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Did Adam and Eve Really Exist?
Crisis Magazine ^ | November 24, 2014 | DENNIS BONNETTE

Posted on 11/24/2014 1:07:14 PM PST by NYer

the-fall-of-man-hendrick-goltzius

Pure myth! That is today’s typical view of a literal Adam and Eve. Yet, contrary to current skepticism, a real Adam and Eve remain credible—both in terms of Catholic doctrine and sound natural science.

By calling the Genesis story a “myth,” people avoid saying it is mere “fantasy,” that is, with no foundation in reality at all. While rejecting a literal first pair of human parents for all mankind, they hope to retain some “deeper” truth about an original “sinful human condition,” a “mythic” meaning. They think that the latest findings in paleoanthropology and genetics render a literal pair of first true human parents to be “scientifically impossible.”

The prevailing assumption underlying media reports about human origins is that humanity evolved very gradually over vast periods of time as a population (a collection of interbreeding organisms), which itself originally evolved from a Homo/Pan (human/chimpanzee) common ancestor millions of years ago. Therefore, we are not seen as descendants of the biblical Adam and Eve.

This universal evolutionary perspective leads many Catholics and others to conclude that a literal Adam and Eve is “scientifically impossible” for two reasons: First, paleoanthropologists deny the sudden appearance of intelligent, self-reflective, fully-human primates, but rather view the emergence of consciousness and intelligence as taking place slowly and incrementally over long periods of time. Second, in light of recent findings in molecular biology, especially from studies based on genetic data gleaned from the Human Genome Project, it is claimed that the hominin population (the primate group from which modern man is said to have arisen) has never had a bottleneck (reduced population) of a single mating pair in the last seven or more million years: no literal Adam and Eve. Many succumb to the modernist tendency to “adjust” Church teaching to fit the latest scientific claims—thus intimidating Catholics into thinking that divinely revealed truths can be abandoned—“if need be.”

This skepticism of a literal Adam and Eve begs for four much needed corrections.

First, Church teaching about Adam and Eve has not, and cannot, change. The fact remains that a literal Adam and Eve are unchanging Catholic doctrine. Central to St. Paul’s teaching is the fact that one man, Adam, committed original sin and that through the God-man, Jesus Christ, redemption was accomplished (Romans 5:12-21; 1 Cor. 15: 21-22). In paragraphs 396-406, the Catechism of the Catholic Church, speaks of Adam and Eve as a single mating pair who “committed a personal sin, but this sin affected the human nature that they would then transmit in a fallen state” (CCC, 404). “Baptism, by imparting the life of Christ’s grace, erases original sin and turns a man back toward God, but the consequences for nature, weakened and inclined to evil, persist in man and summon him to spiritual battle” (CCC, 405). The doctrines surrounding original sin cannot be altered “without undermining the mystery of Christ” (CCC, 389).

Today, many think that Pope Pius XII’s encyclical Humani generis did not definitively exclude theological polygenism. What they fail to notice, though, is that the Holy Father clearly insists that Scripture and the Magisterium affirm that original sin “proceeds from a sin truly committed by one Adam [ab uno Adamo]” and that this sin is transmitted to all true human beings through generation (para. 37). This proves that denial of a literal Adam (and his spouse, Eve) as the sole first genuinely human parents of all true human beings is not theologically tenable.

Second, rational human nature itself requires that mankind made an instant appearance on planet Earth. Paleoanthropological claims of gradual appearance of specifically human traits fail to comport with a true philosophy of human nature. Reflecting classical Christian thought, St. Thomas Aquinas demonstrates that true man is distinguished essentially from lower animals by possession of an intellectual and immortal soul, which possesses spiritual powers of understanding, judgment, and reasoning (Summa theologiae I, 75). While these qualitatively superior abilities are manifested through special forms of tool making or culture or art, they need not always be evident in the paleontological record. Sometimes true men share mere animal survival behavior and sometimes truly human behavior is lost to modern sight due to the ravages of time. What matters is that genuinely spiritual powers are either present or not, and that these alone bespeak the presence of true man. Irrational animals, including subhuman primates, are capable of complex sentient behaviors often approaching or imitating the rational activities of true man. But an animal either possesses a spiritual, intellectual soul or not. Thus at some point in time, true man suddenly appears—whether visible to modern science or not. Before that time, all subhuman behavior manifests merely material sensory abilities. The fact that positivistic scientists cannot discern the first presence of true man is hardly remarkable.

Third, a correct understanding of the scientific (inductive) method reveals that it cannot ever logically exclude the possibility of two sole founders of humanity. Natural scientific studies employ the inductive method of reasoning. Empirically observed data is employed to form testable hypotheses. Molecular biologists use computer models in an attempt to validate such hypotheses and reach conclusions about genetic conditions in early primate populations. In this process, some researchers have committed the logically invalid move of inferring from particular data to the universally negative claim that a literal Adam and Eve is impossible. Such methodology produces, at best, solely probable conclusions, based on available evidence and the assumptions used to evaluate the data. There is the inherent possibility that an unknown factor will alter the conclusion, similarly as was the unexpected discovery of black swans in Australia, when the whole world “knew” all swans were white.

