Can Pastors Have a Beer?

Christian Post ^ | 08/07/2017 | Shane Idleman

[SeekAndFind]

A few years ago, I attended a conference where pastors were encouraged to meet at a pub after the general sessions. A few of these pastors could exercise their liberty, but why publicly? I wondered how many people at the conference stumbled because of it.

The demands of life often tempt us to seek gratification in alcohol and other things. We must be on high alert. The enemy uses "opportune times" to draw us away from God. (cf. Luke 4:13.) The line is so thin that it is often hard to determine when we cross over.

The person who consumes alcohol walks a very fine line between freedom and sin, responsibility and carelessness, liberty and abuse — over-indulgence can even disqualify a person from leadership (cf. 1 Timothy 3). This discussion is not about a glass of wine or beer now and then, it's about abusing liberty. Damage done to families and individuals through alcohol use demands a closer look.

Pastor John MacArthur states what many of us feel but seldom discuss, "It is puerile and irresponsible for any pastor to encourage the recreational use of intoxicants — especially in church-sponsored activities. The ravages of alcoholism and drug abuse in our culture are too well known, and no symbol of sin's bondage is more seductive or more oppressive than booze."

I couldn't agree more. The trend of young Christian leaders consuming alcohol on a regular basis is alarming. Many will look back and regret the damage that was done to lives, churches, and their own testimony.

Pastor Darrin Patrick, in his book Church Planter, writes, "I am shocked at the number of them [pastors] who are either addicted or headed toward addiction to alcohol."

David Wilkerson adds, "Alcohol is now the modern golden calf, and millions of people, young and old, male and female, have been seduced by it."

Many counseling appointments are because of alcohol and drug abuse. Add to that the amount of domestic violence cases and the number of abused children because of alcohol, and we would be remiss to ignore its dangers.

We often flaunt liberty and laugh in the face of God's grace by posting our favorite beer brands and wines on Facebook, all under the guise of "exercising liberty." While Romans 14 discusses personal freedoms, it also has strong warnings "not to do anything that will cause others to fall" (vs. 21).

Consider the following:

* Jesus was filled with the Spirit ... holiness flowed from every area of His life. This cannot be said of those who consume alcohol regularly. What is the fruit of today's preoccupation with alcohol? Conversations often turn away from God, if they were there to begin with. We begin to compromise our time and interests; we'd rather head to Vegas than a prayer meeting. Jesus said that "wisdom is justified by her children" (cf. Luke 7:35). Carnal Christians consume alcohol regularly. The harmful fruit that results from a lifestyle focused on alcohol is proof enough.

* The Bible never encourages crossing the line. A preoccupation with alcohol is just one indicator of alcoholism; a preoccupation with drinking at events or social gatherings is another. Some even bring out their private collection of hard liquor after having a few drinks. This is not liberty; it's addiction.

* We assume that the alcohol content today is the same as in Jesus' day. In His day, a little water was often placed into the wine and thus decreased the alcohol content (cf. 1 Timothy 5:23) ... much like an O'douls today. "Strong drink" were drinks with higher alcohol content that led to drunkenness. Craft beer, for example, often has two times more alcohol than mass-produced beer. Those having two pints of craft beer may have the equivalent of five regular beers.

* "Jesus ate and drank with sinners." "But there is no suggestion in Scripture that Jesus purposely assumed the look and lifestyle of a publican in order to gain acceptance..." (John MacArthur). We should fellowship without engaging in the practices of a secular lifestyle. The world will know that we are Christians by our love and by our convictions, not by how well we imitate the world around us. We seldom hear non-Christians say, "I'm turned off by Christians because they seldom compromise." But we do hear, "Christians who say one thing and do another really turn me off." "Be not among winebibbers ..." (Proverbs 23:20).

* Drinking often is now called liberty instead of addiction. Many Christians center everything around alcohol — fellowship, events, birthdays, bible studies, etc. When alcohol is the center of attention, it becomes an idol and an addiction. This is why many will be offended by this article.

* In Jesus' day, society was much more isolated. We cannot calculate how many people are affected by today's social media. A person with 500 "friends" may be encouraging dozens to stumble. It is the selfless motivation of love that keeps us from causing others to stumble (cf. Romans 14).

1 Peter 2:16 reminds us that many use liberty to hide sin: "A cloak for vice," and Galatians 5:13 says we should not "use our freedom to indulge the flesh." If these points raise concerns, I encourage honest repentance. Its often not "if" alcohol consumption causes damage but "when." Why would we willingly walk into the enemy's camp?​

God does not want us to be enslaved to anything. It is important that we take an account of our lives and see if this area has a hold on us. Be honest. How much do you drink? Is it really one drink now and then, or is it throughout the week? Is it a large goblet that holds ¾ of a bottle of wine and do you fill it twice?

Do you make excuses in order to exceed moderation and plan activities around alcohol? Do others comment on your drinking? Do you often argue and try to justify your position? Paul said that even though we have freedom, not everything is good for us. We should not become a slave to anything (cf. 1 Corinthians 6:12). It's time to break free from this flawed liberty.​

- Shane Idleman is the founder and lead pastor of Westside Christian Fellowship in Lancaster, California, just North of Los Angeles

[T. P. Pole]

While I agree with this, mostly, I have to ask the obvious question - what was Jesus’ first recorded miracle? And what was the quality of the miracle?

[Gman]

In answer to the original question: yes.

