Posted on 06/26/2011 12:13:10 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants
As many of you have discovered, you automatic dish detergent hasn't been working very well for the past year, leaving a white film on the dishes. Well, the reason, as usual, is the envirowhackos using junk science to claim that algae blooms in rivers are caused by the phosphates in your dish detergent. The phosphates in detergent do NOT cause the algae to bloom because the algae can't break down the trisodium phosphates. So, instead of check out the facts, the detergent companies were more interested in currying favor with the envirowhackos.
Well, there isn't much way to get them to change their mind, especially since it is actually cheaper for them to make phosphate free detergent (never mind it doesn't work), but you CAN replace the phosphates in your detergent. Just go to the cleaner section of your local hardware store and look for Trisodium Phosphate. Home Depot and Lowes both carry it. Just add about a teaspoon to every load and you will get your dishes clean again. This is the cheapest method.
You can also buy Cascade with phosphates from places that sell commercial grade cleaners. Restockit.com is one place. I am sure there are others if you search.
Yes TSP works great in the dishwasher, but it’s gritty & really hard on clothes.
“STPP”, Sodium Tripolyphosphate, is what you need to use for your washer. Unfortunately I don’t know where you can cost-effectively buy it. It’s the phosphate form being phased out of our laundry detergent.
It’s amazing the bad rap phosphates are getting. Phosphates are essential to all plant & animal life.
Why does the TSP box say it should NOT be used on glass or come in contact with glass??? It also says it turns aluminum containers dark as well.
Probably. The old stuff with phosphates was supposed to have about 20%, so figure 1 part TSP to 4 parts dish detergent.
Na2(B4O7)•10(H2O)
, has water softening, cleansing and disinfectant properties, but is not chemically related to any other substance discussed in this thread.
And how much longer do you think the EPA will allow that?
The imperial government must be obeyed, or peasants must die.
I was considering this...but on the side of the TSP package it said to avoid using on glass??
Just use in a low concentration???
Lye is also used for making soap
I was reading about it, and it is apparently the water that you might think you would get if you dunked wood ashes in a burlap sack into a barrel of water, like a tea bag
You can make your own
It might etch glass in the higher concentrations that are on the box.
The EPA didn’t ban it in dish detergent. It was done voluntarily so that they could get brownie points from the envirowhackos.
Thanks, that is what I was thinking since it is sold as a siding and deck cleaner.
We’ve been using TSP (the real stuff) as an additive in our dishwasher and washing machine for about a month now. It makes a huge difference. Our dishwasher, which had begun to accumulate a black (and as I recently discovered, potentially dangerous) mold is now spotless. The dishes squeak again when you rub your fingers on them, and our white towels are once again, white.
These environmental scams are only possible because you have people too ignorant to know better, lacking any REAL critical thinking skills and devoid of morals, looking for a purpose to latch onto to make a difference. Environmentalism and all the scams surrounding it is how the liberal/secularist tithes.
TSP isn’t the best, as it can leave a residue. The stuff for detergent is Sodium Tripolyphosphate (STPP). It can be ourchased from a number of suppliers like soapgoods.com or http://www.chemistrystore.com/cart.cgi?group=100513&child=100614
Caustic soda is sodium hydroxide (NaOH), aka lye.
I wouldn’t add it to a clothes washer, and maybe not to a dishwasher. The reason it prevents film on glass in a dishwasher is because in hot water it attacks the silica and changes it to sodium silicate, which is water soluble. In other words, it actually dissolves a little of the glass each time by reacting with it. (It prevents film from building up on a substrate by removing the top layer of the substrate). The dissolution won’t occur perfectly evenly over time, so if used too aggressively the glass eventually will gain a slightly rough texture and after a long enough time it will have a slightly frosted appearance that is permanent. Sodium hydroxide does this even to the high grade borosilicate glass used in chemistry laboratories.
As for the clothes, sodium hydroxide will also break most natural fibers down over time via alkaline hydrolysis. If you’ve ever had a cotton shirt develop a hole in it over time from bleaching, the weakening of the fibers that leads to the holes isn’t caused by the sodium hypochlorite (which releases chlorine) in the bleach so much as from the sodium hydroxide added to bleach to stabilize the hypochlorite.
So yes, caustic soda is good for keeping glass looking good in the short term, and excellent for getting grease and oil out of clothes, but it damages both in the long term. It matters less with the glass because it removes very, very little each cycle, but it’ll damage natural fabrics pretty reliably in the long term.
Oh, my goodness. Do you know my husband? ;-) He said almost the same thing, but as an engineer he also drew pictures and wrote formulas.
All the crap I find in the store is PF.
Garde la Foi, mes amis! Nous nous sommes les sauveurs de la République! Maintenant et Toujours!
(Keep the Faith, my friends! We are the saviors of the Republic! Now and Forever!)
LonePalm, le Républicain du verre cassé (The Broken Glass Republican)
Are you using it? If so how much for laundry and dishwasher? Shipping is a killer for me but other than that it’s not that much more than TSP. I’m trying to find it local.
I notice it’s food grade and very non-toxic too.
Another good additive is Lemi-Shine. Get it at Von's or Walmart. Finally, occasionally I toss a couple of cups of plain white vinegar in the bottom of the dishwasher, and a half-cup of CLR.
If I didn't do all of this my dishes and glasses would be white, cloudy, and gross. I prefer CLEAN dishes.
I tried TSP and it was ok. Then I read you could put 1/2 cup vinegar + 1/2 cup water in a coffee mug in the back corner and run it as you always do. It takes the soap film off and makes the glassware sparkle. Even easier to set up.
Try places that sell janitorial supplies.
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