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How to Think About Luther?
Crisis Magazine ^ | July 12, 2017 | James Kalb

Posted on 07/12/2017 4:52:31 PM PDT by ebb tide

How to Think About Luther?

James Kalb

Traditionally, Catholics have viewed Luther as a heresiarch, and the Lutheran break from Rome as a religious and civilizational catastrophe. More recently, in line with current ecumenical and pastoral initiatives, that view has softened.

The softening has been quite noticeable during the current pontificate. The pope recently took part in a joint liturgy with the Church of Sweden to commemorate the five hundredth anniversary of Luther’s rebellion. He has also suggested informally that a Lutheran married to a Catholic might legitimately decide to receive communion from a Catholic priest, and that disputes between Catholics and Lutherans over the doctrine of justification, the basic point at issue in Luther’s split with Rome, are now a thing of the past.

More generally, some papal language regarding law and mercy suggests movement away from the Catholic view that grace enables us to overcome our sins toward Luther’s view that it simply frees us from their consequences. Examples include the comment in Amoris Laetitia that

conscience can … recognize with sincerity and honesty what for now is the most generous response which can be given to God, and come to see with a certain moral security that it is what God himself is asking … while yet not fully the objective ideal.

So if you think it’s all you can do, that’s probably all God is looking for. Luther’s pecca fortiter, “sin boldly,” was based on a similar line of thought.

Are these moves in the right direction? The Church is hierarchical, and it is the pope and other clergy who are charged with teaching doctrine and determining appropriate pastoral and ecumenical efforts. Even so, laymen can hardly avoid forming their own views, and many Catholics find that recent ecumenical efforts have done more harm than good, as has a tendency to confuse “pastoral” with “accepting that people do whatever they do.”

Laymen have the right and even obligation to present these concerns. The issues matter a great deal, and not simply for churchly reasons. Our secular authorities are convinced they have the solution to all social and political problems, at least in principle, and can put it into effect through a global managed system that recognizes nothing human outside it, no authoritative God above it, no enduring human nature beneath it, and no significant history behind it other than the history of its own coming into being. Everything is a social construction, and they will do the constructing.

The project is unfounded, overreaching, and destructive, and Catholics should oppose it. But the ecumenical and interfaith movements, along with proposals for loosening sacramental discipline to accept common practices in the name of “accompaniment,” support it by sidelining specific religious principle. They turn it into something like the British monarchy, which lends historical depth and dignity to a modern utilitarian bureaucracy but does not affect its substance. So those who view current political and social trends as anti-Catholic and anti-human have an additional reason for concern regarding ecumenical and pastoral tendencies in the Church that support them.

Concern regarding the changing Catholic attitude toward Luther is all the more justified because he’s the man who initiated the Protestant split from Rome, a fundamental event in the emergence of the modern world, and a variety of liberal and radical movements have claimed him as an inspiration. So if we are troubled by the trend toward a global society organized through and through on wholly secular and increasingly intolerant principles, and want to understand where the trend comes from, we should know something about his thought and deeds and their consequences.

A recently published collection of essays put out by the Roman Forum, an organization founded by Dietrich von Hildebrand, can help. Luther and His Progeny: 500 Years of Protestantism & Its Consequences for Church, State, and Society includes pieces by a dozen European and American scholars of varying backgrounds, each with his own outlook and concerns, but all troubled by the man, the movement he launched, and current efforts to enlist them, along with Catholicism, in a grand scheme of political, social, and religious unification. Each essay is independent of the others, but collectively they cover the basic issues that led Luther to reject the Church, as well as the effects of his rebellion on European thought and society.

Taken together they present the picture of a revolution in religion, politics, law, ethics, economics, and even the natural sciences, the effects of which profoundly shape our present world. At bottom, what seems to have led Luther to break with Rome was his overwhelming sense of guilt over his inability to keep the moral law. He was in a mess, and the Catholic road of humility, penitence, forgiveness, sacrament, grace, and sanctification didn’t seem to be working for him, so he decided that the world itself is one huge irreversible mess. Man is totally depraved, reason a snare, free will an illusion, and the Church can do nothing and so is fundamentally useless. To make matters worse, God himself is willful, incomprehensible, and even self-contradictory, since he is good but makes man incapable of anything but evil.

