No Clapping, Dancing at Mass, Vatican to Warn

Reuters ^ | Tue, Sep 23, 2003 | Philip Pullella

[presidio9]

No dancing in the aisles or applause in church, please, we're Catholic. And we'd prefer altar boys to altar girls.

Those are some of the warnings contained in the draft of a document the Vatican (news - web sites) is preparing to crack down on what it considers "liturgical abuses" of the mass, the focus of Roman Catholic worship.

According to the authoritative Italian Roman Catholic monthly magazine "Jesus," a draft document urges the faithful to notify their bishop or the Vatican to report suspected abuses.

The magazine released an advance text of the article which will feature in its October edition.

If issued in its draft form, the document, known as a directive, could have wide-ranging ramifications on some worship practices that have come into common use in many developed countries, particularly the United States and in western Europe.

According to the magazine, the draft says the use of girl altar servers should be avoided "unless there is a just pastoral cause" and that "priests should never feel obliged to seek girls for this function."

The Vatican in 1994 gave individual bishops the power to decide whether to allow altar girls in their dioceses. But some conservative Catholics are against altar girls, saying their presence has eroded a traditional recruiting ground for priests.

Traditionalists have also seen altar girls as a foot in the door to a female priesthood, which the church bans.

Italian media reported that the initial reaction to the draft, circulated to the world's bishops, has been negative and the document may have to be at least partially modified.

The draft document also discourages applause during masses and "dances inside the sacred building."

Ironically, Pope John Paul (news - web sites)'s sermons during masses, even those in St Peter's Basilica, are often interrupted by applause.

Some of the pope's masses in Rome and around the world have included dancing, particularly those celebrations marking Asian, African or Latin American events.

The document, drafted by two Vatican departments which oversee doctrine and liturgy, was ordered by the pope who will eventually have to approve a final version.

The draft also warns against the use of non-Biblical language during the mass, such as readings from poets.

It discourages the practice where the faithful receive the wafer and wine at communion.

Catholics believe Christ is present in the wafer and wine but the document says it is preferable just to receive the wafer.

"Self-service" communion is also frowned upon. This appeared to be a reference to the faithful taking the consecrated host directly from the chalice instead of receiving it on their tongue from the hand of a priest.

[BlackElk]

When WILL Trautman reach 75 so that we can be rid of him too?

[Core_Conservative]

Oh my! The Catholic Church has such pressing issues - such as the possible break up from the American Catholic Church - and the lack of new priests - plus the forced retirement of other priests, that they now want to discipline priests for doing things that they have done for years. Clapping in mass for a wedding, a congratulations on an award, or other such things is common practice in my wifes parish. Also, if they did not allow alter girls (and recently female ushers) there would not be enough members to help the priest do his job - like reading the prayers, preparation of the gifts for communion, etc. Does the Vatican really have nothing better to do? Are they trying to Micro-Manage the entire world of Catholic Churches from Rome? I think they seem to be forcing a division of the church - and we really don't need another division - I'd rather see the coming together of churches - means the end would be getting closer.

[Protagoras]

cath·o·lic adj.

1. Of broad or liberal scope; comprehensive: "The 100-odd pages of formulas and constants are surely the most catholic to be found" (Scientific American).
2. Including or concerning all humankind; universal: "what was of catholic rather than national interest" (J.A. Froude).
3. Catholic. Abbr. C. a. Of or involving the Roman Catholic Church.

[Varda]

The mass is not a venue for entertainment. It should be focused on the sacrifice Jesus made that resulted in everlasting life for the bride of Christ. The clapping takes the focus off that.
If jumping around and shouting works for you,go for it but I have to say I haven't been impressed with the people I have known who attend Christian meetings with the express purpose of getting a "high". Their commitment to Christianity seems to last as long as the feelings.

[NYer]

Sounds as if a lot of the Psalms are thrown out here.

On the contrary, the Psalms are sung at Mass. This document is referring to liturgical dance, which has been banned in the US. That has not impeded certain bishops and pastors from ignoring the ban and allowing - even encouraging! - youth in the parish to perform the dance.

In the catholic church, we believe in the Real Presence of Jesus Christ in the Eucharist. At ALL TIMES, a candle burns next to the Tabernacle, a reminder to us of His presence amongst us. Here is why liturgical dance is banned in the this country.

5.3 Performing Liturgical Dance 

Dance is not allowed whatsoever. The document Dance In The Liturgy contains a full explanation. To summarize:

"[In western culture] dancing is tied with love, with diversion, with profaneness, with unbridling of the senses: such dancing, in general, is not pure."

"For that reason it cannot be introduced into liturgical celebrations of any kind whatever: that would be to inject into the liturgy one of the most desacralized and desacralizing elements; and so it would be equivalent to creating an atmosphere of profaneness which would easily recall to those present and to the participants in the celebration worldly places and situations."

The Bishops have expressly prohibited any and all forms of dancing in the Liturgy.

NATIONAL CONFERENCE OF CATHOLIC BISHOPS (BISHOPS' COMMITTEE on the LITURGY) NEWSLETTER.  APRIL/MAY 1982.

"FROM THESE DIRECTIVES, from the NATIONAL CONFERENCE of CATHOLIC BISHOPS, all dancing, (ballet, children's gesture as dancing, the clown liturgy) are not permitted to be 'introduced into liturgical celebrations of any kind whatever.'"

