The Garden Thread - June, 2025

June 1, 2025 | Diana in WI/Greeneyes in Memoriam

[Diana in Wisconsin]

The MONTHLY Gardening Thread is a gathering of folks that love soil, seeds and plants of all kinds. From complete newbies that are looking to start that first potted plant, to gardeners with some acreage, to Master Gardener level and beyond, we would love to hear from you.

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[Diana in Wisconsin]

That’s just the Stock Photo from Jung’s but they are that nice.

Picked enough today to make the first Cherry Pie of the season. Will post pictures of that later. 4 cups pitted for a 9” pie crust and I didn’t find a worm or a problem with any of them. We don’t spray them, either. The birds don’t like them as much because they are a tart cherry, but I saw a little evidence of ‘sampling’ on their part.

And, of course, they don’t all ripen at once, so picking will be a week-long project for me. Takes me about an hour to pick enough for a pie. I do the low branches and Beau does the high branches.

He’s off mowing a pasture to rid it of thistles and he said for SURE he’s coming back home for PIE if there was any doubt about his return. ;)

[Diana in Wisconsin]

He uses Rock Auto too, and has been very happy with them so far. :)

Glad you can have some A/C again in your truck. Such Luxury! ;)

[FamiliarFace]

For Sure!! ;)

[Pollard]

Drip temp test.

Two inches down at a drip, 98 degrees. Two inches down, a foot away, still 98 degrees so that little drip has no effect. Stuck a plastic jar lid under the same drip, still 98 degrees.

Water in the tank is 80 so obviously and unsurprisingly, dark colored drip line in the sun heats up the water in it. My little 10 minute sessions aren't enough to bring tank temperature water to the drippers.

In the shade of a tomato plant - 2 inches down, 86 degrees.

Tallest grassy area in an aisle, 86 degrees.

Under a pile of weeds sitting in the shade, 81 degrees. I have no pile of weeds sitting in the sun right now so I couldn't check that.

Full sun exposed soil 5 inches down, 80 degrees.

Two of three temp/germination charts I have don't even bother to give germination rates at 95 or more for cukes and beans. Could still be old seeds. Mulch and reseed will tell.

Mulch the whole thing and I'd be down in the low to mid 80s instead of 98. I think it's shady there now and I have a dozen square bales of hay taking up space in the tunnel. ttyl

[Pollard]

My whole life, I’ve had AC in a vehicle for an accumulative 2-3 years and I lived in FL for 25 years so it sort of is a luxury for me.

[gitmo]

When I was growing up in GITMO, there was no air conditioning in cars or houses. And certainly not in school.

[Diana in Wisconsin]

It has never occurred to me to worry about the temp of the water I’m giving to my plants. Of course, I’m living on, ‘The Frozen Tundra’ so LIQUID WATER is a LUXURY (Like A/C!) for us all, but does that make a difference, I wonder?

This sounds like something for Paul to figure out. ;)

[Diana in Wisconsin]

I grew up in inner-city Milwaukee. I don’t remember having A/C at school or at home.

Just fans the size of airplane engines! At least ONE KID each year got sucked into one. ;) (Kidding!)

[FamiliarFace]

I didn’t grow up in GITMO, but I did grow up in Florida. No AC in cars or homes, until one day we finally became rich (LOL!!), and dad could have it in his and mom’s bedroom!! We were rich!! 🤣

[Qiviut]

At the old garden, I had 2 big trash cans that I kept filled with water. The cans got sun in the afternoon & the water warmed up. When I planted zinnias, I used a watering can with a sprinkler head & watered the rows with that warm water. The seeds came up within days.

Here, I have a small electric on-demand water heater in the shop bathroom so I used warm water on the zinnia seeds I planted. Again, they came up quickly. They’re still pretty small so I’m using tepid water rather than shocking them with cold.

Whatever was eating my basil quit once it started gaining some height. The produce section basil, in the shop bathroom window, has grown to at least 2 feet! I cut them all back and took the cuttings & put them between the baby zinnia rows. The basil smell is heavenly & I am hoping the deer will smell it & think ‘nah, not something I want to eat!’ I always protected the zinnias at the old garden until they were 6-8 inches & then never had a problem with deer eating them. They might eat tender young zinnia plants and we chased a herd of 4 or 5 out of the yard last night so that made me nervous.

[Qiviut]

BTW, it got to at least 101° today & that’s actual temp, not heat index. The index was forecast to be 105 to 110, but we may have surpassed that since the actual temp was higher than forecast.

The ‘city folk’ (rich ones) before AC used to migrate to the mountains during the summer for cooler air & less humidity. Now, with AC available to most people, that migration doesn’t really happen any more. With weather like we’re having, a cooler mountain clime is nonexistent.

[Pollard]

I never gave it much thought until I met my neighbor buddy and he had prior cow mineral buckets in his garden and filled them with water. He would scoop from them to water his plants individually. Didn't want that cold well water for his maters.

He's also not into weeding and didn't see why he'd want to water his weeds using a sprinkler.

I'm not really sure which one was the priority though. I had heard about black drip getting hot but never heard any details about the effects.

Kinda makes sense when looking at my soil temps today with 98 degrees 2 inches down -- 80 at 5 inches. My current tank temp of 80 ain't nothing compared to well or tap water that's 55-65 degrees or a fresh tank about the same. I guess it depends on how much cold water you're putting into the hot soil too. I'm not worried about drip, drip, drip now.

Got my mulching done including covering the drip line, so that water should be down in the 80s from now on and the soil being under mulch, ought to bring that top 2 inches down from 98 frikkin degrees.

