Posted on 05/12/2025 7:07:32 AM PDT by Red Badger
This is the most idiotic government regulation of the last decade (and that's saying something). The technology shuts off the engine every time the vehicle stops in traffic or at a red light/stop sign.
The average driver might save $1,000 over a decade of using the vehicle if they live in an urban area with frequent stops, but Enhanced Flooded Batteries and heavy-duty starters also cost more, meaning maintenance swallows up much or all of their savings.
(They also have to put up with the psychological torture of having their car turn off and on every five seconds.)
Here's YouTuber Scotty Vilmar explaining in his unique style why this tech is maddening. 👇
New vehicles are not "required" to have such systems, but Swamp bureaucrats created massive incentives for automakers to create something that customers actually hate, all in the name of saving the planet [read: padding their wallets]. Two agencies are primarily responsible for this stupidity in the U.S.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration oversees Corporate average fuel economy (CAFE) standards.
The Environmental Protection Agency oversees greenhouse gas regulations.
The logic for these regulations goes back to the scarcity scare of the Arab oil embargo in the 1970s. Even though we have more available oil than ever, back then, politicians were worried that the stupid peasants would use up all our oil reserves in a crisis, so they aimed to impose regulations on us.
If they imposed taxes and rules on the peasantry, however, the peasants would get angry.
Instead, our ruling elite decided to make it unprofitable not to follow generic rules established by faceless bureaucracies, weaponizing the system to create products that are less efficient and unwanted by customers so that government workers could justify their paychecks.
For example, in 2007, Congress passed the Energy Independence and Security Act that tightened CAFE standards, with a target of 35 miles per gallon for the average fuel economy of passenger cars and light trucks by 2020. This forced automakers to figure out how to make vehicles that got that kind of mileage even if the market demand was not there.
A revolving door of such bills and regulations has made modern cars complex, expensive, buggy, and annoying: A living example of the absolute mess created by government intervention.
I’d just like a revocation of the rules that the ass end of every passenger car has to be 4ft high, the hood of every pickup has to be up to my armpits, and total taillight area must be larger than Nevada.
Dumbest feature ever. So glad my Honda has an option to turn it off.
L
Almost sounds like a Yugo.
Which, BTW, are being re-released next year.
Another good reason I’m thrilled to still be driving my 2011 Toyota Camry.
That is one of the stupidest laws I’ve never heard of!
BTW, we paid $2.41 per gallon of gas at Sams yesterday. Just for reference.
“It would seem that a start sequence burns the richest mixture of fuel/ air resulting in more Mother Earth killing pollutants. ;=)”
modern direct injected gasoline engines once at operating temp do not use fuel enrichment at start up and even cold due to the 3000+ psi fuel injection pressure even cold fuel is a fine micron sized mist as soon as it is injected directly into the cylinder. Only the first few hundred rpm have fuel enrichment maps once the engine is at high idle speed it goes open loop stoichiometric using either a mass airflow sensor or absolute manifold pressure sensor. This is easy to check using a ECU connected diagnostic cable and a laptop or tablet,now you can even use Bluetooth right from the OBDII port to see in real time down to the individual injection event if you have the tech savvy to do it.
Once at operating temps the engine will start in a single revolution of the crank because the ECU has already ok shut down knows which cylinder was in the compression part of the cycle it gets a direct injection of a 14:1 proper mix and the plug fires it off just past TDC that single event is enough to kick the motor over for the next cylinder and the one after to get injected and fired off. In less than 300 milliseconds the engine is at 700+ rpm the starter only has to spin the motor at most a quarter turn to hit that preselected cylinder to just past TDC. So the wear is minimal on the starter, modern cars also have anti-drain back silicon check valves in the oil system which keeps all the journals and channels full of oil even on shut down oil is in incompressable the instant the pump puts pressure on the system every part upstream of the check valve is at full pressure too this is basic hydraulic physics. A lot of newer cars have electric oil pumps too those kick on before a start event but even mechanical one start moving oil on the first rpm of rotation. That and a warm engine has oil film all through it a few tens of seconds or a minute sitting off at a stop in no way could drain that oil film away. This is easy to check turn your motor off then immediately pull your dipstick it will be lower than full. Then come back in an hour it will be higher but not totally full it takes hours to get the level back to full.
It’s boomer fud a few seconds off hurts a motor. We get it bro it’s annoying but save the FUD it does no real harm and engineers will confirm this on modern motors time and time again.
As for savings vmmy Saab and both Volvos had start stops systems that worked just as described above they took under 300 milliseconds to be at running speed faster than you could move your foot from the brake pedal to the accelerator. By the time your foot hit the accelerator it was not only running but it knew to be at high idle 1800rpm already giving you a FASTER pull away vs sitting at idle the 750rpm normal set point.
My S60 got 5 mpg better mileage with it on in Houston traffic and DFW. I was putting 36,000 miles a year on it. In traffic with it off ones setting 23-25 mpg at best , so th it on 28-29 that’s 5 mpg. That’s 279 gallons difference over a single year at $3.25 a gallon back then it was worth $906 per yesr. Yeah I’ll take the cut out for nearly a grant a year less fuel cost but hey freedom and merica spend your money how you want too. In reality it is not doing a lick of damage my S40 went 180,000+ miles the S60 close to that as well they were multi city’s commuter cars.
I had a rental Toyota that kept the engine running as long as you didn’t have the brakes pushed had to the floor. If you held the petal down at a light like you just buried it to the floor to avoid a collision the engine would shut off. Otherwise, take just a tiny amount of pressure off and the engine stays on.
I used to buy silver or gray cars, I had an old Buick Skylark from the 80’s that was silver. My last car was a gray VW POS. I got tired of losing my cars in the parking lot.
Hence the blood red car. Now I can always see my car in case I forgot where I parked.
It was an intentional choice.
Thanks. I understood most of that. I hadn’t thought of any fuel mapping and ECU input.
Maybe it just goes against decades of habit forming, like ABS brakes. It took a while to learn not to pump the brakes.
I also used to fly round engines. Everything had to be babied or it would turn into a very short flight.
EC
My 2025 BMW works the same way. Mine has a mild hybrid system and I can't really tell the difference between modes. The only time I hear the engine startup is when I first turn it on..
I can turn off this ‘feature’ in my 2024 Grand Cherokee.
My ‘64 with a 273 V8 was sweet!
I just sat in the drivers seat of my daughters new ford f350.
The dash is like an aircraft instrument panel!!
Cameras every where!
Got it used, with 11,000 miles on it, for more than $59k
when on the OUTSIDE in affects its speed.
Consider the skeeter flying towards the plane at 1 foot per second and the plane flying towards the skeeter at 880 ft/sec (600 mph).
At the moment of impact the bug STOPS going forward and starts going backward. This means it’s speed, at some point in time is ZERO - thereby stopping the plane as well.
Well, it's a representative government.
Listen to an accomplished mechanical engineer. If the bug runs into the plane head on, the plane continues moving and the bug reverses direction of motion. The change in planes speed can be calculated using preservation of combined momentum of the 2 objects. Momentum is mass x velocity.
Did the bug stop or not?
Was it in contact with the plane??
ERGO
That's not a bug, it's a feature.
Yes bug stopped and reversed direction of motion. The plane has much higher momentum so it continued moving in original direction at almost same speed
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