Posted on 05/07/2016 7:34:23 PM PDT by PinkChampagneonIce
Dear Freeper Preppers:
I have tried to find answers to these questions, and just haven't had much luck. Freepers are always incredibly knowledgeable, so I thought I would throw this out for general comment.
I live somewhat off the grid, in that I live with a bare minimum of electrical appliances. I have a small, motel-sized refrigerator. Its temperature varies. It is so small, that the thermometer will indicate a 5 degree reduction in temperature if I just open the door. During the winter, it is fairly easy to keep it below 40. During the summer, that becomes a challenge. There are many days when the temperature is high that it remains at 45 or so.
The conventional wisdom is that if the temperature rises about 40 the bacteria, germs, microbes, whatever, start growing in food and make it unsafe to eat. As anyone who has lived as I do knows, that is simply not true. For example, sometimes I will buy a pre-cooked rotisserie chicken at the market. It is hot when I buy it, and warm when I put it in the refrigerator. Even if the refrigerator thermometer is showing 45 degrees, the chicken doesn’t automatically “spoil.” If it is in a sealed container/packaging, it is good for at least three days, even though it is chicken, which is considered notoriously likely to spoil. After the three days, I can still use it if I put in in a soup or stew which is boiled for more than 10-15 minutes. I can also refrigerate leftovers for at least 2-3 days without any harmful effects. So just because something is stored below 40 degrees does not necessarily mean that it has spoiled or is dangerous.
Before refrigeration, people used ice boxes. They were insulated, and cooled with blocks of ice. Having done this when I was young on camping trips, I sincerely doubt they maintained a temperature below 40 degrees. Although some people suffered from “summer sickness” from spoiled food, people weren’t dropping like flies. Obviously, some foods are more likely to spoil in a way that causes sickness than others, although this is completely obscured by the modern warnings that anything cooled about 40 degrees is unsafe. I know that in Great Britain, people do not refrigerate items which we are told MUST be refrigerated – for example, jams, mayonnaise, etc. My understanding is that in medieval times spices were prized because they made “tainted” meat palatable.
And so, to my question. For those who have lived off the grid, or in less developed countries, do you have any other guidelines than those which say everything must be cooled below 40 degrees? In your experience, which foods spoil the fastest, and in the most dangerous fashion? Which spoil but are just nasty, not life threatening? In an emergency situation, which foods should be absolutely avoided after a certain time at a certain temperature, and which can be worked with by boiling for 10-15 minutes or charring over an open fire. When is “tainted” meat OK to eat, and when will it kill you?
I’m posting this fairly late in the evening. I’m going to bed, so I won’t be replying to this thread until tomorrow or Monday. I really appreciate your input on this topic.
It’s necessary - IMHO - to ignore the crux of your question and go to the root of the matter: Gut health. In drafting my book I’ve become aware of an epidemic sweeping the population and, as such, the ‘prepper question’ mandates ensuring intestinal health inasmuch as the very food supplies you seek to inventory. I believe the rising incidence of food poisoning reports is not evidence of ‘dirty food’, but of weak immune systems. I also believe the so-called ‘epidemic of disease’ is a consequence as well.
If anyone truly vested in ‘being prepared’ has a combination of these symptoms, educate yourself and fix your gut:
• Acne or other skin problems
• Anxiety, panic attacks, feeling “blue”
• Blurry eyes, eye teaming problems, eye fatigue, floaters, burning or tearing eyes
• Brain fog, poor concentration, feeling ‘spacey’ (confusion)
• Chills, cold feeling in your extremities (cold feet/hands, turning up the heat regularly)
• Dizziness
• Dry mouth, bad breath
• Ear itching, infections, pressure, swelling or tingling
• Fatigue/extreme lethargy especially after eating
• Food sensitivity/allergies
• Food cravings, increased hunger
• Frequent urination
• Gut symptoms, including: Abdominal cramps alleviated by bowel movements, flatulence, generally heinous, heartburn, indigestion, irregular bowels; diarrhea or constipation, painful bowel movements, IBS
• Hair follicle inflammation (candidiasis folliculitis) of various parts of the body (feet, legs, arms), hair loss
• Headaches
• Hyperactivity, attention problems
• Insomnia
• Irritability, mood swings
• Joint swelling and aches, upper back pain/shoulders/neck, lower back pain
• Light-headedness
• Libido problems
• Memory problems, confusion
• Menstruation irregularity, endometriosis, PMS, flushing, night sweats
• Muscle coordination problems, muscle weakness and muscle/tendon pain
• Nutrient absorption problems, malnutrition, need for vitamin supplements
• Sinus problems, post nasal drip, sinusitis/sinus congestion, sinus irritability, seasonal allergies
• Skin autoimmune conditions (eczema), yeast infections, dandruff, dry skin, dry heel cracking rectal itching or athletes foot, extremities numb, burning or tingling sensations, White coated tongue / Oral thrush
• Symptoms worse after starches and/or sugars or foods containing them
The irony is that most people experiencing many of those symptoms have been doing so for years and have rationalized them as ‘normal’, just as I had done.
