laimed to have an apparation from an angel teaching them to pray in the spring of 1916. They were asked to pray repeatedly by the angel who appeared to them. This is why the Catholics were convinced that they have to pray repeatedly.Posted on 03/24/2015 8:06:07 AM PDT by RnMomof7
Just last Sunday, a local newspaper paper released an article teaching that the praying of the Holy Rosary is Bible-based. In the first two paragraphs, the writer admittedly says that there is no passage in the Bible teaching nor mentioned about the praying of Rosary.
However, in the following paragraphs, the writer justified the praying of the Rosary basing it on the repetition of historical events of some Bible characters (like Gideon as he mentioned) about Israel’s history.
I don’t know if the writer of this article did some research about the origin of rosary and how it was deeply encouraged for Roman Catholics.
Praying of Rosary was encouraged when Lucia Dos Santos and her cousins Francisco and Jacinta Marto claimed to have an apparation from an angel teaching them to pray in the spring of 1916. They were asked to pray repeatedly by the angel who appeared to them. This is why the Catholics were convinced that they have to pray repeatedly.
The flaw however in the story was that, the angel gave two sets of completely different prayers. The angel appeared to the three children three times.
Then after a year, 1917, it was said that Our Lady of Rosary had an apparitions for 7 times. In her second apparition the Our Lady said:
“I wish you to come here the 13th of next month; that you say the Rosary every day, and that you learn to read. In succeding months I will tell you what else I want.” “I would like to ask you to bring us to Heaven“, said Lucy. “Yes, Giacinta and Francis will be among the few, but you must stay here for a long time. Jesus wants to help Himself of you to make Me known and loved. God wishes you to remain in the world for some time because He wants to use you to establish in the world a devotion to my Immaculate Heart. I promise salvation to those who embrace it, and their souls will be loved by God as flowers placed by myself to adorn His throne.” Lucy asked: “Will I stay here alone”?, “Don’t be discouraged , I will not abandon you ever. My Immaculate Heart will be your refuge and through it will conduct you to God.”
Now here are the flaws of this apparition. First, the Our Lady is telling the children to teach the people to make her known and be loved. Note that the apparition was initiated not by Jesus, nor an angel, but the very person who wants to be made known. It is like, someone came to you and asked you using the name of your friend to introduce her to other people that you know.
The second flaw, Our Lady promises salvation to those who embrace this command. A completely heretical claim, and totally in contrast to what the Bible is saying. The Bible is very clear in saying that “…whosoever believes in Him (Jesus) will not perish but have everlasting life (John 3:16).” Only God can give salvation. This is the Biblical truth that cannot be altered, deducted nor added.
Third flaw, Our Lady claims that her immaculate heart will be our refuge and through it will conduct you to God. This is another contradiction to what the Bible is saying. “Come to me all you labor and are heavily burdened and I will give you rest (Matt.11:28)”, “I am the way the truth and the life, NO ONE comes to the Father except through me (John 14:6)”.
The truth is, there is only one mediator between God and man, it is only Jesus Christ (Hebrews chapters 6,7,8,9, and 10)
This is the statement coming from the third apparition:
“In october I will tell you who I am, that which I want, and I will do a miracle that all can see and believe. Sacrifice yourselves for sinners, and say often this prayer, especially during any sacrifice: “O my Jesus, I offer this for love of Thee, for the conversion of poor sinners, and in reparation for all the sins commited against the Immaculate Heart of Mary.“
The flaw of the third apparition is the claiming of honor which belongs to Jesus Christ, and the idea of co-equality with Jesus. Though she did not claim co-equality, but the fact of showing that people committed sins against her proposes the idea of deity that people needs to be so sorry for not recognizing her. The Bible tells us that there are three persona where we committed sins, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. And now, here comes the Mary, an addition to the Holy Trinity.
