11th-HOUR LOOK AT 'PASSION' / THE TRUTH CAME OUT TOO LATE (Al Gore 111)

New York Post - Page Six ^ | 2/03/04 | Richard Johnson with Paula Froelich & Chris Wilson

[kattracks]

MEL Gibson isn't going to make it easy for critics of his controversial movie "The Passion of the Christ." The flick won't be screened for reviewers until just two days before its Ash Wednesday opening on Feb. 25, Post Movie Critic Lou Lumenick reports. Reps for the picture blamed the last-minute screening - usually reserved for such bombs as the Jennifer Lopez-Ben Affleck starrer "Gigli" - on its not being ready. "Passion" has been under attack over fears that it will fan anti- Semitism. Gibson has screened it for Christian conservatives - as well as at Internet movie gossip Harry Knowles' Butt-Numb-a-Thon film festival - but not for professional reviewers. Gibson, who claims his story comes straight from the Gospels, turned down a "courage" award from the Broadcast Film Critics Association, who insisted on seeing his flick first. It's widely believed he spurned an invitation from the Sundance Festival rather than subject "Passion" to the media elite prematurely.

[twigs]

I agree with you. I think the children of elected officials should stay out of the news. Even though we tend to knock politicians a lot, these people put in astonishing hours and all too often, their family life suffers. Marriages are difficult, but usually the spouse has some sort of say in the decision to enter public life. The children don't. I agree that this should remain a private matter.

[dangus]

The "prophecies" are a little wierd... They sound like some preachers trying to ride someone else's coattails.

But your letter certainly demonstrates how powerfully Satan moves within some "Christian" churches to sow distrust and fear and contempt and disunity. I just don't think it did so in the way you intended it to.

[dangus]

I'm sorry... It was a little bit of bad humor.

Bonnie Franklin was also the name of an actress who starred in a TV sitcom about a woman who fled her abusive, alcoholic husband with her two daughters. Valerie Bertinelli played one of the two daughters, who then had a very troubled time, getting herself in the tabloids regularly for the next decade. In truth, Ms. Bertinelli seems to have come out OK... Last few times I saw her, she was in gentle, vaguely Christian TV movies.

[Quix]

I suppose I should have been MORE wary hereon.

But I still prefer to live less cynically and treat things at face value until evidence indicates otherwise.

Thanks for fessing up.

[hurly]

I notice you did not answer the question. I guess you just can tell my attitude and tone from your superior faith. What hubris!
You are talking about "miracle cures", etc. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary proof! Why are you so reluctant to provide any facts? I am not questioning your faith or religion, just your facts!

[af_vet_1981]

What an incredibly stupid thing to say!

You should not be surprised. Many Jews have died because of that point of view (which you rightfully rebuke). I only hope there are more of you than him ...

[Quix]

It's possible that my response reflects a certain . . . element of reflex to the typical hereon.

However, in terms of the report--I found the reporting person very convincing. It may be that my long term relationship with the reporting route was a factor.

I also found a witness in my spirit as I read the report--much stronger than average by quite a margin, in fact. Either one of those would have been sufficient for me. Both together are certainly sufficient.

The pharisees demanded a sign. Modern day ones demand proof WITH A CERTAIN ATTITUDE. Your wording and style seem consistent with that attitude.

I'll see what I can track down in terms of the longer report. But, I don't think anything will convince you until you are 30 minutes away from death from perhaps lung cancer with massive masses over 70%+ of your lungs and then healed dramatically with accompanying X-rays. You MIGHT then believe. I'm skeptical short of that--that you'd believe any "evidence" regardless of how dramatic or rigorously obtained.

There are no accompanying medical stuff with the report. Just honest people in a room with needs when they arrived at the movie. As they left, the physical needs were gone. As the blind man in the NT said--'I don't know all that. All I know is that once I was blind but now I can see.'

I'm curious, does your theology preclude healings in the modern era--since St John ran out of ink with Revelation?

[dangus]

Don't be more wary... I shouldn't joke about certain topics... I just thought the names were well known enough...

[Quix]

Oh, I don't know.

I'm sure many enjoyed your joke.

I'm just not up on HOLLYWEED stuff by a looonnnnnngggg shot.

I do enjoy poking uhhhhh barbs at

Babs StrivingNTheSand.

[Quix]

I searched through half a dozen or more MEL GIBSON threads and didn't find the one concerned. I'm going to do some grading and class prep now. I may eventually search my own comments list to find the post.

I will note, however . . .

that while God DOES care about facts,

in Scripture and in my experience,

GOD CARES FAR MORE ABOUT ATTITUDE . . .

