Posted on 07/26/2015 8:55:19 AM PDT by MHGinTN
Here is yet more information, for those who miss the Rapture and are here after the event. This is for people, not any particular congregation of people. Please, think about it ...
Says an expert in slinging stuff.
***CRICKETS***,***CRICKETS***,***CRICKETS***
Kinda like this response to it.
LOL!
Some folks are still in bed!
LOL Those two books changed my view of being faced with death because of my faith. I’ve been a post-tribber since 1974 but until jihad, didn’t know how so many would be beheaded.
“Tell us what you believe ‘in Christ’ means.”
It means they are saved. What else could it possibly mean?
Hmm. I wonder how many people are getting tattooed these days.
What two books?
The seventy weeks of Daniel's prophecy is for:
Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
For those in Christ, Paul tells us:
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who don't walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus made me free from the law of sin and of death.
Do you presume that God will have these who are not condemned upon the Earth when the condemnation from God begins in Jerusalem? The Revelation indicates otherwise:
Rev 3:7 To the angel of the assembly in Philadelphia write: He who is holy, he who is true, he who has the key of David, he who opens and no one can shut, and who shuts and no one opens, says these things: I know your works (behold, I have set before you an open door, which no one can shut), that you have a little power, and kept my word, and didn't deny my name.
9 Behold, I give of the synagogue of Satan, of those who say they are Jews, and they are not, but lie. Behold, I will make them to come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you.
10 Because you kept my command to endure, I also will keep you from the hour of testing, which is to come on the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.
11 I am coming quickly! Hold firmly that which you have, so that no one takes your crown.
Now let's see what this open door opens to, as shown to John, remembering that the Bible did not have chapter separations as we have now, so this verse is a continuation of what we see in Rev 3 with the open door:
Rev4:1 After these things I looked and saw a door opened in heaven, and the first voice that I heard, like a trumpet speaking with me, was one saying, "Come up here, and I will show you the things which must happen after this." Immediately I was in the Spirit.
The message to the Laodicean Church comes right after the message to the Philadelphia Church. Looking at what The Spirit says about spewing that Church out, we understand the 'after these things' to then refer us to what came right before 'these things' regarding the Laodicean Church. So we see the door open as the door referred to in the message to the Philadelphia Church. The Spirit says "Come up here, and I will show you the things which must happen after this." From that point in the Revelation until the nineteenth chapter, the Church is not mentioned on Earth. When The Body of Christ, the Spiritual Church, is mentioned again it is called 'The Bride of Christ'. So where did the marriage take place since it happened before the Bride and The Lord return to the Earth?
“Do you presume that God will have these who are not condemned upon the Earth when the condemnation from God begins in Jerusalem?”
The condemnation of God doesn’t happen until after Christ returns, as it is Christ that treads the winepress of God’s wrath. By that time, we’ll all be resurrected in glorified bodies, so we won’t have to worry about being “collateral damage”.
“remembering that the Bible did not have chapter separations as we have now, so this verse is a continuation of what we see in Rev 3 with the open door:”
Nonsense, there is a clear textual distinction, with the previous chapter being in the form of an epistle to a church, and this chapter being a visionary prophecy, told from the first person point of view of John. John is the one being told to “come up here”, just as John is the subject of many such instructions and comments throughout the book, as he is the one being given the vision.
“When The Body of Christ, the Spiritual Church, is mentioned again it is called ‘The Bride of Christ’. So where did the marriage take place since it happened before the Bride and The Lord return to the Earth?”
The marriage can’t happen before the resurrection, otherwise only believers who were alive at the time could be considered part of the church, and that can’t possibly be a correct interpretation. So any wedding can’t take place before the first resurrection, when all members of the church, living and dead, are reunited with Christ, and that takes place at the end of the tribulation.
Except there is not one first resurrection, pretribs tell us, there are three: Jesus' resurrection, a pretrib resurrection, and the first resurrection of Rev. 20:4. Just like there are three comings.