Here we put a lot into seed tray temps but don't think much about soil temps which can and should actually be cooler and I've never set a heat mat for 98 frikkin degrees. And then direct sowing into 98 --- nuts.

I'm going to sow replacement seeds for what didn't germinate and see if the results are different.

I mulched the bed with maters and peppers with alfalfa hay. Some high dollar compressed stuff a neighbor didn't need. That along with that bed being loaded with goat manure, I don't think I need any amendments for a Fall planting. Alfalfa is a nitrogen source. Gave some to the new goat momma too. Both momma goats seem more attentive and momma-like with these twins.

As far as questions about a subject like irrigation water temps, I'm loving perplexity.ai, AI generated answers. It's my default browser's search engine.

---

It was nice getting some things done today. When I first went back to work after having sat on my butt for 9 months, I had an excuse to now sit on my butt for my two days off to rest. Then swapping to 4 - 10 hour days, kind of had an excuse to sit on my butt for the day after and day before the work week but didn't do much on the middle day off either. I also had zero to spend and doing things costs money, period. I was falling into a lazy trap though and broke free today. Having a $150 waterpump to put on and being able to spend $35 today to do it made a big difference.

[Pollard]

I want one. Clean up fall leaves for a soil amendment. Mow the lawn and have all the seed free hay aka grass clippings I need for mulch. I need one.

[Paul R.]

Haha - I was out (and then “out” with an early crash to bed) yesterday afternoon & evening. Now I’m up, way too early...

So, Pollard has beaten me to it and covered the irrigation temperature issue pretty well. (There’s a pun in there somewhere!) I do avoid watering from a “hot hose” (run until lukewarm) this time of year. We get some really cold downbursts in t’storms sometimes, but generally I’m more worried about the storm itself, or, really cold precipitation. (Hail!)

I save rainwater when practical, but, I really need a dedicated setup and large barrels to do that effectively after the spigot turns off (usually in early July, for us.)

Poor germination, I suspect from uncontrolled soil temperature is my biggest problem. I have the damdest problems getting Opo (or snake gourds), for example, to germinate. When the soggy soils killed off all my Opo except one in a pot (doing well), I tried starting some more, but not one has germinated. Too warm for them now @ my upstairs “plants window”, I guess, even though it’s a “tropical” plant... The already in small starter pots tomatoes are mostly doing well though. (My determinate varieties usually fizzle out in August, so, I’m going to try planting some late to see if I get any harvest in Sept.)

I collect and use rainwater in the spring, but really need a dedicated setup and large barrels to do that effectively, esp. after the spigot turns off - usually in early July, for us.

Of note / in the other direction: I’m convinced now that Roundup works much better with rainwater than our hard well water. Apparently, minerals in the well water tend to neutralize glyphosate-based herbicides.

[Pollard]

All I did was ask AI but the answer was fuzzy on details and I didn’t click on any of the source links. I’m wondering about growing under black plastic mulch which has to bake the soil. I guess that’s why they use white plastic mulch sometimes and in the odd case of strawberries(I think), they prefer red plastic mulch.

Has to have an affect on soil microbes but with compost, they get really active and create that heat on their own but that’s a different set of microbes.

Grow maters under black plastic mulch but worry about irrigating with black plastic drip line exposed to sun because of heat? Contradiction.

Looked over the links and it depends. Study on direct sown soybeans using different irrigation techniques said drip allowed the soil to stay warmer and germination was faster and sprouts were bigger.

Rice can be damaged from cold water.

Study on greenhouse veggies says 68-71.6 degrees is ideal for growth stage of veggies. Quite specific yet didn’t mention what veggies. It’s standard practice to turn off the heat mat after germination so cooler growing temps than germination temp is a known thing.

In nature, everything seems to manage and a rain can really cool off the soil and full sun on clear hot day vs cool dark nights makes a big swing. In nature, the soil generally stays covered with something. Either live plants or leaves/litter.

At 6am my garden soil at 2 inches was 77 degrees and 3pm it was 98 degrees which seems a bit hot and a big swing. Now that I mulched with light colored hay, I’m sure the daytime soil temp will drop into the 80s. Might have an effect on night time temps within a couple of days as the thermal mass cools. My tatsoi and celery have light spots on their leaves that showed up when these 90+ degree days showed up. Will see if that goes away with cooler soil.

They say pull back the mulch in Spring to allow the soil to warm up so direct sun on bare soil is known for warming the soil. Some people put a black tarp over beds in the Spring to warm the soil up. Everyone turns the heat mats off after germination so cooler soil for growth is known.

So for me, I think I could have mulched a little earlier to avoid the near 100 degree temp and that includes mulching the drip lines. Come Fall when it gets cold, swap out the hay mulch for dark compost mulch until the following May or June.

My gut tells me 60 to 80s is good but it depends on crop. Peas to watermelon - 60 to 80s. I think of 90 degree soil with 60 a degree fast heavy watering like running out of hot water in the shower. Bit of a shock. Not worried about it for drip though.

Once I have all four IBC tanks that will mostly get filled with rain water, things will change. That and with cold temps, I’ll end up with 40 degree tank water at some point and then have to worry about it freezing soon after. Irrigate with 36 degree water? yikes. Do I need cold weather tanks painted black? Swap my white gutters for black gutters to melt ice/snow? Thought about a tank or two inside the tunnel for winter.

Meanwhile, it’s light out so I’m going to go re-sow those bean/melon seeds and see what happens with soil that’s mid 80s instead of high 90s. Not going to pre-soak as I read an extension article that said not to and I know those beds are moist all the time with the intermittent drip schedule I have going.