Posted on 05/30/2011 7:40:28 AM PDT by Ordinary_American
The United States is in a Constitutional and political crisis without precedent.
What can ordinary Americans do when a large number of politicians are corrupt and an even larger portion of the national political leadership is complicit in a cover-up of that corruption?
Do we petition those leaders to investigate and punish themselves?
(snip)
The evident bewilderment displayed by Will is prima facie evidence of the depth of denial now prevalent in Washington, D.C.
It is an equivalent to writing an article after the Pearl Harbor attack entitled “The Japanese might not like us.”
(snip)
Having been born in Panama and not eligible to run for the Presidency, McCain obviously doesn’t recognize the Constitution either.
For me, the uncertainty about McCain’s ineligibility was resolved by the bogus, non-binding Senate Resolution 511, co-sponsored by Obama, which declared McCain a “natural born citizen” and, therefore, eligible for the Presidency.
The fact that Congress has no authority to do such a thing was apparently completely irrelevant to that majestic body. Maybe I’m a cynic, but it sounds to me like just another crooked, backroom deal.
If McCain and Obama both didn’t need the “cover”, why go through that elaborate Senate charade?
(Excerpt) Read more at canadafreepress.com ...
I don’t know if the heat is getting to me, but none of your last post made any sense.
Nope. Once again you’re wrong.
I know you, 100% in the tank for Obama, can’t admit that you’re wrong.
But you haven’t the right to spread disinformation.
....Native and natural born are interchangeable....
Says who?
I'm just saying that if Obama were to be removed from office, or had been prohibited from assuming office once elected, a huge amount of violence would have spread across the country. The significant loss of life and property would be hard to justify for such a seemingly moot point. We are between a rock and a hard place.
The state legislatures need to pass laws that prevent ineligible people from appearing on their ballots, and invalidate votes for any write in candidate not willing or able to proof eligibility. Unquestionable proof of eligibility must be presented to any requesting citizen before certification of the vote. Or better yet, before appearance on the ballot.
The sad and stupid mishmash we have now is begging of a civil war or massive street violence.
Actually if the usurper is not removed from office the violence and death will be immensely worse. To allow a criminal thug usurper to squat illegally in the White House because of cowards who are afraid of a few riots which might or might not happen is the most disgusting cowardly sentiment I've ever heard. It's merely an excuse for the two party criminal class in DC to do nothing so as not to upset their gravy train and cushy lifestyle.
Constitutional eligibility is a freaking "moot point"? And you accuse Zero of disrespecting the Constitution??? You want the states to demand proof of eligibility? We already have proof the thug is NOT eligible. For the last three years. We are in the middle of a coup and you're worried about a few thugs burning down their neighborhoods or something.
Actually if the usurper is not removed from office the violence and death will be immensely worse. To allow a criminal thug usurper to squat illegally in the White House because of cowards who are afraid of a few riots which might or might not happen is the most disgusting cowardly sentiment I've ever heard. It's merely an excuse for the two party criminal class in DC to do nothing so as not to upset their gravy train and cushy lifestyle.
Constitutional eligibility is a freaking "moot point"? And you accuse Zero of disrespecting the Constitution??? You want the states to demand proof of eligibility? We already have proof the thug is NOT eligible. For the last three years. We are in the middle of a coup and you're worried about a few thugs burning down their neighborhoods or something.
Absolutely - when the author of this piece claimed McCain was not a citizen - born of a U.S. military father and a U.s citizen mother - they lost credibility and hurt the rest of their claim, no matter how valid.
McCain was born of two US citizens while serving on a military base in Panama. there is no way on earth I would EVER classify someone born that way as NOT being a "natural born citizen". It would be a supreme dishonor to the children of every military veteran.
Obama on the other hand has a british father and an underage mother and born in Kenya. that is why he keeps hiding his REAL birth records
Never mind, that’s not the way I mean it.
This whole discussion is like pissing into the wind anyway.
