Posted on 06/23/2018 7:48:28 AM PDT by Salvation
I’ve been on vacation camping and working off an iPad with slow to no internet service.
Sorry for the delay in answering. The long and short is that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of heaven.
Our glorified heavenly bodies are not the same substance as our eathly bodies. Our earthly bodies can not survive outside of a very narrow range of parameters.
If you are saying that Jesus was not raised from the dead in His incarnate body, which would include His blood, then you are preaching antiChrist statements.
Of course His blood was RESURRECTED with His body: "Life is in the blood"
And, of course His blood was shed, once and for all, on the Cross prior to His resurrection.
For you to deny that Christ was resurrected in the flesh (i.e. with blood running through His veins) is to take some weird Mormon antiChrist point of view that Jesus was a Spirit when He was Resurrected, and not flesh and bone
(and blood... for blood is created in our bones!)
Luke 24: 39
"See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.”
Why would you assume I don't. I do.
Why have someone else ask for you?
I have others ask with me.
Do you not think that God would answer you Himself?
Indeed, he does.
And yes, I do have "good luck" (but it is not really statistical with God). I get answers to every petition that I make on the basis of His Word. He hears me when I'm right with Him, and His answers are either "Yes," "No," "Maybe," or "You're not listening. Pay attention." But He always hears when my slate is clean (1 John 1:9). He is there, and He is not silent. I don't make too many demands. I ask for His Will to come to pass. When that happens, there is no question about the outcome.
The Devil also often answers, but pretty much I have been able to discern the difference, and not respond to His blandishments.
"For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world" (1 Jn. 2:16 AV).
If its these things you pray for, and get them, you can know it is not God who is giving them. A lot of people don't, and mis-attribute the source.
I think the issue isn't whether he was resurrected - and that this was a *miracle, meaning no blood necessarily required* - He is now in His *glorified* body, having ascended to the Father.
"See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.”
No mention of blood...
.....
This seems to be a discussion of an issue that doesn't bring salvation - especially to people in denominations that have never heard the Gospel of Grace, but are trapped in rituals and a hamster wheel of guilt and false works.
Clearly, you don't.
I get answers to every petition that I make on the basis of His Word. He hears me when I'm right with Him, and His answers are either "Yes," "No," "Maybe," or "You're not listening. Pay attention." But He always hears when my slate is clean (1 John 1:9). He is there, and He is not silent. I don't make too many demands. I ask for His Will to come to pass. When that happens, there is no question about the outcome.
That's good to hear, finally.
Dear aMorePerfectUnion: I just composed this for metmom when I saw your post, but it distinguishes “flesh and bone” from how Christ used the term “flesh and blood” in a way to answer your last:
The NAR loves to preach on glorified bodies; can’t recall it all but it has to do with their Manifest Sons Of God nonsense.
Same as how Rick Joyner preached that Jesus died on the cross as a spirit.
Anti Christ teachings!
Jesus’ blood was shed on the Cross once and for all, the Lamb of God. Yet He was also resurrected in His full flesh and bone body, and like Lazarus, ate meals.
“See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.”
Luke 24:39
Christ’s ascension, just as Elijah’s rapture, was in their flesh and bone bodies.
The contrasting idea that “flesh and blood” (as opposed to “flesh and bone”) cannot enter the Kingdom of Heaven has to do with the sufficiency of works done in the Spirit:
“Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven.:...
(I leave you that scriptural tagline to get back to the problems of Catholicism...)
P.S. Jesus’ blood was shed on the Cross, but to deny that He again had blood running through His veins after the Resurrection is an anti-Christ position.
If He was not fully resurrected as a flesh and bone (including blood) man, then He was not truly resurrected.
Was Lazarus’ blood in his body when he was resurrected? Yes. Of course. That’s why the Pharisees were so upset when Jesus ate with him at his house the night before entering into Jerusalem... so upset that they plotted to kill Lazarus again! (LOL)
Jesus was resurrected in His full human body. With blood running through His veins. Anything less is from the evil one; and any idea that His resurrected body with blood somehow detracts from the finality of His shed blood on the cross is also from the evil one.
