we, thank God, found out she was safe.
So we rented a car in Toronto and drove across the country. It took a couple hours to get across the border in the middle of the night. We stopped in Omaha, and then Colorado. I can't even tell you how much I loved my country driving across its beauty in those days after the attacks. And there were no jokes about "we're in enemy territory" because we were in "red states." We were in America. Everywhere we went people said "How are you? Is everyone safe?"
I know everyone has similar stories of those days. And certainly many, many people have stories of real loss - not just "we thought we lost someone, but it was a happy ending." Then, fairly quickly, I felt my patriotism coming under attack because I had a difference of opinion about how to fight back. I didn't think Iraq was the right choice - it made no sense to me, and I certainly wasn't alone. But people questioned my love of my country. And that was very, very hard to forgive.
When 2008 came up, more than anything, I wanted to win the White House back. I wanted to punish the Bush administration for what I felt was not just a failure to be competent, but a failure to keep the country united. I inititally supported Hilary, but I had this feeling in my gut that she was just going to be Bush - but for our side. She'd be a partisan warrior, a polarizing figure (which Bush wasn't when he started, but Hilary already was...). It made me sick to my stomach.
I wanted to go back to feeling like an American in those days after the attack - where our disagreements were things we laughed about over a beer and the real threat was far, far more serious.
I'd written Obama's candidacy off as a dry run for 2016 or later. Or maybe he was running for VP. I thought - hey, dude, at least finish a term in the Senate. Then when he said "we're not a collection of red states and blue states, we're the United States of America" it hit me like lightning. It had nothing to do with him - it had to do with the country, and my love for it and this feeling deep down in my gut that we were fighting over the placement of the deck chairs while the ship was sinking.
Wow, this got really rambly. Sorry about that. Here's why I posted initially. I saw this thing on here about Obama's "national defense force" and some posters commenting about the coming civil war or some such. I'm pretty sure Obama was just talking about funding for police. I mean - are you guys really worried he's going to do this? There was a rumor on the left that Bush was bringing a military brigade trained in "riot control" home from Iraq before the elections. People were convinced Bush was going to take over the country in a military coup. I'm sure you think that's laughable - as do I. Obama is not going to raise a civilian force of brown coats. First of all there's no money for it, nobody would go for it, and he'd be laughed out of the White House.
He's also not a socialist. And he's not coming for your guns. If he did either of this things, he can basically just go home now. Those are not realistic positions for any president to have. He will likely appoint liberals - at least too liberal for you guys - to the courts.
But here's the thing. He's going to try and be a good president. I think they all do. And Obama ran on uniting the country, on being bipartisan. That's sort of ALL he ran on. It's how he won 60% of independent and brought home so many of the Clinton voters. So if he doesn't deliver on this - I imagine he'll be fairly easy to beat in 2012.
So that's my two cents. Obama was always going to get my vote as the nominee because I'm a lifelong democrat and a liberal. But I'm not a socialist or a pacifist. I believe in the 2nd amendment and favor the idea of most issues being decided by the states. I'm not a religious man, but I respect those who are and I think the Dems over reach in pushing religion out of the public square. I believe global warming is a serious problem, but I also think Al Gore enjoys it WAY too much.
And here's another caveat. I know it's easier to be bipartisan and talk about "togetherness" when my guy won. I was where you guys are now in 2000 and 2004. I mean, my party ALMOST ran Howard Dean and then said "No wait! John Kerry is a much better idea!" Or in this election to have a friend say "You've GOT to read Alec Baldwin's latest piece on HuffPo." I mean...really? He doesn't count as an "Obamacon" you know, he only plays a republican on TV...(you guys ever notice that our most annoying Hollywood liberals end up playing republicans? what's with that?)
So yeah - we've all spent some time in the woods. I just hope we can all agree that we're just as American as the other, and we're passionate about what we believe to be the right path to take. There are real problems with the economy, and Islamic Terrorists aren't going to take a vacation for four years.
That's about it I guess. Sorry you guys lost.
“Drive-by troll.”
You never know. I was dismissed as such as well. Let’s see what he does.
Chances are you’re right and he’ll scurry off to go brag to his leftist buddies. But every now and then, you find an honest liberal who senses there’s *something* better out there.
Yes, I believe it was the “Olive Branch” thread, which got pulled.
*
4) Create doubt. Question his judgment. Support his opponents. Ridicule his errors. Mitigate his successes with suggestion of unintended consequences. Refuse to praise his work. Challenge his advocates when they advocate; don't let them own the conversation. Contrast failures of the future with GOP successes of the past. Speak to personal liberty; it's fertile ground.
Amen.
....STOP BACK IN A YEAR AND WE CAN GO POINT BY POINT
Your post is all this guy needs to read
Mandatory community service while in middle school, high school and college? Socicalism.