[Lost Highway]

I guess this means no Sister Act III.

[fml]

--Really, it's not that hard to dress decently even in the heat of summer.--


Look around - almost no one knows how to dress decently (at least modestly) these days. If I never see another belly-button, strangers thighs, chains and tight jeans in Church again I would be one happy parishoner.

[TxBec]

I feel honored to be the one "in charge" of my kids.

[My back yard]

women are 2nd-class citizens

Who says they are 2nd-class. Where does it suggest that unless they are let into the priesthood or the alter boys they are 2nd. They are just not boys. Boys and girls have different positions and duties in the church, as in life. Neither of them is more important than the other.

We're talking fundamental stuff here. It is time that the church offer the message that it is ok for girls to be girls and boys to be boys, and the best that they can be in their roles. It is ok for them to be mom's too, and not the breadwinner.

History is also full of great followers, without whom nothing of greatness is ever achievable. It is ok to be a follower, just be the best one you can possibly be.

The purpose to being a priest is doing service for Our Lord. A girl who wishes to circumvent the church in order to fulfill a personal need, rather than the needs of the church, is not of the proper mindset to serve. She serves herself. Just ask Mother Teresa.

I think one of the most evil things done to humanity is convincing them all that women in their roles are secondary.

[Aliska]

but 'womyn' are self-identified feminists

There's a reason they became feminists. Some of the reasons are negative but not all. One of the reasons is that they haven't felt loved or worthy. Men and society don't love them or respect their abilities so they react.

[irish_links]

".. I didnt read that as "No having fun in Church". Sorry. Not trying to be confrontational, just debate the fact that God wants us to sit quietly absent of outward joy of his presence...."

You may not understand that the Catholic Mass is fundamentally different from a Protestant worship service. The Mass is a sacrifice in which the priest offers the congregation's gifts of bread and wine to the Lord and such gifts are literally accepted (we hope) and tranfigured into the sacred Body and Blood of Christ. Catholics believe that Christ is physically present in the Eucharist, one of the fundamental mysteries of our faith.

This is all very serious business and not to be taken lightly. Thus, while clapping, dancing and histrionic individual demonstrations of faith are wholly appropriate in a worship service, they are not during the Sacrifice of the Mass or at any time in a Catholic Church when the Lord is physically present in the sanctuary.

There are times and places for histrionic displays of faith. I respect the faith and practice of Protestants who live out their faith in this way. But, the Mass isn't one of these times and a Catholic Church isn't one of these places.

[Protagoras]

The Life Teen masses are truly revolting. As the kids age, they will expect to be ENTERTAINED at Mass.....sad.

I disagree with your prediction. And I think if the church universal doesn't connect with their children, they will drift away. And I'm not talking about doing non scriptural things just to be popular.

[miss marmelstein]

No, they just rule the Church.

As for altar girls being reliable, the last time I saw one, she was running about the altar so much, the priest had to rebuke her. This, of course, was in between the congregation applauding itself, swaying to bad music and lining up in hordes to receive Holy Communion from a man in a light blue leisure suit. Yuck!

[Ann Archy]

You would rather spend ETERNITY without God because you read a stupid book about a nun kissing the steps a priest walked up? Man...you DO need that therapist!!! Think about what you have written.....REALLY. It's absurd.

[Skooz]

Thanks for your excellent post.

There is a time for demonstrations of exhilerating joy in God's presence.
And there is a time for quiet reverence in God's presence.
There is a time for loud displays of clapping and dancing to celebrate the Resurrection and eternal life.
There is a time for silent reflection on Christ's sacrifice.

[Desdemona]

Why are we whining about serving God? All work is for God. It doesn't matter who does it and frankly if a man is willing to cut the grass, I'll be happy to do his laundry. It beats having an asthma attack from the grass.

I happen to live in a family where the men, for many generations, were waited on hand and foot and to the women in my family it was a great joy because they were treated well. There was food on the table, there were roofs over heads, everyone had clothes. And the women were, and still are, the bedrock of the family. Where there are problems among all of us is where the roles started reversing.

I just don't get it. If you want to be treated well and like a lady, act like one. It brings out the best in men. At least, that's been my experience. That means no treading on their ground.

[smith288]

Strangly enough, our Southern Baptist church does practice Communion once a month.

[BlackElk]

If a woman is sooooo wedded to the standards of the world that equality (or what passes for equality) or ANYTHING else is more important that the Mass, the sacraments and the truth, then she has already apostasized and should recognize her apostasy by leaving until she conforms to the will of Christ as expressed through His Church. Equality lies in the fact that the same exact standard applies to men as well if any of them find ANYTHING more impotant than the Mass, the sacraments and the truth of the Church as described above.

Do not entertain yourself by supposing that fear has anything to do with it or ignorance (??????) or "overblown importance."

You last paragraph is a stew of paradoxes.

[TxBec]

I attended CCD in the late 70s/early 80s and I feel cheated. I was never taught ANYTHING about the real Presence..about our rich history/traditions..about what it really means to be Catholic....I was a cradle Catholic who just "went to Church now and then."

It took a divorce and completely drifting away to bring me to where I am now. I am homeschooling my kids and making sure that they are active in the Church and are learning more than the watered-down Catholicism that I learned.

[smith288]

Thank you for the very mature, intellectual, honest and understanding answer. Bless you.