Some have posited that it was in fact the sudden appearance of that Glory which left the imprint upon the Shroud of Turin, as the Spirit radiated LIFE from a point within the body in the tomb. There is a very small but dynamic proof for this, that the source of radiant energy emitted from a point within the body of the tomb sequester Jesus. Would you like to know what that proof is?... And it's Science!
“P.S. Jesus’ blood was shed on the Cross, but to deny that He again had blood running through His veins after the Resurrection is an anti-Christ position.“
This is simply an assertion you are making, without evidence. Do you have any?
Beyond this, do you believe Christ today, in His glorified body, has blood? If so, why is this important and what do you base it on?
“There is a very small but dynamic proof for this, that the source of radiant energy emitted from a point within the body of the tomb sequester Jesus.”
I read a bunch from some nuclear physicist gal that examined the Shroud. She posited that it was an event like a mini “Big Bang”. I think something in the shroud image shows that it wasn’t weighted laying down on the body, and the body wasn’t laying on the shroud. Everything was suspended in air. She had some explanation about that - something like “In a singularity there is no gravity”.
I don’t know - it isn’t critical to my faith - but it sure is interesting.
It wouldn’t surprise me that a God that can speak everything into existence with a Word out of nothing (like the “Big Bang” theory suggests) - something as “simple” as a person can be brought back to life with a mini bang.
The image on the shroud is much like a photographic positive. Half of the shroud has the back of Jesus and the other half has the front of Jesus. Careful examination of the material shows no partial image of the front on the back and no partial image of the back on the front. If the energy source were from front or back there would be evidence of both perspectives in both surfaces of the cloth, but none is there! The source of the energy had to come from inside and radiate outward in all directions, leaving the images of front and back on the two surfaces without impinging upon either, as in a double exposure, etc.
That inner spark will 'resonate' with the voice and the Trump of God to transform us in a moment. Those who have died in Christ across the centuries will be given bodies again and their human soul/spirit bacj into that body to resonate also. For those who have died in Christ will GOD bring with Him as He descends from Heaven to the air around the earth. The souls with 'sparky spirits' will be shot into resurrected bodies, then transformed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye. It is that 'rain of souls' which most writers on the Rapture fail to notice.
Jesus dispelled the myth that He was a ghost or in a glorified body at the Resurrection:
"Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.” - Luke 24:39
I swallowed the Shroud of Turin Kool-aid for a while, like you, until I realized how long we have been hoaxed by other centuries-old masonic Jesuit type hoaxes, this was just a camera-obscura experiment.
Carbon dating in the Shroud also proves nothing.
But the bigger problem with the Shroud is that it was not mentioned in God's Word... His gravecloths were mentioned but not some radiation image.
Which means God does not want us to rely upon extra-Biblical proofs (or hoaxes, no matter how well-meaning) to verify all the built-in proofs of the Word. His Word is sufficient. And Eternal.
You overlook that he same power that raised Lazarus from the dead raised Christ from the dead.
Why wasn't there a radiation burst with Lazarus - or one noted on his grave cloths? Why wasn't there a radiation burst with Tabitha's resurrection?
I only take the time to ask you these questions to shake you out of your misconception about the Resurrection.
Christ was fully man when He died and fully man when He was resurrected, otherwise, there would be no point!
For Christ in His Godhood to have died and to be raised in His Godhood, there is no propitiation of sin.
That is the most solemn criticism of your extra-biblical imaginings you can get.
Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
The reason Luke and the other gospels mention how many times Jesus and Lazarus ate food was to prove they were fully resurrected in their flesh/blood/bone bodies.
Your beliefs negate the totality of the miracle of the Resurrection, because you imply that Christ was not really raised from the dead in His incarnate body, but as a Spirit.
Jesus's own words about this indict you of a serious error. Please reconsider how Christ's words "I am flesh and bone, NOT A SPIRIT" tie into John's admonitions about the spirit of Anti Christ...denying that Christ is come in the flesh and RAISED IN THAT SAME FLESH.
Not a glorified body.
Finally, you don't need to add anything to the Gospel about the Shroud as an extra-biblical "sign and wonder".
God does not need a sign and a wonder hoax with the Shroud of Turin to evidence the most important miracle at the apex of all history: the Resurrection.