This is so convoluted and so much conflation, we'll have to take it clause by clause.
The condemnation of God doesn’t happen until after Christ returns In this start you are spot on, God does not deliver the Earth over to the machinations of satan until Christ comes in the clouds to remove His Body of believers. These that will be removed will return after the Tribulation as His Bride.
it is Christ that treads the winepress of God’s wrath. Once again you are correct but you have apparently omitted all the events prior to this treading the winepress. In the harvests, the barley is first, and to harvest the grain from the stalks one need only wave the stalks in the air to release the grain. Next harvested is the wheat. To get the grain from the stalks with wheat the bundles are crushed with a tribulum dragged over the stalks and the grain is crushed out of what becomes the chaff. By the time we get to the harvesting of grapes and the treading of the winepress, there have been previous harvests. The barley prefigures the Rapture harvest of the believers in Christ. The tribulum crushing the grains from the stalks of wheat prefigures those who will become real believers during the events occurring upon the earth during the tribulation. By the time the winepress 'occurs' the only thing left are the unbelievers, those who have refused to believe Jesus is the ONLY means of deliverance and eternal life as God offers to bring life tot he dead souls of men.
By that time, we’ll all be resurrected in glorified bodies, so we won’t have to worry about being “collateral damage". Again, close, but the orientation seems askew. When the barley harvest, er, I mean the Rapture happens, the dead in Christ who died during the Church Age together with those alive in Christ at the moment of the harvest, er, I mean Rapture of the Church, will be --as Paul put it, telling the Corinthians that he was showing them a mystery, something hidden and just being revealed-- transformed, I a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, then together (as Paul wrote in 2 Thess 2) as a gathering together unto Him, The Christ, we shall be departed to where Jesus told His disciples He was going to prepare for them and come to take them THERE, not uppn the EArth, THERE, in Heaven. While the born from above are in Heaven, going before the Bema Seat of Christ, the seventieth week of Daniel's Prophecy will run on the earth, with the wheat being tribulumed, er, I mean the unbelievers being subject to growing wrath.
God has not appointed us unto wrath, but to obtain Salvation/Deliverance. God will not put His life in a believer only to then subject them to His wrath. The wrath of satan and of men has been doing that to The Church members since the first century AD. God will remove His chosen before He sends His wrath, as He releases by removing the Restrainer out of the way.
The seventieth week of Daniel's prophecy, whose purpose is int he previous post from Daniel 9, that seventieth week begins when a 'safety' deal is made with the evil one's representative, 'guaranteeing' safety for Israel so Israel need not keep their armies on constant alert for islamic attack. The 'safety' treaty is hallmarked by severe military actions wiping out some gathering to assault Israel and annihilate her. The scene into which this 'giver of safety' strides for making deals is not a pleasant world. Jesus described the state of things world-wide in the Olivet Discourse recorded in Matthew 24 and Mark 13. The hellish state will already be started, so those in Christ will already be gone with The Christ back to where He has been preparing a place for the born from above.
Yes, the above represents my opinion, the way I read the scriptures after decades in them as a born from above member of The Body of Christ. If you wish to discuss this further, I will do so with you in a spirit of comity. But I have not insulted your opinion so I would expect the same in return even as you offer your extensive opinion doubtless derived from years of study also.
If America is to have revival, I see the Truth of the imminency of the Rapture as an anchor to which revival can be secured. The Septuagint was replete with signs to watch for so a precise timing of the seventieth week of Daniel culmination could be calculated. There are no such signs of fulfillment in order for the Rapture to happen. The Bible makes it clear we are to be always alert to His coming int he Air to snatch away His Church, His body of believers accumulating during the Church Age. But as to the Second return to touch down upon the Mt of Olives, there are numerous signs for timing that arrival.
Jesus Freaks 1 & 2
Popcorn. I can see the angels doing facepalms. Or better yet, the swords are drawn over this spiritual warfare. I like the simple way because time should be spent doing. Those who attack every post they disagree with have way too much invested in their own ideas. Like democrats.