Under such circumstances what do we do, if it makes sense to ask the question when we have no inclination or ability to think or choose rightly? Basically, Luther’s answer was to rely wholly on the mercy of Christ, who might—or might not—choose to cover up our sins and accept us as justified even though we would inevitably remain as corrupt as ever.

These are not reasonable views. How, for example, is a God worthy of love, worship, and trust who condemns to eternal torment sinners he made incapable of acting otherwise, but then arbitrarily chooses some, who are no better than the others, for forgiveness and eternal bliss? The best that can be done for such views intellectually, one of the essayists suggests, is to view them as a precursor of German idealism, which treats contradiction as fundamental to reality and its dialectical resolution as the basis of the self-construction of the Absolute. At the transcendent level that means, as Luther put it, that “God must first become the devil before he becomes God.” And at the human level, it means faith goes through radically different stages, with the transitions involving overwhelming temptations to unbelief and blasphemy, and ultimate resolution not possible in this world.

Some people think that sort of explanation makes sense, others don’t. A more psychological and likely more comprehensible approach that some have recently proposed is to portray him as a “mystic of mercy,” overwhelmed by the infinitude of divine grace, whose words cannot be taken literally. (Muslims take the same approach with their own mystics, whose words are rarely compatible with orthodox Islam.)

That approach may explain something of the man, but not the movement he started: people don’t look to the incoherent outbursts of mystics for practical tips on the reform of Church, State, and doctrine, but that’s exactly what Luther offered, and what people took from him.

The specifics are complicated. His thought wasn’t coherent, so people took from it what suited them. At bottom, though, denying the practical effectiveness of religion tended strongly to liberate secular affairs from religious concerns, and destroy the authority and the sacramental structure of the Church. And that, it appears, was the reason for the success of his rebellion. By insisting on the irrelevance of divine law to what men actually do, Luther enabled secular powers to shake off the authority of the Church, set themselves up as absolute within their domains, and incidentally enrich themselves and their supporters with the property that an ineffectual Church could no longer justify possessing.

All of which remains relevant today. Secular authorities still don’t like religious limitations, so if a contemporary religious leader wants to exchange scorn for adulation, all he has to do is ignore distinctions, loosen restrictions, and proclaim mercy without penitence or emendation of life. Neither talent, virtue, nor rational coherence is needed, only a willingness to go along in order to get along. And there are many high-ranking churchmen who are eager to accept the deal.

Editor’s note: Pictured above is Pope Francis with the General Secretary of the Lutheran World Federation Rev. Martin Junge (right) and the President of the Lutheran World Federation Bishop Munib Younan (far left) attending an ecumenical prayer service at the Lutheran cathedral in Lund, Sweden, Oct. 31. (Photo credit: CNS photo/Paul Haring)



TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Mainline Protestant; Religion & Politics
KEYWORDS: bergoglio; luther
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To: ebb tide
It's printed in green.
341 posted on 07/14/2017 6:08:28 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Mark17
 
GPS stuff was a mere gleam in the eye of scientitists back in the 60's.
 
I merely had to deal with the diurnal shift in the ionosphere with the time delay/advance of the WWVB longwave timing signal.

342 posted on 07/14/2017 6:17:56 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: af_vet_1981

I can’t say much about the King, but I can refer folks to the Mayor!

https://moabcity.org/index.aspx?NID=184


343 posted on 07/14/2017 6:20:11 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: Elsie; Tennessee Nana

Halfway there!


344 posted on 07/14/2017 6:21:08 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: boatbums
>>There really is no reason why anyone is ignorant about it today

You on FR back in 1983 were ya?  Concordia Seward was a small campus.  If the subject had been in the curriculum - students would've talked about it.

Which part of "it wasn't in the curriculum" are you having trouble comprehending?

>>There really is no reason why anyone is ignorant about it today especially with the invention of the Internet 

Unless you happen to bring it up on the LCMS' Facebook Page... where they've ICONified Luther into representing the reformation and will block people who bring it up.

I don't seem to recall Jefferson's Virginia Act being part of LCMS curriculum either.