ESPECIALLY ATTITUDE OF THE HEART . . .

which seems to relate to spirit rather directly.

And the attitude of the heart and the spirit flowing out of the heart largely decide the nature of one's relationship with God and others.

I'll stop there instead of pontificating further at the moment.

[Texas2step]

You should not be surprised. Many Jews have died because of that point of view (which you rightfully rebuke). I only hope there are more of you than him ...

It was not surprise. I'm not surprised by much these days.

It's been my experience that there are "more of me than him". Unfortunately, there's probably even more that may agree with me, but won't dare call anyone on their bigotry or ignorance.

[dubyagee]

Mel is backing off the the end of the picture that implies/says the Jews killed Christ. And they did.

And so did you.

[hurly]

The blind man would be easy to verify. All I'm asking for is some proof that a medical problem, not spiritual need,feelings or other unproveable want, existed, but now does not, as a direct result of viewing this film. That is what you stated happened.

It is a good thing that I am not (I hope) dying of lung cancer at this moment, as you apparently wish on me for daring to question you or your Gods.
I do gather that you are taking the report of someone because you find them convincing. Liberals practice the same kind of "feel good" science to support their views.

I thought one of the hallmarks of a conservative was the ability and willingness and insistance of facing FACTS and basing our decisions/views on those! I realize that religion is one of those feel good things that you can neither prove or disprove, but if are going to say supernatural things occurred please be prepared to back that up with some kind of facts! Not hearsay

I have no personal bias for or against modern or ancient "miracles".

[pctech]

In other words I think these are prophecies are from the devil. If you want to believe them that is your right and I respect that

Someone who actually agrees with me. You could have taken farther and said something like, "How the Holy Spirit speak through a religious system that has murderer millions of actual god-fearing men and women in the last two thousand years?" But what the hey, no need to give anyone the notion of being a "catholic basher" huh?

That being said, I am going to see this movie and I will take my kids with me. Though it is coming from a catholic perspective, what from I hear even most learned protestant leaders are also hailing the film. If there are any discrepancies in what is actually in the Bible, then I will point it out.

[weegee]

Albert Gore III is getting a slap on the wrist this time because he was called a "first time offender" when that was not the case. This charge will be DROPPED from his record too if he can remain clean (or at least not get caught) for a probationary period. Then he can be a first offender yet again.

He is being coddled because of who he is.

[Quix]

Am glad you have no personal bias against ancient nor modern miracles. That's what I bristle at so quickly.

I'm saying to you that I don't believe the SORT of meticulously documented medical proof you are asking for exists in this situation.

It was as I reported a simple thing.

If you have had a serious pain or other overt medical problem and carried it for days to months or years, then in a meeting, it is suddenly gone, you don't need X-Rays to prove anything.

Anyway--I'll try and track down the longer report. But it will NOT satisfy you in the least. It may give you a more robust description from which to make a judgment.

IT IS CLEAR that you

FAVOR MAKING A TYPE II error instead of a TYPE I error. That arbitrary preference is always illogical and a little mystifying to me.

[weegee]

It's been my experience that there are "more of me than him". Unfortunately, there's probably even more that may agree with me, but won't dare call anyone on their bigotry or ignorance.

I call on people to do just that. This is the same problem that many have with Islamofascists not being shouted down by muslims.

Does Jesus' "Forgive them, Father, for they know not what they do" serve as a request for God to show mercy on Jews (and all of humanity)? Wouldn't that also appeal apply to Christians?

[Quix]

I'll be brash enough to add this:

I don't know how it will happen and it's a bit hard for me to imagine the context, contengencies . . .

But I strongly believe in my heart and spirit that there will be more than a few dead people raised from a showing of this film. I mean people who have been clinically dead for hours to days.

[hurly]

I said I have no bias against "miracles". Didn't say I believe in them, modern or ancient.

I can not and do not argue about feelings or subjective statements. If you said some people felt better after viewing the film, I would have no disagreement about that.

Thank you for a lively discussion even thought you wished me to have cancer to prove your gods benevolence.

[Lost Highway]

Mel is backing off the the end of the picture that implies/says the Jews killed Christ. And they did.

Actually if you are going to be that pickey the Romans killed Jesus. But it makes no difference who physically drove the nail. We all killed Jesus with our sin. Mel is not backing off anything. That is the heart of the Christian faith. Christ died to redeem humans from their sin. White, black, jew, arab etc...

Jesus Christ did not carry his cross. He was so beaten that he couldn't. A man named Aremaes or something like that got picked to carry it.

Matthew, Mark, and Luke tell of a man carrying Jesus's cross. John says that Jesus carries his own cross. The common thought is that Jesus carried it as far as he could and then this man was required to do so.