“You have seen Hell, where the souls of poor sinners go. To save future souls God wishes to establish in the world the devotion to My Immaculate Heart. If people do what I tell you, many souls will be saved.” Then She said:” If my requests are granted, Russia will be converted and there will be peace. If not, she will scatter her errors throughout the world, provoking wars and persecution of the Church. The good will be martyed, the Holy Father will have much to suffer, and various nations will be destroyed…But in the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me, Russia will be converted, and a certain period of peace will be granted to the world“. “Do you want to learn a prayer?” the vision asked, “Yes we do!” the children responded. “When you recite the Rosary, say at the end of each decade: Oh My Jesus, forgive us our sins, save us from the fires of hell, and lead all souls to Heaven, especially those in most need of Your Mercy.“
Now let’s look at this additional quotations from the third apparition. This is more like “Our Lady” centered command rather than “Jesus” centered command. Russia will be consecreted to Our Lady of Rosary than instead of Jesus. Notice the number of recitation of the Rosary. At the end of each decade (10), there is only one calling for Jesus help.
This is quoted from the last (6th) apparition
“I am the Lady of the Rosary, I desire here a chapel in my honor to be built, that people continue to recite the Rosary every day. Will the war finish. The war is going to end, and the soldiers will soon return to their homes.” Then Lucy asked: “may I ask you for cures and conversions, will you grant them?”. “Some yes, others no. It is necessary that they ask pardon for their sins, that they don’t offend God our Lord, and that he is already too much offended.” “Do you Want anything else from me?” Lucy asked. “I do not want anything more.“
The flaw of the 6th apparition is that the Lady of the Rosary is asking for a chapel in “HER” honor, and not Jesus’ nor the Father’s honor. We have to note that taking glory which supposed to be for God is a serious sin, this is idolatry.
The apparition is completely directing people in a wrong path. It is completely in contradiction with what the Bible is saying. The Bible warn us about these kinds of apparitions in Galatians 1:8 “But even though we (referring to Paul and his companions) or an angel from heaven, which should preach to you any gospel other than that which we preached to you, let him be cursed.” This is a strong warning that we should be careful in believing apparitions especially if it gives another teachings that what the Bible already have taught us.
Just some additional observations concerning the apparition of Our Lady of Rosary. Our Lady appeared “6” times. In Hebrew culture (the Israelite culture), 6 is the imperfect number. A number usually associated with evil things. Thus, the number of the Beast in the Book of Revelations tells us that it is 666.
Another observation is the dates of the apparition. The apparition dates are significantly on the 13th of every month of that year. Even until, Roman Catholics believe that 13th is always associated with evil things like Friday the 13t h bad luck and not placing 13th floor on buildings. Not to mention all the horror movies that happens on Friday the 13th.
Now let me ask you, do you really believe that these apparitions comes from God? These apparition and commands are completely in contrast to what the Bible teaches us. They are “Our Lady of Rosary” centered rather than “God” centered. The apparitions promotes glory and honor for “Our Lady of Rosary” rather than the glory of God. And finally, even culture related things are in contradiction to the apparitions. Not to mention its lack of Apostolicity and Biblical support.
And Mary's name?
While Mary gave birth to and mothered the incarnate Christ, she contributed nothing to His Divine nature, and owes her own existence to Christ. Giving her the formal title Mother of God disrespects how the Holy Spirit describes and gives titles to created beings, which works against exalting them as RCs extremely do with Mary, thinking of her "above that which is written," which the Spirit warns against. (1Co. 4:6)
How did you manage to say that so well?
I'm glad you Mormons fixed that for us.
Would you please tell where the Epistle of Laodicea is located in the Standard Works?
Well; you see the book that Rome compiled mentions some folks called Bereans, and how they searched the Scriptures to see if what they'd been told was true; and that modus operandi (a little Latin for the fans) has kinda rubbed off onto me.
Remember when that angel was talking to Mary, and she asked, "How shall this be...?"
I think, IIRC, that the angel said the Holy Ghost would overshadow thee...
I don't want to sound like I'm mocking anyone either -- that's why I would never want to mock God and pray to someone/something that is NOT God. Called idolatry. Or Mariolatry in this instance. Did not Christ teach his disciples to pray by saying, "pray like this: Father..."?
If I have access to God, through Christ, why would I pray to someone dead, hopefully in Heaven, but who cannot hear my prayers? Just doesn't make sense.
If we are talking Old Testament God, I would think not. But the New Testament God seems a little more forgiving.
I thought there was only one true living God... maybe you think otherwise, but there is only one.
Hoss
Oh; wait...