Never heard of them (the books).
Dave's not here, man? lol
That small amount of joking aside, thanks for the explanation.
I see now (after some searching the phrase) the books are listed and commented about, online.
...And a line from a Jesus-rock video (that I didn't even know existed);
Remind me of the time somebody, in exasperation exclaimed to me;
Naturally, I replied, "no, but Jesus was".
They were still mad at me afterwards. Oh well (part 2)
“By the time the winepress ‘occurs’ the only thing left are the unbelievers, those who have refused to believe Jesus is the ONLY means of deliverance and eternal life as God offers to bring life tot he dead souls of men.”
Yes, only unbelievers are left because the first resurrection occurs at Christ’s return, and all believers, living and dead are resurrected as part of that event. After that, Christ dispenses God’s wrath on the world.
“When the barley harvest, er, I mean the Rapture happens, the dead in Christ who died during the Church Age together with those alive in Christ at the moment of the harvest, er, I mean Rapture of the Church, will be —as Paul put it, telling the Corinthians that he was showing them a mystery, something hidden and just being revealed— transformed, I a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, then together (as Paul wrote in 2 Thess 2) as a gathering together unto Him, The Christ, we shall be departed to where Jesus told His disciples He was going to prepare for them and come to take them THERE, not uppn the EArth, THERE, in Heaven.”
So then why is there a first resurrection, of all the believers living and dead, at the end of the tribulation? According to you, all have already been resurrected in the rapture, rendering the first resurrection not only falsely labelled (since it wouldn’t actually be the first) but also superfluous. God doesn’t do things that are false or superfluous, so your interpretation has some pretty huge contradictions to try to explain away.
“God will remove His chosen before He sends His wrath”
Of course, that is why we are resurrected at Christ’s return at the end of the tribulation, before God’s wrath comes upon the world.
“The hellish state will already be started, so those in Christ will already be gone with The Christ back to where He has been preparing a place for the born from above.”
This is just an assumption on your part, and I think a very poor one. Nowhere in the Bible does it say that Christians will be removed before the Tribulation.
“If America is to have revival, I see the Truth of the imminency of the Rapture as an anchor to which revival can be secured.”
I don’t think revival based on a misinterpretation of Scripture is likely or desirable. Besides, we know there will be great apostasy before the end, so we should expect the number of Christians to dwindle and not increase at that time.
There will be folks who come to believe in Jesus during the frist half of the Tribulation. They will not be indwelt in the way believers during the Church Age have been. They are resurrected at the end of the Tribulation. The verses for the Tribulation are often conflated with the Church Age. That's understandable because so many conflate the Luke 21 Doscourse witht eh Matthew 24 and Mark 13 Olivet Discourse.
There is nothing superfluous about what God does. But I see you want to hang that label upon what I've offered in good faith. So, that appears to be as far as it is possible to go with you for comity. But the exchanges so far may have helped readers sort out the persepctives on the Rapture of The Chruch, not the Tribulation believers, the Church, The Body of Christ, which will not be going through seven years of tribulation designed for the Jews to put an end to sin 'in Israel'. Have nice day and enjoy life while it is possible to do so upon the earth. when the Tribulation of seven years begins, the Restrainer will no longer be upon the earth in Believers restraining lawlessness. And this will be the first of the wrath of God which grows stronger by degrees, as illustrated in the Book of Revelation after the Church is gone.
Maybe I have a warped sense of humor, but I found that hilarious. I may have to borrow it.
Sure.
It might be difficult though, to get somebody to provide the entire straight-line set-up.
The lady who blurted it out walked into the whole deal, pretty much all on her own.
It helped that she was one of those types who despised Christians, voted pure "lefty", probably thought she knew about Jesus (and everyone but herself, and lefty Democrats, were getting "Jesus" all wrong) etc.
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