[ObozoMustGo2012]

While I find responsible imbibing to be ok (Jesus DID drink wine), I agree that letting it get out of control skirts the issue to if a member of clergy can carry out their function as a faith leader, if their minds are clouded by alcohol.

[pharmacopeia]

Is this attitude about alcohol common in Protestant circles? Is tee-totaling or something very like it expected of evangelicals?

[robroys woman]

Paul is pretty clear about alcohol consumption in Romans. If you are drinking in front of a weaker brother that thinks it’s a sin, then you should not do it.

However, he says the same thing about eating meat.

So, weaker brothers leave us unable to live in freedom, though we can. Paul says it is permissible, but not always profitable.

So I do my drinking at home or when around non-believers. And being in a band that sometimes plays in bars, I may be in a bar but not drinking alcohol. Go where the sinners are. I have some very good discussions in some of those bars.

[robroys woman]

We assume that the alcohol content today is the same as in Jesus’ day. In His day, a little water was often placed into the wine and thus decreased the alcohol content (cf. 1 Timothy 5:23) ... much like an O’douls today.

---

Pure baloney.

I left one of the baptist churches where I currently live because of the insistence of clinging to such tripe.

[robroys woman]

Beat me to it. There is a message there.

[Gamecock]

elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient. Since an overseer is entrusted with God’s work, he must be blameless – not overbearing, not quick-tempered, not given to drunkenness, not violent, not pursuing dishonest gain. Rather, he must be hospitable, one who loves what is good, who is self-controlled, upright, holy and disciplined. He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it.
Titus 1:6-9

The issue is getting drunk, not having a drink.

[DFG]

There are three truths in life:
Jewish people do not recognize Jesus as the Messiah.
Protestants do not recognize the Pope as the leader
of the Christian faith.
Baptists do not recognize each other in the liquor store.

[robroys woman]

I moved to a dry county about six years ago. It is also the bible belt. Whenever someone says that drinking alcohol is a sin I say, “Are you mormon, or is it muslim?”

That gets the conversation started nicely.

[petro45acp]

Ephesians 5:17-20

18 ...and be ye not drunk with wine wherein is dissipation...

It’s about volition, appreciation, and responsibility.

.02
YMMV
KYPD

[Gamecock]

I can just hear them at the wedding feast: “Wow Jesus! This is the best watered down wine I have ever had!”

[Fai Mao]

“Is this attitude about alcohol common in Protestant circles? Is tee-totaling or something very like it expected of evangelicals?”

Yeah, Baptist think it leads to dancing and Pentecostals are afraid that a drunk might understand what they’re saying.

As to causing people to “stumble” there is a difference between stumbling and triggering a bout of self-righteousness.

When I lived in China even the Baptist missionaries drank beer because the water wasn’t safe.

[robroys woman]

In my Assembly of God church that was pretty much tea totalling, one day the pastor was reading scripture on a subject that had nothing to do with alcohol, though in it there was a mention of drinking wine as a thing people do and is ok (I forget the scripture). In front of a congregation of about 800, the pastor closed the bible on his finger and said something like, “The greek word there means fermented wine, not grape juice.”

I commended him for his honesty.

I confess that, since becoming a Christian in 1981, I’ve never, EVER found a single scripture to support complete abstinance regarding alcohol. I did go alcohol free for about two years shortly after becoming a Christian because I was the drunkest guy at a party and, I believe, the only professing Christian there. I was seriously ashamed of that.

[ctdonath2]

“Consider the following:”

Yes, lets.

- Christ’s first public miracle was creating wine for the more inebriated end of a party.

- Christ, and Scripture in general, frequently uses wine and the production thereof as positive analogies/metaphors for spirituality.

- The prescribed sacrament of Communion has wine as a central element. (Having grown up with grape juice as an element, and switched to real wine as element shortly after giving up being a teetotaler, I can assure you there is an objective difference in the experience of partaking.)

- As weak as the wine in question allegedly was, it was still wine; being a critical source of disease-free water, consumption surely was at volumes that more than made up for the low alcohol ratio.

- On that note, as weak as daily wine may have been, that produced in the miracle was surely “high octane stuff” - otherwise those imbibing it would not have expressed such positive reviews thereof.

We get it.
Don’t get drunk - that leads to sin.
But in downplaying the value of alcoholic beverages, don’t be so darned cherry-picking about it: Scripture is loaded with analogies, metaphors, parables, and outright recommendation & expectation of consuming alcohol in moderation (to wit 1-3 oz ethanol per day). Don’t get carried away with bashing that which God Himself made for us to enjoy.

[Seruzawa]

Why don’t you invite a Mormon to go fishing? He’ll drink all the beer.

How do you keep the Mormon from drinking all the beer? Invite another Mormon.

[Bob434]

exactly- a little known fact- the wine Jesus created was of the best kind- not the cheaper variety that hosts usually give their guests once they become too drunk to care about the quality- Jesus could have created cheap wine- but apparently He didn’t accordign to those who have studied the miracle-

[Fantasywriter]

Methodists tee-total proudly for the most part. To see a notable exception—Hillary. Many Baptists take a dim view of alcohol. Some fundamentalist groups absolutely eschew it.

Lutherans and Episcopalians are fine with alcohol. There may be a little friendly competition as to which group serves the better wine at communion.

Evangelicals tend to be more accepting than not of social alcoholic consumption. I have yet to see the evangelical church that served wine with communion, though. They may exist, but in my experience it’s been grape juice.

[dfwgator]

I’ve heard that joke, but substituting “Baptist” for “Mormon.”