Think about it: If your gut isn’t as healthy as your inventory, an intestinal illness will kill you long before the food is gone. As you cite about historical food storage: People survived even when there weren’t refrigerators. I believe that’s telling.
.02
Be well.
I'm fairly certain a Beretta M9 will still kill you even if boiled.
For each 10 degrees centigrade(not fahrenheit) you raise the temperature, you double the rate of an organic chemical reaction. Conversely, for each 10 degrees centigrade you lower the temp, you cut the rate of the chemical reaction in half.
As for the poorly working old refrigerator: Check the Freon. Make sure the coils are clean. Check the gasket around the door perimeter that seals it
...For 1k you can buy a used camper...
A stove and water heater use a ton of propane.
In a SHTF situation, and even in normal times, an RV fridge uses practically none.
One 4 gallon tank will last for months and run the fridge/ freezer. But, a camper also provides a roof and bed.
Aging hanging meat changes the texture (makes it easier to cut). I have only heard of hanging meat outside or in a barn during winter.
Spices actually often act as a preservative. If you look at the world, the areas where people prefer spicy food are also very warm: Mexico, Louisiana, Southern Italy, Spain, certain provinces of China, India, etc. Yet, in colder climates, the food is usually bland (to me). It has been theorized that when food got too hot and became spoiled, people who preferred spicy food survived and passed that preference on.
My raw egg sodium silicate experiments have been epic fail.
Unwashed eggs last longer than washed eggs.
I should add my mom would do the float test before boiling eggs, any that floated she did not boil.
Old camping technique.
We learned to make them in the Boy Scouts out of orange crates and burlap bags.
They work on the same principle as the "swamp cooler" type air conditioners.
Keep the burlap wet and the evaporation keeps the contents cool.
Something like this:
Just Google "evaoporative cooler" to get some ideas.
this reminds me of how kimchi and is made in korea - they put everything in a jar sealed it (wax maybe) and buried it. Sauerkraut is fermented similarly but I don’t know if the germans ever buried theirs.
I raise my own pork. They start free ranging with clean feed and water given once a day. They get treated for ant illness and de-wormed. They go from babies to the freezer in 7 months. Yes poorly raised sickly pork should be avoided. Same with chicken, beef and fish.
Just saying that store bought mass raised anything can be dangerous. I have seen dying cattle “make” it to slaughter house in time.
Good fmeat costs more or takes more time to raise. It’s worth it in my opinion.
“My raw egg sodium silicate experiments have been epic fail.”
You need to dip the eggs in boiling water for a few seconds to kill any surface bacteria before sealing them with water glass.
floating is just an age indicator.
Yeah pretty simple. I converted my gas grill from propane to nat gas when we moved to the current house. It was literally as easy as drilling out the feed orifice hole.
My dog is a champ at this: kills a rabbit and buries it, digs it up before it turns and eats like a king. She has about 3 in her ‘fridge’ atm.
Anyways, have you thought about curing/smoking? I like to pepper cure lean cuts of meat. My gf will not partake, but I can keep it well above 45 with no gastronomical problems for a few days. (only venison and beef, no pork or poultry)
Maybe this will sound crazy to everyone but you. I would bury a large picnic cooler. Use a couple of carpet rugs to cover the lid when it is closed to help insulate it. Use ice inside. Make sure you get one with a low drain plug so you can get rid of the water when the ice melts. If you bury it well with insulation it could suit your needs.
Covering meats in fat may not be common as a storage method, but call it by the French name “confit”, and it’s considered gourmet cooking: http://www.seriouseats.com/2013/01/ask-the-food-lab-what-the-heck-is-confit.html
I have a cookbook by Michael Ruhlman that had pretty much half the book dedicated to confits.
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