Evidently that whole "Truth is Great and will prevail" idea isn't too popular in Saint LouISIS these days.

>>Look, I really have no desire to continue on

Please provide a link to where I said everything Luther taught should be excluded?

The problem is ALL of what he “contributed” should be included along with the material the LCMS has indoctrinated children to regurgitate.

Its kinda like iconifying the Beach Boys without acknowledging the reality of how Brian Wilson went insane in the context of dropping acid while hosting the Charlie and the Manson Family as house guests.

Oops!

>>You won’t be able to convince me to stop admiring the many wonderful contributions Luther

Great, put him on a stamp then and ignore the wonderful contributions he made in the minds of whoever wrote Mein Kampf too while you’re at it.


345 posted on 07/14/2017 6:35:24 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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To: Mark17; metmom

>>I didn't get deep enough into GPS criteria, to know if earth curvature affected GPS arrival procedures.

The time dilation predicted by Special and General Relativity is an observable fact - engineered into practical examples like GPS and observable throughout the universe in association with various phenomena.

But that won't prevent metmom and her cohorts from trying to assume dominion over the faith of others with their fallible and uninspired 24x6 literalist opinions and modes of thinking.

Oddly, they also can't seem to answer whether or not the literal King of Tyre was literally in the literal Garden of Eden...

 

Ezek 28:11-13

11 The word of the Lord came to me: 12 "Son of man, take up a lament concerning the king of Tyre and say to him: 'This is what the Sovereign Lord says:

"'You were the model of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.

13 You were in Eden, the garden of God;
NIV

...or...

Gen 3:23-24

23 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken. 24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east sidee of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.
NIV

...not, either.

346 posted on 07/14/2017 6:47:10 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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To: af_vet_1981; metmom
So, am I correct in assuming, that you agree with me, that the Pharisee should have added Luther's name to his list of disagreeables?
Praise God for Luther. 😀😆🙃😁😂😄
347 posted on 07/14/2017 7:05:52 AM PDT by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Elsie

Da number !!!

Youz has it !!!


348 posted on 07/14/2017 7:31:39 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Elsie; metmom
I merely had to deal with the diurnal shift in the ionosphere with the time delay/advance of the WWVB longwave timing signal.

Yep, I am a Ham radio operator too, so not only did I talk to airplanes on line of sight VHF and UHF, but I talked to Hams all over the world, so I had to know what freqs to use to do that. We used to love to talk to the female Hams in Japan, Korea, China and Russia.
I used to get my time hacks, from WWV, Fort Collins, CO, on 5, 10, 15, or 20 Megs. Now? I just look at my iPhone for accurate time information. 🙃😊👍

349 posted on 07/14/2017 7:41:41 AM PDT by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Elsie; metmom
Mom...
...you tryin' to make Catholic heads explode??

I made my entire family's catholic heads explode, when I left the Catholic Church. A couple of them have never gotten over it. Oh well, that's life. I am sure, that to them, I am the savor of death to death. 😩🔥

350 posted on 07/14/2017 7:50:47 AM PDT by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Mark17
No; Gentiles who hated the Jewish people (except they repented/did penance) would fall in other passages. Balaam also had those who praised him.

Set thou a wicked man over him: and let Satan stand at his right hand. When he shall be judged, let him be condemned: and let his prayer become sin. Let his days be few; and let another take his office. Let his children be fatherless, and his wife a widow. Let his children be continually vagabonds, and beg: let them seek their bread also out of their desolate places. Let the extortioner catch all that he hath; and let the strangers spoil his labour. Let there be none to extend mercy unto him: neither let there be any to favour his fatherless children. Let his posterity be cut off; and in the generation following let their name be blotted out. Let the iniquity of his fathers be remembered with the Lord; and let not the sin of his mother be blotted out. Let them be before the Lord continually, that he may cut off the memory of them from the earth. Because that he remembered not to shew mercy, but persecuted the poor and needy man, that he might even slay the broken in heart. As he loved cursing, so let it come unto him: as he delighted not in blessing, so let it be far from him. As he clothed himself with cursing like as with his garment, so let it come into his bowels like water, and like oil into his bones. Let it be unto him as the garment which covereth him, and for a girdle wherewith he is girded continually.

