Transmission of disease

[zimfam007]

What is the difference b/w an airborne pathogen and everything else?

[zimfam007]

My agent orange is sooooo acting up. I am so frustrated by seeing all these posts and articles about Ebola not being an airborne pathogen. So many people posted this crap and the media talking about this and even the medical community highlighting this don't even really understand a) what they are posting/reporting b) understand the layman's understanding of what an airborne pathogen entails. It is so very specific in the world of microbiology...to say that a disease is not airborne is not to say that it cannot be transmitted via droplets. The distinction is so specific that to put out a blanket statement saying it is not airborne or it is airborne w/o laying out the science behind those statements is very very bad reporting/science/information disbursement. In order for a pathogen to be deemed airborne, it must be able to infect over a long distance and time (in microbe standards), hence the saying in the early 20th century, "Open the window and In FLU ENZA". When a person is in the mid to late stages of a disease, where viral loads are high, especially when the pathogen can be transmitted via bodily fluids, transmission can occur from sneezes/coughs where saliva and mucous are exchanged in close proximity and the non-infected person comes into contact with those droplets on "wet" membranes, i.e. Nasal, pharyngeal, eyes, cuts in the skin. This DOES NOT MEAN it is an airborne pathogen. My fear is that when people say it is not airborne, that the layman thinks it cannot be transmitted via droplet form b/c the doctors/medical community and the laymen understand the vocabulary from two distinct points of view. This is JUST NOT THE CASE!

[oblomov]

My understanding is that sneezing and coughing aren’t typical symptoms of the disease, unlike, say, influenza and measles.

[zimfam007]

Understand your reasoning; however, when the mucosial membranes are agitated, as happens in most infections ( as with Ebola) an infected person will cough and sneeze as the body tries to clear pathways. Just understand that this disease, in early stages, mimics diseases like influenza and malaria....

[oblomov]

I’m inclined to believe that there is risk to airborne transmission with Ebola, just not as much as with other diseases. It seems to preferentially attack the alimentary system.

[zimfam007]

But for a microbe to be able to infect via airborne transmission is so very specific in the micro/virology world. That is why I am saying, to say that it is not airborne, or better yet, transmission is not airborne is a disservice and a horrible lack of public education. For the most part, the laymen has no understanding b/w the specifics of airborne transmission and droplet transmission. This is why I have been so frustrated. I have talked to many people that do not have a background in micro/virology/public health and those that do have an extensive background and the conversations all agree that when an official says that Ebola is not an airborne pathogen, the laymen automatically assume that they cannot contract the disease in an “airborne” manner. I put “airborne” in quotes b/c the laymen assumes that coughs/sneezes et al equate to airborne and that is simply, not scientifically the case due to the transmission via droplets which is TOTALLY different than airborne transmission.

[Bobalu]

All virii can live in droplets suspended in the air and carried by air currents.

They differ VERY widely in how long they can survive in droplets in the air.

They also differ in how easily they can infect another person when they are breathed into the lungs or deposited on the eyes or other mucus membranes.

The common cold is extremely hardy in these respects and just a few particles breathed in will give you a cold.

Ebola is FAR less hardy in the air than the cold virus. It is possible that Ebola could someday mutate into a form more easily transmitted by airborne droplets.... perhaps a change in the protein coat could do it... make it hardier and more sticky. As it is right now Ebola is able to transfer to a new host by droplets coughed directly into ones face from less than three feet.... picture a wet cough of such magnitude that you need to wipe your face off or rub the droplets from your eyes.

[greeneyes]

Yep, when the CDC says it’s not airborne, then the layman thinks ok sneezes and coughs etc. are not a problem.

Stating that sneezes and coughs are not usually symptoms of Ebola, doesn’t make provision for the Flu season coming up, and there’s going to be lots of sneezing and coughing, and I assume that someone with Ebola could also have the flu. Not to mention that there are many reason why someone sneezes, and if they have Ebola those droplets contain the virus.

[ansel12]

My impression is that they are saying that it isn’t airborne, but remember that within 3 feet, you could still get some liquid on you from coughing and sneezing, and rub it in your eyes, or such tissue that isn’t your outer skin.

But sharing the same air isn’t a problem.

[freds6girlies]

bookmark

[PA Engineer]

I posted a link on the Ebola Surveillance Thread. I think it is much worse in a pandemic setting. This is the most definitive study I have found to date:

Link

The virus will survive for long periods as active virus or fomite at <4ºC. We in many ways with winters in the north are far worse than Africa.

Three feet is a guess and conservative to begin with. 90 minute aerosol viral life is a disaster. Add cold temperatures and folmites. We cannot let it into the country.

This is where the dishonest CDC reporting is both political or "crisis reporting." Either they are incompetent or insidious to the core. It doesn't really matter considering their massive failure in our current trial by fire.

[jazzlite]

Are droplets of mucus and saliva not bodily fluids? Of course they are. Would those be a way of transmitting Ebola, especially in the closed environment of an airplane..I believe they would.

[Smokin' Joe]

Ping…

A link to this thread has been posted on the Ebola Surveillance Thread

[Smokin' Joe]

The survival of filoviruses in liquids, on solid substrates and in a dynamic aerosol

[iontheball]

My understanding is that sneezing and coughing aren’t typical symptoms of the disease, unlike, say, influenza and measles.
__________________________________________
A person does not need to have Ebola to sneeze or cough. These are common reoccurring bodily functions, just as sweat is secreted from the human body. Viral particles do not need to hit someone, they may land or be placed by hand contact on an article that is subsequently touch by another.

[iontheball]

Would those be a way of transmitting Ebola, especially in the closed environment of an airplane..I believe they would.
_________________________________________________
Let’s just consider the secretion of sweat. Sweat from palms that touch lavatory door handles, faucets, etc. Palms that are placed on arm rests, tray tables and trays, cups, etc., in an airplane.

[lostboy61]

Well here is my problem with this whole thing. I saw a medical study that was done on shopping carts at your local store. 72% had fecal matter on the handles from poor bathroom practices. So if the general population can not wipe there ass correctly and wash their hands what chance do we have? If you add sneezing and coughing than stores are a good place to die.

[Cvengr]

Oh,..you mean like this?

[sten]

ebola is a direct contact or aerosol contagion

i’m wondering when we can just start calling it the Black Death

both are hemorrhagic fevers and this latest outbreak was brought to us by our first black president

[Cvengr]

http://scgnews.com/ebola-what-youre-not-being-told

a nice summary of transmission risks.

If you are in the same room, for an extended period of time, the risk increases for some infected particle lighting on a mucous membrane or in the lungs, or even a microcut or fresh shave.

[thesligoduffyflynns]

Agreeing here with your most sensible post of all.