There is no rule of law in this country, and the Constitution is not the law of the land.
We should argue how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, it’s just as relevant to the real world. Or how to get a camel through the eye of a needle. Because that’s the kind of magic it’s going to take to pull this country out of the crapper.
Its not moot.Its article II of our Constitution. And I can assure you as a historian, that the future damage and disaster of defeating this national socialist movement through civil virtue will impose a far greater cost on our people in terms of death and destruction, than in the present case proposal too enforce the constitution. The horrible suffering in that future would pale the so called death and destruction perpetrated on our nation by those who would seek to protest Obama's removal in this way , protesting by the use of violence. Indeed it would prove us right in our resolve. It was also true when we as a nation rejected the methods of the Black Panthers and those of the Symbionese Liberation front, the precurser cousins to those who now dress in sheeps clothing of a so called kinder and gentler left, and occupy the White House to the detriment of our whole nation and its economy and peace. http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/05/barack_obama_the_quintessentia_1.html
“It would be a supreme dishonor to the children of every military veteran.” With bullshit hyperbole like that your agenda slip is showing. ‘Every’? ... do you folks ever stop to think before posting your pea brain notions?
7 FAM 1131.6-2 Eligibility for Presidency (TL:CON-68; 04-01-1998)
a. It has never been determined definitively by a court whether a person who acquired U.S. citizenship by birth abroad to U.S. citizens is a natural-born citizen within the meaning of Article II of the Constitution and, therefore, eligible for the Presidency.
b. Section 1, Article II, of the Constitution states, in relevant part that ―No Person except a natural born Citizen...shall be eligible for the Office of President.‖
c. The Constitution does not define "natural born". The "Act to establish an Uniform Rule of Naturalization", enacted March 26, 1790, (1 Stat. 103,104) provided that, ―...the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born ... out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided that the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States.
d. This statute is no longer operative, however, and its formula is not included in modern nationality statutes. In any event, the fact that someone is a natural born citizen pursuant to a statute does not necessarily imply that he or she is such a citizen for Constitutional purposes.
>>...If we disqualify citizens from serving as president because their parents were serving in foreign billets while in the service of the country, then something is wrong...<<
While I agree your sentiment is reasonable, the de Vattel definition of “Natural Born Citizen” is clear and succinct. Unfortunately, there does not appear to be any wiggle room, presuming we aren’t going through tortured arguments over “what de Vattel really meant was...”
Perhaps the term, “Natural Born Citizen” will be redefined (or definition ultimately confirmed) by the SCOTUS should Obama’s eligibility *ever* receive the proper review it deserves. Perhaps it will then directly address foreign-born children of deployed service members.
Feelings don't enter into it; the question is intent. "Natural born citizen" is not defined in the Constitution, but it's pretty clear the "intent" was to prevent people with divided allegiances from becoming President. McCain didn't have the slightest shred of allegiance to Panama. None. Zip. Nada.
The closest you can come to a contemporary understanding of who was considered a natural born citizen would be the United States Naturalization Law of March 26, 1790 which stated quite specifically that "the children of citizens of the United States that may be born beyond Sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born Citizens" McCain's parents were undoubtedly U.S. citizens (and so were his grandparents).
18th century law commentaries were pretty clear about "natural born" when they stated "The children of ambassadors in a foreign Country, are natural born Subjects, and not Aliens." McCain's father was not working out of an embassy, but he was most certainly in Panama at his government's behest.
Your position seems to be that the thousands and thousands of children born overseas to U.S. citizens serving their country aren't natural born because they weren't born on U.S. soil, but by that same "logic" every anchor-baby born to an illegal alien must be. If that's the case, then the Law truly is an ass.
Ping!
>>...Vattel had nothing to do with US law on citizenship...<<
True, but either way, de Vattel’s definition (swiss, french or otherwise) was wholly consistent with the commonly accepted definition of the term, “natural-born-citizen” at the time of the Constitution’s writing, was it not? That deVattel’s writing were considered a reference work provides us with a codifed definition. And to be sure, I have yet to hear of any other inconsistent definition from the period. Have you?
