Praying of the Rosary Is NOT Bible-Based Teaching

The Disciplers ^ | 2011 | Ptr. Vince

[rwa265]

And where exactly in the verses shown does it say Mary is the mother of God?

---

It doesn’t. As I stated in another post:

The phrase ‘mother of God’ is not found anywhere in Scripture. But does the fact that a specific phrase is not mentioned make it not so? Does that mean that the Son of God is not the “Second Person of the Trinity” because that specific phrase is not found in the Bible?

More importantly, is the concept or the essential truth of Mary as Mother of God found in Scripture? Does Scripture contradict the teaching that Mary is the Mother of God?

There are many verses that support the teaching that Mary is the mother of God. One such verse is:

“And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.”

This supports the concept that the child that “shall be born” was fully human and fully divine at the time of His birth. And by conceiving in her womb and bringing forth “that holy thing that shall be called the Son of God,” Mary did become the mother of this child in His humanity and in His divinity; that is, the mother of God incarnate.

I have not found anything in Scripture that contradicts this. It would be Scripture contradicting itself.

Can you show me anywhere in Scripture that refutes the concept that Mary is the mother of God incarnate?

[CynicalBear]

>>their Christological errors must be refuted.<<

Calling Mary the "mother of God" doesn't do it.

[CynicalBear]

>>The title of Mother of God clears that up in no uncertain terms.<<

You're kidding only yourself. Those who don't acknowledge the divinity of Christ aren't going to change their mind simply because you call her mother of God. What do you think? That they can't read scripture and see that's not a term ever used?

[NoCmpromiz]

Ghandi didn’t know Jesus Christ...I wouldn’t take his advice...

He probably knew enough of his teachings to form an opinion.

It appears he stated his opinion...

"Jesus is ideal and wonderful, but you Christians - you are not like him."
Mahatma Gandhi

[CynicalBear]

>>Can you show me anywhere in Scripture that refutes the concept that Mary is the mother of God incarnate?<<

John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Ergo, no beginning with Mary.

[Colofornian]

Who knows what you're missing out on: Col 4: 16 And when this epistle is read among you, cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans; and that ye likewise read the epistle from Laodicea.
Paul gives instructions to read the epistle of Laodicea. But, you don't have it. Obviously it was important. God wanted everyone to read it. So it wasn't God that didn't put it in the Bible, that was man's choice. Perhaps it contained doctrine on not baptizing babies... who knows...but one thing is for certain, God wanted us to read it.

So, supposedly prophetic words are...
...recorded at great difficulty on golden plates,
...survive the centuries of gold-diggers,
...with a ghost guy named Moroni given a special mantle to lead a lad named Smith to find,
...who is supposedly somehow handed a urium & thummim device we don't see operated by Mormon "prophets" today -- even tho it's rumored to be in the special underground vault maintained by the Mormon church...
...and this "revelation" is meticulously recorded by Martin Harris.

But...

...since Harris took the manuscript home...
...and it's been since alleged that his wife hid it or lost it...
...we just don't have it...
...only an alleged "abridgement" Smith hastily edited...
...leaving out aplenty as "Book of Mormon" editor/slasher.

Obviously it must have been important! The Mormon god wanted everyone to read it. So it wasn't the Mormon god that didn't put it in the Book of Mormon; that was man's choice. That included Joseph Smith's choice to FAIL to double back & reconsult his sources...
...whether it was...
...a gold plate...
...a urim & thummim...
...and a hat...

(I mean what kind of a god is this who falters at the hands of Mrs. Martin Harris???)

Likewise, perhaps...
...the large plates of Nephi
...& the unabridged version of Ether
...& all those buried plates buried in the ground that the "prophet" Mormon didn't touch...
...contained doctrine on not teaching age 8 as the golden age of accountability ... who knows...but one thing is for certain, the Mormon god wanted us to read it.

References above: See:

* The large plates of Nephi [reduced to an abridgement: 3 Nephi 5:8-17; Words of Mormon 1]
* The supposed "numerous plates" buried in a hill that the "prophet" Mormon didn't touch (Mormon 1:3-4)
* The unabridged version of Ether (Ether 1:1-5; Moroni 1:1)

[Resettozero]

That’s the beauty of Catholicism we don’t need to reinvent the two thousand year old wheel. Or reverse engineer it from a text.

Or think at all.

Nesotarians denied the divinity of Christ. The title of Mother of God clears that up in no uncertain terms.

Like I said: RCs don't need to think...just to repeat the mantras and keep the funds flowing in.