P.S. Remember Mormons don't believe Jesus was raised in the flesh/blood/bone either. This clues you in as to how important this topic is to the Lord.
I forgot to ping you: see post 754 https://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3665509/posts?page=754#754
One more time, Jesus after the Resurrection was not a ghost or a Spirit or in a glorified body.
You are arguing with Christ Himself, not me, if you believe this heresy.
Not sure how many times one can quote John or Jesus without getting through to people that call themselves Christians?
It’s not very difficult. Jesus was crucified and died in as a MAN. In the flesh.
He was similarly resurrected as a MAN, In the flesh. With blood coursing through His veins.
His digestive system was working because He had blood in His body helping with digestion of the food Jesus was eating. Luke the Physician took special note of this fact.
If Christ did not die as a man in a human body, and was not raised from the dead in that same human body, then there is no point to Christianity, and we are all dead in our sins.
As to a glorified body, or spirit, Jesus Himself says that it is NOT MADE OF FLESH AND BONE. And since blood is created in the bone marrow, Jesus does not have blood running through His flesh or bones because His glorified body is a SPIRIT.
You know, the Lord wrote the Word to be simple. And understandable. And the Word interprets itself. If you have a question about one portion of scripture, you look up the word or phrase in another part to understand what God means. (Just as I did in my previous post by comparing the usage of the phrase “flesh and blood” with “flesh and bone” because their meanings and usages are different and revealing to this discussion.)
So we enter into the Kingdom with childlike faith, not a tortured, twisted arcane understanding of vaunted elitist, extra special extra Biblical belief.
Jesus was crucified in the flesh, He is come in the flesh and was therefore raised in the Flesh...
JUST AS HE SAID.
Why is there so much discussion about this very important but simple matter by men and women I know on FR who are good Christians?
It’s so weird. Please beware deception and false teachings. And GBU
Wrong suppositions.
>> Of course His blood was RESURRECTED with His body: "Life is in the blood" <<
True only for the mortal body, not the immortal one.
>> And, of course His blood was shed, once and for all, on the Cross prior to His resurrection. <<
True, It was shed, gone, not stuffed back in the resurrected body, but presented in Heaven as the price for discharging the sin debt of mankind. Being incorruptible originally, now present and alive, uncoagulated on the Mercy Seat, before The Father.
>> For you to deny that Christ was resurrected in the flesh (i.e. with blood running through His veins)unprovable is to take some weird Mormon antiChrist point of view that Jesus was a Spirit when He was Resurrected, and not flesh and bone <<
Wrong assumptions again, saying what I did not say, meaning what I did not mean, and twisting my doctrine. What Jesus was showing was that He was not an evanescent, immaterial, bodiless entity like a hologram or projector image, but a dimensional human body of flesh, bones, and motivating spirit, able to go through walls and take other human form (Mk. 16:2; Lk. 24:16;, Rev. 3:13-16, 5:6, 19:12).
>> (and blood... for blood is created in our bones!) <<
Only in the mortal body; not in the immortal body, AFIK, where life is in the Spirit.
=====
All your theories here are unsupported imaginations and false.
For The Christ, The First-begotten from the dead ones, life is in the spirit, not in the blood.
"Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have" (Lk. 24:39 AV).
Jesus has a body of flesh and bones, not flesh and blood.
He was raised from out of the dead ones, and as the first resurrected human, He was changed, as His servants will be:
1 Cor. 15:52,53 AV:
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump:
for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible,
and we shall be changed. 53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality"
It will be a changed flesh body, with all the normal appendages and healthy, but the flesh will be incorruptible, with no blood necessary. In it, the Spirit gives life, as it did of Jesus, both man and Deity. But the flesh and bones is a vehicle with humanoid operation, but without blood, for we shall be like Him:
1 John 3:2 AV:
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be:
but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
We will also have flesh and bone like His, with life in the Spirit, not in blood any longer.
"It is the spirit that quickenethgives life; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life" (Jn. 6:63 AV).
Where did the blood come from (if there was any) in Jesus resurrected body?