I got that wrong.
I believe all the Bereans throughout history, not just those known as Bereans, have contributed significently more to the cause of Christ than the RCC and all its appendages.
But that’s just my opinion; The Lord is my judge.
Is that really the ratio? I was pondering that after debating with a Mormon the other day. I felt like I had a bit more in common with Catholics than Mormons but is it really a lot?
Nah...
...just how your chosen religion is going to get all the NAMES of those folks (and the ones in their graves) to be proxy baptized for them; so they can have a chance to accept Mormonism.
(That'll take a LOT of gold to make THEM plates!)
To get to the TOP level of 'heaven'; one MUST follow all the rules that SLC has set forth.
HEAVEN-The Mormon church teaches there are three levels of heaven (three "degrees of glory"):
SALVATION: A word that Mormons qualify in one of three ways: unconditional or general salvation is simply resurrection from the dead, granted to all through Christ's atonement; conditional or individual salvation involves entering the celestial kingdom through works of Mormonism; full salvation means exaltation to become a God as a result of temple ceremonies and other works. The word 'salvation' can have a two-fold meaning: a) forgiveness of sins and b) universal resurrection:
The Mormons have several different levels of "salvation".
I get the feeling that storm prepper is going to be with me on Level Two for a Very Long Time...
I’ve not seen any admission that he follows all the rules.
I need BIGGER ones!
What about their beliefs about the nature of God?
Did your god NOT 'will' that JS re-translate the KJV?
Didn't JS do it??
Why doesn't headquarters; high above SLC; consider it to be scripture???
See!
That wasn't so hard; was it!
Once again I repeat: The title is NOT to be found in the Bible.
I get that. The words ‘mother of God’ are not found anywhere in the Bible. As I stated in another post:
Very well. The phrase ‘mother of God’ is not found anywhere in Scripture. But does the fact that a specific phrase is not mentioned make it not so? Does that mean that the Son of God is not the “Second Person of the Trinity” because that specific phrase is not found in the Bible?
More importantly, is the concept or the essential truth of Mary as Mother of God found in Scripture? Does Scripture contradict the teaching that Mary is the Mother of God?
There are many verses that support the teaching that Mary is the mother of God. One such verse is:
“And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.”
This supports the concept that the child that “shall be born” was fully human and fully divine at the time of His birth. And by conceiving in her womb and bringing forth “that holy thing that shall be called the Son of God,” Mary did become the mother of this child in His humanity and in His divinity; that is, the mother of God incarnate.
I have not found anything in Scripture that contradicts this. It would be Scripture contradicting itself.
As a teenager and in my twenties, I fancied myself a future science-fiction master, such as Bob Heinlein or E.R. Eddison.
I could not have dreamt of anything wilder than did Joe Smith and those who embellished (corrected) his writings.
Almost...
...Jesus was 'fully divine'; BEFORE birth.
HE was 'fully devine' BEFORE the Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary.
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.
“Because the normal and natural connotation of mother denotes ontological oneness, making Mary as a goddess begetting a God after her nature.”
But Jesus has both human and Divine natures. Mary gave birth to a being that is ontologically fully human. God the Father provide the nature that is ontologically fully Divine. Jesus is both/and, not either/or. Mary gave birth to a person who has has both natures, but she did not provide any of the Divine nature, so it is not required that she be a goddess in order to still be Mother of God. Remember, this is a singular event in history, so the normal connotations go out the window.
Aquinas probably has the definitive answer on this, but I won’t have time to search the Summa Theologica for a while.
If this was a trial, you would be ruled out of order for failing to establish a foundation:
1. You failed to prove if ANY of these were EVER regarded as divinely authoritative.
2. You failed to prove if ANY church father even had any of these books in their possession to "toss out."
On top of that, Mormons overlook what Joseph Smith elected to "toss out" of the Book of Mormon...Smith gets a free pass on that, yet you seemingly think the worse of the early church fathers ... not even knowing what they had in their possession.
If those "gold plates" were so, and if Smith's dictation of them were accurate, then we know what he gave to Martin Harris included a portion of 1 Nephi that was not only "lost" but DELIBERATELY never "redictated" by Smith. (What? Did that hat he duck his head into become misplaced?)
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