Posted on 12/14/2014 11:57:21 AM PST by ealgeone
The reason for this article is to determine if the worship/veneration given to Mary by the catholic church is justified from a Biblical perspective. This will be evaluated using the Biblical standard and not man’s standard.
Then please show documented proof that the apostles taught it.
(I can say more and will in a while, but get this concept in your mind first.)
Dead faith is a faith that does not save, and though this form of regret with penalties for "forgiveness" has a great popular spread amongst Romanists, they do not monopolize it. That attitude is everywhere.
Ephesians 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--
The Greek word used there is ἐστε and is a verb in the present tense in the active voice. Paul also said it here:
Ephesians 2:5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.
Those who have been saved are in Christ.
2 Corinthians 1:21 Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us,
Those who have been saved will not face condemnation in any judgement.
Romans 8:1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,
The Catholic Church lies to it's followers in order that they might be beholden to them. Catholics would be wise to study scripture rather then parroting the false teachings of that church.
Ephesians 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God-- 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
Now it's after having been saved by grace that the works show up.
Ephesians 2:10 For we are God's handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
It is funny how the Prtestant Catholics quote-proofing always misses the important parts of the quote.
The Deuterocanonicals/Apocrypha were NOT considered scripture until the Catholic Church inserted them as has been shown multiple times on these threads.
And yet here you are responding.
ROFLOL!! You keep repeating that false assumption as if it was teaching by the apostles. Paul said if you teach something that we didn't teach you should be considered accursed. First of all, the woman in Revelation 12 is NOT Mary as you have been shown many times. Second, the vision in Revelation was future as John clearly stated. The Catholic Church claims that the apostles, and even Jesus, were present at Mary's end and witnessed Jesus taking her to heaven. For one that would make an extra visit by Christ to earth which He said would not happen. And if they were all there not one even mentioned such an important event for the Catholic Church. Preposterous!!
Mary's assumption is a completely made up fable by the Catholic Church. It's origin is in paganism.
Well done! Now we will see if “here to learn” means anything.
Quinisext Ecumenical Council, Canon 64: It does not befit a layman to dispute or teach publicly, thus claiming for himself authority to teach, but he should yield to the order appointed by the Lord, and to open his ears to those who have received the grace to teach, and be taught by them divine things; for in one Church God has made "different members," according to the word of the Apostle... But if any one be found weakening [disobeying] the present canon, he is to be cut off for forty days. — http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3814.htm
“the Church forbids the faithful to communicate with those unbelievers who have forsaken the faith they once received, either by corrupting the faith, as heretics, or by entirely renouncing the faith, as apostates, because the Church pronounces sentence of excommunication on both.” St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica; http://www.newadvent.org/summa/3010.htm
We furthermore forbid any lay person to engage in dispute, either private or public, concerning the Catholic Faith. Whosoever shall act contrary to this decree, let him be bound in the fetters of excommunication. — Pope Alexander IV (1254-1261) in “Sextus Decretalium”, http://oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Religious_Discussions Commenting on this, the Catholic Encyclopedia states,
“This law, like all penal laws, must be very narrowly construed. The terms Catholic Faith and dispute have a technical signification. The former term refers to questions purely theological; the latter to disputations more or less formal, and engrossing the attention of the public...But when there is a question of dogmatic or moral theology, every intelligent layman will concede the propriety of leaving the exposition and defense of it to the clergy.
But the clergy are not free to engage in public disputes on religion without due authorization...In the Collectanea S. Cong. de Prop. Fide" (p. 102, n. 294) we find the following decree, issued 8 March, 1625: "The Sacred Congregation has ordered that public discussions shall not be held with heretics...The Sacred Congregation enforced this decree with such vigour, that the custom of holding public disputes with heretics wellnigh fell into desuetude.
That this legislation is still in force appears from the letter addressed to the bishops of Italy by Cardinal Rampolla in the name of the Cong. for Ecclesiastical Affairs (27 Jan., 1902) in which it is declared that discussions with Socialists are subject to the decrees of the Holy See regarding public disputes with heretics; and, in accordance with the decree of Propaganda, 7 Feb., 1645, such public disputations are not to be permitted unless there is hope of producing greater good and unless the conditions prescribed by theologians are fulfilled. The Holy See, it is added, considering that these discussions often produce no result at all or even result in harm, has frequently forbidden them and ordered ecclesiastical superiors to prevent them; where this cannot be done, care must be taken that the discussions are not held without the authorization of the Apostolic See; and that only those who are well qualified to secure the triumph of Christian truth shall take part therein. It is evident, then, that no Catholic priest is ever permitted to become the aggressor or to issue a challenge to such a debate. - www.newadvent.org/cathen/05034a.htm
Do not converse with heretics even for the sake of defending the faith, for fear lest their words instil their poison in your mind. Bl. Isaias Boner of Krakow (Polish, Augustinian priest, theologian, professor of Scripture, d. 1471)
Can. 831 §1 Unless there is a just and reasonable cause, no member of Christ's faithful may write in newspapers, pamphlets or periodicals which clearly are accustomed to attack the catholic religion or good morals. Clerics and members of religious institutes may write in them only with the permission of the local Ordinary. - http://www.intratext.com/IXT/ENG0017/_P2P.HTM
And yet you reply.
The SINFUL Mary?
Who paid a SIN offering in the Temple?
Surely not!
or NEVER!
narses; eat yer heart out!
2 Peter 3 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)1 Behold this second epistle I write to you, my dearly beloved, in which I stir up by way of admonition your sincere mind: 2 That you may be mindful of those words which I told you before from the holy prophets, and of your apostles, of the precepts of the Lord and Saviour. 3 Knowing this first, that in the last days there shall come deceitful scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 4 Saying: Where is his promise or his coming? for since the time that the fathers slept, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. 5 For this they are wilfully ignorant of, that the heavens were before, and the earth out of water, and through water, consisting by the word of God. 6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished. 7 But the heavens and the earth which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of the ungodly men. 8 But of this one thing be not ignorant, my beloved, that one day with the Lord is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord delayeth not his promise, as some imagine, but dealeth patiently for your sake, not willing that any should perish, but that all should return to penance. 10 But the day of the Lord shall come as a thief, in which the heavens shall pass away with great violence, and the elements shall be melted with heat, and the earth and the works which are in it, shall be burnt up. 11 Seeing then that all these things are to be dissolved, what manner of people ought you to be in holy conversation and godliness? 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of the Lord, by which the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with the burning heat? 13 But we look for new heavens and a new earth according to his promises, in which justice dwelleth. 14 Wherefore, dearly beloved, waiting for these things, be diligent that you may be found before him unspotted and blameless in peace. 15 And account the longsuffering of our Lord, salvation; as also our most dear brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, hath written to you: 16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction. 17 You therefore, brethren, knowing these things before, take heed, lest being led aside by the error of the unwise, you fall from your own steadfastness. 18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and unto the day of eternity. Amen. |
There’s an ECHO in here!
Oh what a tangled web they weave! It’s rather comical to watch actually. And this present pope is surely adding to the popcorn sales.
That is the part that I thought was interesting. Not that the rest wasn't interesting, but this caught my eye.
Yes, and he is in Manila today. I did not go see him.
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