Don’t Be a Liar

Elsie - while I agree with you (I think!!??), you are always so cryptic.

I suppose it's because I think way faster than I type; so a lot of the stuff that link the pieces together gets lost in the shuffle.

...which he hath built thereupon,...

And what do Catholics build upon?

Such have been "enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come," (Hebrews 6:4-5. KJV) and are accepted in the Beloved, and seated with Him in Heaven, and have immediate direct access into the holy of holies ijn Heaven to meet with God. (Eph. 1:6; 2:6; Heb. 10:19)

And such will be realize the full experience of their salvation if they "hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end." (Hebrews 3:6. KJV)

It looks like there is concurrence that "those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come," will only realize the full experience of their salvation upon persevering until their death or the Messiah's return.

Christians are saved but can fall away and be lost, per that reference to Hebrews.

Christians are saved but can fall away and be lost, per that reference to Hebrews.

I'll agree with the premise here.

After all THIS verse CLEARLY says your name CAN be removed from the BoL!!

Revelation 3:5
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Agree there will be different levels of punishment in hell, yet that was not the point. The one in charge, who mistreated others, would be cut in two and assigned his portion with unbelievers, and his infraction was the worst in the passage. Those with stripes were not assigned a portion with the unbelievers in the actual scriptural text. The point was, given the depth of agony of suffering in hell, whether there could be a relatively mild punishment (stripes) for relatively mild infractions then followed by utter agony for all eternity. That does not make sense. God is the God of mercy and justice.

Since the punishment is eternal it makes sense there are different levels of eternal punishment in hell, but not "few stripes." That leads to hell being but a punishment of "few stripes" for those who did not know the LORD's will and broke His laws, and "many stripes" for those that knew, but did not prepare and obey. Thus hell would not be torment and agony for those disciples who fell short, but something far less than that dependent on one's works while supposed to be on duty watching as it were.

For example, we read the various levels of punishment amongst the brethren (from minor punishment to danger of hell), a brother can go to some place of prison and yet be released after payment (and this is not about shekels):

Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee;
Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
Agree with thine adversary quickly, whiles thou art in the way with him; lest at any time the adversary deliver thee to the judge, and the judge deliver thee to the officer, and thou be cast into prison.
Verily I say unto thee, Thou shalt by no means come out thence, till thou hast paid the uttermost farthing.

Matthew, Catholic chapter five, Protestant verses seventeen to twenty six ,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

RVG Placemarker.

Wrong, for the context is future, and you can lose something that is yours to take if you fulfil the conditions, thus the warning "Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown." (Revelation 3:11. KJV) And as shown, fruit such as the Philippians were Paul's “joy and crown” (Phil. 4:1) but which crowns are not given until the Lord comes. But by your logic, no man could take their crown since they had not yet received it.

"which thou hast" is not in the future, and the crown of life does not sound like an optional reward, but the sign of eternal life, which goes back to the discussion of whether being saved is in the present or in the future.

Thus the suffering of loss refers to what he would have at the judgment, that just as fruit such as the Philippians would mean the obtaining of a reward, losing this work (which is also suffering loss) meant losing the reward.

Except that is not what the Messiah said when using that word for suffering loss all three times. Here is another example of the reference to not watching (same word as in Luke passage being discussed), and it sounds much more ominous than the loss of an optional reward.

Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Revelation, Catholic chapter three, Protestant verse three,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

You are being ignored as one vainly flailing against the obvious Like a man who has lost both legs and arms, you have nothing new (and crowns are given when the Lord returns) to even gain a foothold (which is all you try for) against the insurmountable wall of evidence against your argument Those who want to see why can can look, by the grace of God.

Its over. May God peradventure grant you “repentance to the acknowledging of the truth.” (2 Timothy 2:25)

You are being ignored as one vainly flailing against the obvious Like a man who has lost both legs and arms, ...

When the law is on your side, argue the law.
When the facts are on your side, argue the facts.
When neither the facts nor the law are on your side,
make an ad hominem attack.
-- Old Adage

The demeanor of the poster says more about his own confession than the post says about yours. When he is being rude or mean it drives people away from his confession and towards yours. That is of course if you can resist the urge to meet fire with fire, in which case neither confession is appealing to the lurkers. The poster who “turns the other cheek” wins every single time.

If the other guy is throwing spitwads at you on an “open” thread it probably means he has run out of ammunition. Take it as a backhanded compliment. You won, walk away.

x

Didn’t you mean a RVG placemaker? 😁☝️

Yes, ... or did I????