"Spread the wealth around"? Socialism.
and, with all due respect, he is coming for our guns:
Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama and Biden also favor commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. They support closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. They also support making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets.
http://www.change.gov/agenda/urbanpolicy/
ping to post 111
While Obama really worries me, Nancy Pelosi really scares the hell out of me. She is going to turn your guy into her house boy and cram thru as many socialist programs as she and her San Francisco friends can dream up. They got that huge bailout and now they are hungry for more. There are 2 years to further lower her 9% approval rating pushing her agenda. She will destroy the Democrat party (I hope). By then Republicans will have a group of real conservatives to oppose her House members, and with any luck she’ll drag the Senate down with her.
It should have happened this time, but the MSM hung the sub prime mess and resulting economic collapse on Republicans. The MSM think they are king makers because they gave Democrats and Republicans their candidates and then manipulated the outcome of the general election. This was done thru manipulating the weighting of polls and by holding back legitimate news stories. Think I’m wrong?? They sat on the Edwards bimbo story to take votes away from Hillary. They suppressed Wright, Ayres, Fannie & Freddie, and bankrupting the coal industry stories so that nothing would hurt Obama until the early voters had gone to the polls.
Thank you for making that distinction. I can agree with it.
But, my dear, you forget one crucial thing: We have the guns and a heavy population of military trained patriots who promised to defend the Constitution from all enemies, both foreign and domestic. We do not take that oath lightly. Pardon us if we do not share your enthusiasm for the Socialist take-over of our government by someone who thought there were 57 states and whose best friends are terrorists.
One question, Travis: How far would you be willing to stick to that principle? Would you vote for Odinga if he was your Democratic candidate ? What about Stalin? Marx? Hitler? Putin? This is what I fear most about your statement. As a conservative, I cannot say that. While you say you are not socialist, you vote for the party that has become just that, if not worse. You folks have really done it this time. And when it becomes painfully aware to you of the damage you have caused this nation, don't run to us for help, because we're gonna shove you to the front line so that your first to go, while we fight to save ourselves.
Travis...
Welcome to FR. Unlike a lot of Democrats these days..who lately have become worse than the folks who come to your door to convert you to X religion (I am not a fan of anybody who does this...I am a Jew and happy with it), your statement is thoughtful and honest. I too feel perhaps things need to back off a bit.
Here’s the but. Liberals need to acknowledge that there should have been a burial of the hatchet in 2001. There wasn’t. It’s polarized this nation and to be honest, with regards to Iraq...whatever your feeling about the whys and wherefores about going in...and we could fill books about the reasons...we’re there, and to be honest, it has done one thing in retrospect..it’s attracted a lot of Al-Queda folks to come get killed in an environment controlled by us. Wars are not won by being on the defensive. You go on the offensive and you seek out the enemy to kill him. We did that in both Afghanistan and Iraq. There are other reasons that Afghanistan’s got problems right now...among then are:
1- A lot of foreign troop contingents have rediculously restricive ROEs put on them by their governments who are seeking to prevent casualties from affecting their domestic political situation (the Germans were especially known for this). Thus, these nations may send troops, but they end up not doing very much at all.
2- The history of the area. Nobody’s pacified Afghanistan and Waziristan since Alexander the Great...and the methods he used would get us crucified on CNN.
3- The terrain. Simply put, Afghanistan is light infantry country. It’s not the place for M1s or even Strykers. We need more 11Bs and Marines in total. But with the current economic crisis...I doubt we’ll get them.
There’s one other factor on why I think we went into Iraq...and it’s not something I think anyone really wants to say. After 9/11, the Arab world didn’t think much of us. They thought us quite weak. And when we started to bomb Afghanistan, they reacted like somebody retaliating against us by nuking West Virginia...so, I think some folks decided..fine..the Arab world wants to underestimate us..fine..we have unfinished buisness with Saddam. So, we did..and we made sure the rest of the world saw it...for all the public poo-pooing..I am sure privately it scared the hell out of the folks we wanted scared. Not to mention Saddam was violating the cease-fire...he was firing on aircraft patrolling the no-fly zone. So, you can make the argument we were simply resuming hostilities that had been suspended in 1991. Frankly..I think that’s the argument that should have been made.
I would never question your love for your country because of reluctance over going to war, particularly with a country that didn't directly attack us.
I would, however, question your love for your country due to voting for a socialist enemy of our Constitution.
LOL...That was a standard briefing from me, my unit officers and NCO’s to our troops.........it is shared all over the DOD as well and has been for a long time. Not sure who made the original quote but it works in all walks of life !
Stay safe and Keep the Faith !
Read this off of Lbama's® President Elect Web Page ...
Pay careful attention to the word require
Get back to us when you officially wake up from your stupor.
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