I agree that Obama’s policies are treasonous, and opposition leaders should bring that out and convince the majority of Americans such is so.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The history of the current President of the United States of America, Barack Obama, is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these United States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.
1. He has violated his oath to defend the US Constitution by exercising powers forbidden by the Constitution.
2. He has used public money to purchase private companies.
3. He has illegally tried to use public money to create publicly owned companies.
4. He has embezzled public money allocated by Congress for rescuing distressed private financial institutions, and used it to purchase automobile manufacturing companies.
5. He has given our public money to finance foreign automobile companies.
6. He has given our public money to a foreign state to finance their state-run oil company while refusing to allow us to develop our own oil resources.
7. He has violated the principle of balance of powers by usurping Congress’ role of law maker.
8. He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.
9. He has ignored the laws protecting us from the insolvency of financial institutions.
10. He has demanded and implemented Tax-and-Spend laws that inevitably lead to economic collapse.
11. He has obstructed the Administration of Justice by appointing a judge to the Supreme Court based not on ability to interpret the Constitution, but on radical ideology and color of skin.
12. He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Czars to harass our people and eat out their substance.
13. He has violated the balance of powers by appointing Czars with far reaching powers who are accountable to no one but himself.
14. He has as a matter of patronage stolen private industries from shareholders and given them to workers’ unions.
15. He has substantially benefitted his political financial supporters by giving public money to foreign industries.
16. He has arranged very large unscrupulous deals with private companies to exchange public money for his political advertising.
17. He has attempted to create a public industry, a health insurance company, that would compete with existing and similar private industries in open defiance of the consent of the people, and the letter and intent of the Constitution.
18. He has attempted to annul free of speech by setting up an illegal reporting system for recording the names of dissenters and by publicly attacking private citizens who oppose him.
19. He has counted illegal aliens as citizens to skew his standing with Congress.
20. He has illegally fired Inspectors General who found wrong-doing with his political crones.
21. He has attempted to insert himself into even the most personal life experience, our end of life care.
22. He has attempted to refuse to pay for medical treatment for wounded soldiers.
23. He has refused his assent to Laws of Congress, exercising false powers of veto that are contrary and insubordinate to the Constitution.
24. He has contradicted and violated the rule of law regarding bankruptcy after forcing the failure of one of our largest automakers.
25. He has appointed a Secretary of State who is ineligible for office.
26. He has attempted to force all citizens into mandatory servitude to the government.
27. He has wasted our precious time and resources on his pet projects, while neglecting to attend to critical issues of the general welfare.
28. He has violated the First Amendment by trying to stifle free speech by using the NEA to support political partisanship.
29. He has refused reasonable demonstrations of fidelity to the United States.
30. He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our lands, the merciless Islamo-fascist terrorists whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.
31. He has misapplied America’s military for his own political puposes.
32. He has aided and abetted America’s enemies.
33. He has accepted a bribe from a foreign government for fulfilling their political purposes.
34. He has created a federal bank in direct violation of the Constitution.
35. He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their Public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.
36. He has combined with Communist, Socialists and Fascists to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our American character, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation.
37. He has, in collusion with an insolent and irresponsible Congress, imposed Taxes against our consent not only on us, but also on our beloved children and our grandchildren denying them any representation.
38. He has nullified parts of our Constitution, abolishing our most valuable Laws and altering fundamentally our Form of Government.
In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms. Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated insults and injuries. A President whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant is unfit to be the Chief Executive of a free people.
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>>...no one in any position of power cares...<<
Therein lies the rub. Regardless of the evidence against Obama’s eligibility, it will ultimately be a fruitless pursuit. There exists not a single local, state or federal prosecutor/justice/representative who (apparently) can do and/or cares to do anything about it.
Frantzie was an obnoxious one-trick pony that could never come off that one thing. I don't miss it.
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