Psalms, Catholic chapter one hundred and nine, Protestant verses six to sixteen,

as authorized, but not authored, by King James

351 posted on 07/14/2017 7:55:16 AM PDT by af_vet_1981 (The bus came by and I got on, That's when it all began.)
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To: af_vet_1981; metmom; boatbums
Hmmm. When I was a Catholic, I occasionally heard the term Christ killer from other Catholics, concerning Jews. It's been more than 4 decades since I left the Catholic Church, so I can't remember if I ever heard a priest or nun actually say that. They may have implied it. They were never stupid enough, to come right out and say they were against marriage, but they implied that, by saying becoming priests and nuns was a better way.
I know my dad asked me if I ever thought about becoming a priest. I said no. I didn't say it, but I thought I committed too many mortal sins, and I liked females too much, so I wasn't about to become a priest.
At this time, it doesn't matter a hill of beans to me, but no one has ever been able to tell me what are mortal sins and what are venial sins. I guess I will never know, but I can live with that.
352 posted on 07/14/2017 8:25:35 AM PDT by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Elsie

I notice how the commitment is to the church of Peter and to him and his successors.


353 posted on 07/14/2017 8:38:26 AM PDT by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith..)
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Comment #354 Removed by Moderator

To: fortes fortuna juvat; metmom
>>the Catholic hierarchy

Catholic hierarchy; catholic hierarchy.

What's interesting is the human tendency of vestigially plumaged dominionists to, despite what Luther correctly cited as "the Priesthood of all believers",  inevitably try to nail themselves to the Perch over everybody else regardless of the denomination and capitalization of their hierachical feathers.

355 posted on 07/14/2017 9:15:16 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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To: Elsie
>>E=mc...

Meh. Stupid Natural Order of Things.

Who needs that "gobbledeeegook" when all that's required to keep folks coming to "Bible" class is...

...Donuts!

356 posted on 07/14/2017 9:26:29 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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To: metmom
>>PS, you don’t need to pretend to lecture me on relativity.

Great. Then you should be able to tell everybody how this...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relativistic_Doppler_effect

... was produced with another practical application which demonstrates of the veracity of the Time Dilation predicted by Special Relativity.

357 posted on 07/14/2017 10:16:38 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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To: ebb tide; Luircin; metmom; RegulatorCountry

"For ethics, we usually went up the road to the Jesuits at St. Louis University who seem to take delight in the finer distinctions of life"
---Presented to the Symposium on Infertility Ethics November 8, 2014 - Concordia Seminary, St. Louis

https://www.lcms.org/Document.fdoc?src=lcm&id=3173

So, how long til the "more catholic than the Catholics" syncretic love-fest becomes "more jesuit than the Jesuits...",  LCMS/Iconic Luther fans?

"I do not like the reappearance of the Jesuits....
Shall we not have regular swarms of them here, in as many disguises as only a king
of the gipsies can assume, dressed as printers, publishers, writers and schoolmasters?
If ever there was a body of men who merited damnation on earth and in Hell,
it is this society of Loyola’s.
Nevertheless, we are compelled by our system of religious toleration
to offer them an asylum."

--John Adams to Thomas Jefferson; May, 1816


358 posted on 07/14/2017 10:40:03 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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To: HLPhat

tl; dr.

Or more like I don’t care what someone who denies Christ has to say about Christian topics.

And before you protest, YES, YOU DID. On this thread, you did. Feel free to prove me wrong and confess that Jesus is Lord, as I challenged you to do.

Other than that, I really do NOT care. Lay off the harassment and leave me be.


359 posted on 07/14/2017 10:47:07 AM PDT by Luircin
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To: Luircin; Religion Moderator

>>someone who denies Christ

How’s that personalized slander and bearing of false witness thing working for ya Luircin?

I’ve stated multiple times that the relationship between myself is restored by the victory of Christ.

But, as I’ve answer pointed out in answer to your personified challenge, that it seems that’s not enough for folks who’ve assumed dominion with their 24x6 literalist opinions.


360 posted on 07/14/2017 10:55:42 AM PDT by HLPhat (It takes a Republic TO SECURE THESE RIGHTS - not a populist Tyranny of the Majority)
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