Lazarus came out of the crypt in a mortal body. He was not "resurrected" into an immortal body. It was Jesus who was the first-begotten out of the dead (ones). So, however this happened, Lazarus had to suffer a physical death again.
"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstbornfrom the dead among many brethren" (Rom. 8:29 AV).
"And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; . . ." (Col. 1:18 AV).
"And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten ofek=out of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, . . ." (Rev. 1:5 AV).
"Firstborn" (πρωτοτοκος proh-to-to-kos) means first in time as well as first in place.
Anything less is from the evil one; and any idea that His resurrected body with blood somehow detracts from the finality of His shed blood on the cross is also from the evil one.
What detracts from the finality His shed blood is the (erroneous) concept that somehow He got more blood that was unshed. There is nothing anyplace in the Bible that ever says that His resurrected body was mortal with blood in it, rather than an immortal body without blood, where life is in the Spirit. Flesh, yes. Bone, yes. Blood, no.
Here you go. You cannot back out of your Anti Christ error now:
Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.
FLESH: Strong's G4561 -- Flesh (the soft substance of the living body, which covers the bones and is permeated with blood) of both man and beasts
Jesus was NOT resurrected into an "immortal body" because that would be a SPIRIT...
His FLESH did not suffer corruption at the Resurrection.
So what are you talking about?
Jesus walked through walls by the same power of the Holy Spirit that transported Phillip miles and miles away, and they both had these miracles in their flesh and bone (i.e. with BLOOD) in their bodies.
How would Jesus digest food, if He had no blood to give life to His flesh, to transport nutrients to the body and marrow in the bone?
Why did Jesus ask for food when He was hungry in Luke? To evidence the miracle of His resurrection, that He still was in His carnate (flesh and blood and bone) body.
You are just wrong.
... His soul was not left in hell, neither His flesh did see corruption.
Christ's flesh did not see corruption at the Resurrection, because He was resurrected in His incarnate body of FLESH (BLOOD AND BONE).
And you preach a damnable heresy, that Christ was resurrected into an immortal body, which is antiChrist, which discredits the Resurrection
You negate the miracle of the resurrection by preaching He had a glorified/immortal/superspiritual body without any blood in it... this is antChrist...
And why does your theory negate the Resurrection? Because you infer that Christ's sufferings on the Cross and Resurrection were somehow less human because of His Divinity. This diminishes the miracle of it. Christ died in His full humanity as a man, and was raised in His full humanity as a man.
Otherwise, there is no propitiation for our sins!
Otherwise, there is no miracle of the incarnation!
Otherwise, there you are saying Christ was not fully human!
Otherwise, there is no SACRIFICE in what Christ did, because it didn't really hurt, He didn't really suffer as a man, because it all happened because He was God.
You are preaching Anti Christ.
Get thee behind me, Satan.
Whatcha gonna do if you died in a fire and your body and bones were consumed by it? Huh? Will you be resurrected? If so, where's your body gonna come from? what will it be made of?
The real "you" is your soul and spirit. Your body is/was just a continually changing vehicle that finally wears out, if it isn't killed before a natural death occurs. If God provided your soul and spirit with another, better, non-aging, totally satisfying vehicle without blood, kind of like Robocop, would you have a temper tantrum and demand that it be given blood? Huh?
What is your problem here? Because Jesus ate honey and fish doesn't mean you know how the ingested stuff was processed. You don't, so please don't insist that you have any idea of what a resurrected body is like, until when/if you get one.
I'm going for the Terminator model, myself. /sarc
even after only about 48 hours after a spear opened his side and poked through to break the pericardial sac, penetrate his heart, and release the blood and edema, His open wounds were not bleeding, and they were not healed. My belief is that He will look the same in Heaven, so everyone can always know it is Him, not just some substitute filling in when He wants to sleep or go somewhere else. I also believe that everyone else will have a fine, perfect, unwounded, body so that we can tell who is NOT Him.
What I do know is that His resurrected body could not have supported blood circulation. If it could, explain to me with Bible verses--not just your own imaginations--how there could have been circulating blood in His body.
If you can't explain that, I'm not going to give you any more of my precious time.
In the meantime, work on your logic circuits. They are not working.
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