Posted on 08/11/2010 5:10:45 AM PDT by marktwain
Capt. John Raguso keeps threatening to send us a review of Kel Tecs smokin SUB-2000 9mm carbine. Today, Hi-Point Carbines drops the news that their long awaited .45 ACP rifle is ready to rock and roll. These handgun-caliber carbine may be gaining favor over the venerable 12-gauge as the weapon of choice for hom defense. And for good reason. In fact, here are four. . .
1. Less recoil than a shotgun
While home defense shotguns put an awful lot of lead downrange with a single trigger squeeze, shooters pay the price with a big ole wallop to their shoulder. Thats no big thing for big people whore comfortable with firearms (who may, in fact, like the kick). And in the heat of battle, who cares? But if a gun is formidable to fire (i.e. painful), its owners are FAR less likely to practice. If they dont, they will not be confident and accurate.
Even in .45 ACP, handgun-caliber carbines have minimal recoil, relatively speaking. The lower recoil makes the rifles far more attractive to women, teens and (lets be honest here) small-framed men. They can also put a lot of lead downrange. BONUS! Quick mag changes are easier than reloading a shotgun.
2. Quieter than a shotgun
The state prohibitions against silencers really piss me off. (Somebody was watching way too many spy movies.) Meanwhile, shotguns are ridiculously, enormously loud. While a handgun caliber carbine will make plenty of noise, a shooter stands a chance of being able to hear something after firingwhich could save their life. Comparing the two firearms genres, handgun caliber rifles will definitely reduce a shooters chances of permanent, perhaps even catastrophic hearing loss.
3. Better than a handgun
Sos a shotgun. But again, there are plenty of people who find shotguns intimidating. In that sense, handgun caliber carbines hit the sweet spot. Thanks to the carbines longer sight radius, theyre easier to aim than a handgun, And more intimidating (i.e. visible)
Handgun caliber carbines increase bullet speed and, thus, penetration. Hi-Point says their .45 ACPs longer barrel increases velocity figures between 80-200 FPS (feet per second) over a like-chambered handgun.
4. Less expensive
To my way of thinking, a semi-automatic weapon is the best home defense shotgun. A good one costs the thick end of a grand. This Hi-Point .45 ACP Carbine costs $330. The SUB-2000 goes for $409.
I love shotguns. But the handgun caliber carbines may be better for more people. The market will speak.
Specifications for Hi-Point .45 ACP Carbine:
Price: $330 MSRP Finish: Special high-durability black powder coat Stock: Black molded polymer-(with standard upper and lower Picatinny rails). Barrel length: 171/2-inches Overall length: 33-inches Weight: 71/2-pounds. Magazine capacity: 9-rounds. Sight: Adjustable front post and adjustable rear (ghost ring) Warranty: Lifetime on parts and labor that follows the gun. Manufacturer: Hi-Point of Mansfield Ohio-every part is made in the U.S.A. Factory affordable options are available: Folding grip, laser, scope sight, etc.
Me too. Except that it was a bit difficult to retract the bolt on the simplified later version M3A1 when wearing gloves. That was a problem during my first hitch, as a young tank crewman in Germany, less so my second time out of the cage during my tour of the spas and cathouses of Southeast asia.
The only real problem I had with the things was that the GI issue 3-cell magazine pouches were in short supply. In germany we used an *engineers bag* pouch with eight mags to cure that problem. After I found out how much ammo I could go through when I missed a lot, I started carrying 15 magazines in a GO *buttpack* on a wide strap sling over my other shoulder.
I've had a 14-inch barrelled Remington 870 AOW, and found it to be a bit slow for the second and followup shots. Agreed, a 12-to-14- inch barrel can indeed be handy on a shotgun, but good control pretty well requires having the full buttstock on behind, not just a pistol grip.
Also, muzzle flash from a shorty can lead to flashblindness of the user at night. Since I had mine as bear insurance, that wasn't much of a consideration for me, particularly as my first round up the spout was a dragon's breath load, which I figured would serve either to discourage any bruins I ran into at night, or to signal to aircraft passing overhead.
That folds up like how Bugs Bunny would fold Elmer Fudd’s shotgun. That already makes me want one. But I live in the Democratic People’s Republic of Bloomberg City.
Plus I’m a small guy, so I’d probably only be able to handle a 20 gauge comfortably.
Carried one on the 5km zone on our side of the *Iron Curtain* fences in Germany in the 1960s and taught the NATO weapons familiarization course to Seventh Army NCO Academy troops at Bad Toelz. Had one when I was in Israel but mostly carried a Browning GP instead, and had one as my ambush answer while driving a Toyota half-ton truck or Volkswagen Rabbit in Africa in the '70s- the Uzi fit very nicely in the full-dash-width package shelf the Rabbit had instead of a glove box. Very neat, but not much reach- and now not often seen in Israel, where most in the Army carry M16s, and the police reservists [mishmir esrachi] mostly carry old US M1 carbines- more reach.
Mine didn't care much for US jacketed hollowpoint ammo, which would be what I'd want to use inside a home. But that was easy to fix, and in a vehicle in the outdoors with ball ammo mixed with occasional spits of three tracers, very nice.
I've been saving them because I know that when I get older I'll be too lazy to walk up to what I want to set on fire.
He missed riding in tanks in the SEA festivities, so didn’t have to deal with keeping the M3 fed in times of serious need. By that time he had gone Army Aviation and flew Caribou out of Can Tho. Don’t know what he kept in the cockpit, just thinking about it, and he’s not around to ask (he came back from VN, died after retirement).
Your answer on keeping the M3 fed looks like a good one to me!
Concur. If you've got enough ammo around, a Thompson can be a very handy thing to have.
All the *experts* agree!
Shotguns can be loaded with ammo that WON’T go through several walls and you don’t have to be a crack shot.
There's a very good series of videos on Youtube by a lawyer explaining why you should REMAIN SILENT. Perhaps somebody can post a link.
The most convincing point to me was that it isn't even safe to tell the absolute truth. If a credible witness mistakenly contradicts what actually happened, the contradiction alone might reflect badly on you, making it appear that you are lying.
Anything you wish to say can be said AFTER you talk to your attorney. I can't remember if it was the same series of videos which makes it clear that NOTHING you can say is likely to reverse the opinion of an officer who would decide to arrest you if you remain silent.
Where does she live that she can't have a taser? They are openly and freely available here in Texas. Grandma needs to move here. :)
But this grandpa (with cane BTW, temporarily at least) prefers .45 ACP, .30 Carbine and 12 gauge (mine has 18.5" barrel, full length pistol grip stock) There's a video of me shooting the serious social purposes shotgun (I have a bird gun too) on YouTube. (Can't go to YouTube here, but it's under "Humblegunner" and something like "3rd Texas Cowboy Memorial shoot. Lots of other FReepers shooting their weapons of choice, plus the livestock on the range.) In the video I also have one of the .45s on my hip (EAA Witness compact) , where it looks very tiny indeed.
Yep, there’s a 50 rd drum mag you can use with either the 1911 or the Camp Carbine. I’ve seen one, but never actually used it.
Ya outdrew me partner :-)
I like handguns and I like carbines but for clearing out space, nothing does it like a shotgun.
You forgot the hockey mask— for face protection (really!)
” But he doesnt really want a gun for HD like I do.”...
He must be of the opinion that taking out the trash is the wife’s job. =)
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