The Gospel for Roman Catholics

Southern Baptist Midwestern Seminary For The Church ^ | June 14, 2015 | A.D. Robles

[imardmd1]

This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them.

Protesters correcting the Judaizers, I guess.

[betty boop]

I think the cause of the many divisions in recent years have been Doctrines, which cannot be proven upon the basis of the teachings within God’s word,...these ‘are elevated as a substitute for truth’,....which in turn does lead to factions within the Body of Christ.

Great observation, caww. Thank you!

And Happy Fourth of July!

[Mrs. Don-o]

To believe is to assent.

You knew that!

[MHGinTN]

I posted a response to your post but failed to put your name in the 'to' box at #401.

In your opinion, has Vatican II changed the proclamation of Trent?

[Petrosius]

Jesus says that if we do not forgive others we will not be forgiven. So merely faith is not enough. Kind of simple.

[Petrosius]

The premise of many Roman Catholics is to place their faith in the Church prior to faith in Christ on the Cross.

You have it backwards. Catholics put our faith in the Church because we place our faith in Jesus on the Cross.

[Petrosius]

If that were true your CC would not disagree with Holy Scriptures both would be one consistent word.

The Catholic Church does not disagree with Scripture. It disagrees with Protestant interpretations of Scripture. From my point of view it is Protestantism that disagrees with Scripture.

[MHGinTN]

You did not answer the question. It is not a simple matter. Is the forgiveness denied tot he person BEFORE salvation? Or is it after salvation? Conflating these two dispositions before God is the point of the questions you are avoiding. The Catholic means to salvation is an ongoing process draped with sacraments, following the sacramental trail as it were to 'obtain salvation'. So, if a person on this trail fails to forgive someone in this life, will they be denied forgiveness?

I'll anticipate your Catholic answer to include some plea to purgatory for 'cleansing' so the person once at the finish line of salvation trail can then eventually enter Heaven. Is that an accurate portrayal of how one who does not forgive others yet is following sacramental trail arrives at salvation entry into Heaven?

[MHGinTN]

And in Catholicism the Catholic is continuously accessing the propitiatory sacrifice at Mass to accomplish what?

[Resettozero]

Jesus says that if we do not forgive others we will not be forgiven. So merely faith is not enough. Kind of simple.

A little overly-simplified by you in your post. You appear to be operating with a minimalist's definition of faith in Lord Jesus Christ.

Saving faith in Christ alone, Scripturally in the Holy Bible and also witnessed by at least one other non-Roman Catholic Christian posting here encompasses many other facets of daily living as parts of the whole of this kind of faith; facets that have nomenclatures such as "forgiveness", "humbleness" and "loving kindness", for a very few.

[af_vet_1981]

I find that particular question and answer unpersuasive, and rather presumptuous and shallow. Perhaps got answers is a Protestant derivative imitation of a magisterium trying to make sense of the streams of reformed, fundamentalist, evangelical, and emerging theologies. Who are the men behind the mask ? Who ordained them ? What is their provenance and authority ?

[MHGinTN]

Excellent question! I myself do not agree 100% with the posted at that site answer tot he question. I do find the scripture passages quite persuasive however.

[MHGinTN]

I posted the entry for the question, so that a dialogue over the Bema Seat in HEAVEN might be contrasted with striving for salvation and purgatory, both found to be foundational in Catholic dogma ... well, until Vatican II sought to launch an ecumenism.

[Resettozero]

The Catholic Church does not disagree with Scripture. It disagrees with Protestant interpretations of Scripture. From my point of view it is Protestantism that disagrees with Scripture.

You speak for the Roman Catholic Church now? Or is that your personal interpretation of what the RCC has taught you?

That which you post here sometimes differs substantially from the posts of other RCs who post on FR RF. Which of the various RCC interpretations of the Holy Bible carries the most weight with you?

There seem to be competing versions of the RCC teachings of what the Bible actually says and what it doesn't say. There appear to be many divisions of teachings and interpretations of church members within the worldwide RCC. The impression to other FR readers is there are many denominations of Roman Catholicism, in spite of repeated denials.

[Petrosius]

It is not a simple matter. Is the forgiveness denied tot he person BEFORE salvation?

How can there be forgiveness without salvation or salvation without forgiveness?

[Petrosius]

And in Catholicism the Catholic is continuously accessing the propitiatory sacrifice at Mass to accomplish what?

To offer fitting worship to God and to have access to the grace of God to increase our love for him.

[Resettozero]

To offer fitting worship to God and to have access to the grace of God to increase our love for him.

Is it possible to do this without ever participating in a Roman Catholic church mass? Is it possible for me, presuming I remain a non-Roman Catholic from now until the first death?

[MHGinTN]

According to the RCC Catechism the Mass is essential to obtain salvation. That is the reason every effort is made on the battlefield to administer the Mass before death of a soldier. Is that correct, have I characterized the Mass properly with this? ... I’m not referring to last rites, I refer to the effort to bring a Mass to the dying man.

[MHGinTN]

Vatican II, in confirming complete agreement with Trent says that actually without being a Catholic you are doomed to eternal damnation. However, at the end of Vatican II there is a blurring of this agreement to allow for salvation by God’s Grace to Buddhists, Moslems, Hindus, etc.