(And be able to imagine the goofiest explanations for what they don't really know.)

[rwa265]

Before Abraham was, I am.

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True, Jesus is I AM. However, He was not incarnate before He became the son of Mary.

[NoCmpromiz]

can be found in the Book of MORMON.

Also would be appropriate to ask the apologist for peer reviewed archeology reports on the historicity of such internal claims presented in that work as could with reasonable expectation be verified by such research...

You know, like we have for much of the similarly identifiable claims in the real Bible...

[Resettozero]

My mind was opened to apprehend and appreciate the information in this your post.

Thank you for the clarity and the understandable layout of information.

R2z

[CynicalBear]

>>True, Jesus is I AM. However, He was not incarnate before He became the son of Mary.<<

Incarnate - having a human body

So! Now we have Jesus who always has been taking on human form from Mary. Ergo, Mary is the originator of His human body and not His God nature.

[Resettozero]

So! Now we have Jesus who always has been taking on human form from Mary. Ergo, Mary is the originator of His human body and not His God nature.

Lee Marvin voice:

"I'll drink to that!"

(huh?)

[Colofornian]

There are people right here in the RF who deny the divinity of Our Lord, nevermind the mormons. There are arians and nestorians still running around today, their Christological errors must be refuted.

I simply don't tend to find JWs (modern-day Arians) or openly id'd process theologians (Barth thought them a form a Nestorianism) around on FR.

Now some do link Oneness Pentecostals to embracing a form a Nestorianism, so I suppose you may be able to be able to build a case for others to post more threads on them.

My experience with this group (I hate to stereotype them all...so a caveat here that I'm not pidgeon-holing them all):
* Their focus is often more on the Holy Spirit than Christ (or His divinity);
* They're highly worship-oriented; and would rather experience the Divinity and the resulting joy & emotions that come with/from that, than to enter into once-removed digital discussions that tend to lean on the "intellectual" side...this isn't to say they are "anti-intellectual," but they invest their energies based upon "guidance" or "impulse" or "intuition" -- or however that's to be framed.

[Resettozero]

Duh. I git it now.

“So! Now we have Jesus, who always has been, taking on human form from Mary. Ergo, Mary is the originator of His human body and not His God nature.”

Two commas added did the trick this time.

(Is that like adding a jot or a tittle?)

[af_vet_1981]

And where exactly in the verses shown does it say Mary is the mother of God?
Hoss

Hoss, good question; since the Holy Spirit interpreted the scripture for us we know that Miriam/Mary is the mother of "God with us," which is what the Hebrew from Isaiah means.

Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
Isaiah, Catholic chapter seven, Protestant verse fourteen, Matthew, Catholic chapter one, Protestant verse twenty three,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

[Vermont Lt]

I tried to send my wife to the red tent once.

That did not work out well. I think I ended up sleeping in the back yard for a few night.

[Vermont Lt]

I think it’s a logic thing.

Jesus is God, incarnate.
Mary is Jesus mother.
Ergo, Mary is the Mother of God.

I don’t know how one can be the creator of the creator.

I thought you were being literal (as if Mary did not bear and raise Jesus.)

[Colofornian]

But, I don’t tell my catholic relatives their prayers are wasted. (My term, not yours.). In the end, we will know. Then it’s too late.

When Jesus commented on "vain repetition" prayers (Matt. 6:7), his comment was aimed at a very general group ("heathen")...not a specific religious group like the Pharisees.

Yet in the context in which he spoke Matt 6:7, He wasn't directing it immediately as something "in-your-face" to the heathen;
so it wasn't so much a "descriptive" focus...
as much as a contrast "prescriptive" directive: Don't pray as they do; instead, pray this way.

I think we can learn from that on this subject.

Instead of saying in an accusatory approach, "Your prayers are wasted" in a direct, descriptive way; we could say, "Ya know, Jesus prescribed some ways of praying...namely something similar to The Lord's Prayer...and He also prescribed as a way of contrast how vain repetitions in prayer reflected more heathenism than it did godly prayer. How do you think those who call upon the Name of Christ could move further away from heathenism by engaging in distinctive prayer patterns?"

[Resettozero]

The Jewish Messiah has many Names and titles. One of His many Names is Immanuel (Emmanuel when Romanized). But This Person of Whom we speak went by the quite ordinary name Yeshua (Jesus, in the Greek).

Thus, one might say that Miriam/Mary is the mother of “Yeshua” or “Jesus”.

Hope this helps.

[daniel1212]

How does God manage to use me much at all is the real question!