Fourth, specific scientific arguments against Adam and Eve have proven not as forceful as many presently believe (Gauger 2012). For example, some have claimed that effective population size estimates for the last several million years would not permit just two true humans to have lived during that time. Still, the technical concept of average effective population size estimates should not be confused with an actual “bottleneck” (a temporarily reduced population) which may be much smaller. Effective population size estimates can vary from as high as 14,000 (Blum 2011) to as low as 2,000 (Tenesa 2007), depending on the methods used.

Such calculations rely upon many assumptions about mutation rate, recombination rate, and other factors, that are known to vary widely. All of this entails retrospective calculations about events in the far distant past, for which we have no directly verifiable data. For such reasons, some experts have concluded that effective population size cannot be determined using DNA sequence differences alone (Sjödin 2005; Hawks 2008).

Indeed, the most famous genetic study proclaimed as a “scientific objection” to Adam and Eve turned out to be based on methodological errors. An article by geneticist Francisco J. Ayala appearing in the journal, Science (1995), led many to believe that a founding population of only two individuals was impossible. Ayala based his challenge to monogenism (two sole founders of humanity) on the large number of versions (alleles) of the particular gene HLA-DRB1, which are present in the current population. Accepting the common ancestor theory, he claimed that there were thirty-two ancient lineages of the HLA-DRB1 gene prior to the Homo/Pan split (approximately seven million years ago). Over time, these “pre-split” lineages, themselves, evolved into the new additional versions present today. Because each individual carries only two versions of a gene, a single founding pair could not have passed on the thirty-two versions that Ayala claimed existed some seven million years ago—either at that time or at any time since. A bottleneck of just two true humans, Adam and Eve, was “scientifically impossible.”

However, Ayala’s claim of thirty-two ancient HLA-DRB1 lineages (prior to the Homo/Pan split) was wrong because of methodological errors. The number of lineages was subsequently adjusted by Bergström (1998) to just seven at the time of the split, with most of the genetic diversity appearing in the last 250,000 years. A still later study coming out of Bergström’s group inferred that just four such lineages existed more than five million years ago, but that a few more appeared soon thereafter (von Salomé 2007). While two mating hominins can transmit four lineages, the few additional later ones still require explanation.

These genetic studies, based on many assumptions and use of computer models, do not tell us how the origin of the human race actually took place. But, they do show (1) that methodological limitations and radical contingency are inherent in such studies, which are employed to make retroactive judgments about deeply ancient populations that can never be subject to direct observation, and (2) that present scientific claims against the possibility of a literal Adam and Eve are not definitive (Gauger 2012, 105-122).

Philosopher Kenneth W. Kemp and others have suggested that interbreeding between true humans and subhuman primates in the same biological population might account for presently observed genetic diversity (Kemp 2011). Such interbreeding is not to be confused with the marriages between true human siblings and cousins which would have occurred in the first generations following Adam and Eve, which unions were a necessary part of God’s plan for the initial propagation of mankind (Gen. 1:28).

The difficulty with any interbreeding solution (save, perhaps, in rare instances) is that it would place at the human race’s very beginning a severe impediment to its healthy growth and development. Natural law requires that marriage and procreation take place solely between a man and a woman, so that children are given proper role models for adult life. So too, even if the union between a true human and a subhuman primate were not merely transitory, but lasting, the defective parenting and role model of a parent who is not a true human being would introduce serious disorder in the proper functioning of the family and education of children. Hence, widespread interbreeding is not an acceptable solution to the problem of genetic diversity.

Moreover, given the marked reduction in the number of ancient HLA-DRB1 alleles found by the later genetic studies of Bergström and von Salomé, it may turn out that no interbreeding is needed at all, or at most, that very rare instances of it may have occurred. Such rare events might not even entail the consent of true human beings, since they could result from an attack by a subhuman male upon a non-consenting human female.

A literal Adam and Eve remains rationally, scientifically credible.

Since the same God is author both of human reason and of authentic revelation, legitimate natural science, properly conducted, will never contradict Catholic doctrine, properly understood. Catholic doctrine still maintains that a literal Adam and Eve must have existed, a primal couple who committed that personal original sin, which occasioned the need for, and the divine promise of, the coming of the Redeemer, Jesus Christ.

Editor’s note: The image above is a detail from “The Fall of Man” painted by Hendrik Goltzius in 1616.



TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; Religion & Science; Theology
KEYWORDS: adam; adamandeve; creation; crevo; crevolist; eve; evolution; fazalerana; gardenofeden; genesis; hughross; originalparents; origins
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To: Partisan Gunslinger

Actually, the remnant of 7000 refers to 1Kings 19:18, which happened in the past. The Romans 11 context refers simply to a modern day remnant, exact number not specified in that passage.


881 posted on 11/30/2014 9:48:08 AM PST by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: redleghunter
Using your own metric of "verse by verse, chapter by chapter, book by book" where else in the NT do we see clear evidence of a 7000 number of stand outs?

I'd say Matthew chapter 10 is dealing with some of the 7000. Some of the 7000 will be arrested and brought up to testify. Many will be saved through their testimony. Maybe some of you who don't believe in the 7000 will hear the testimony and will remember this thread and come to your senses regarding the great deceiver.

882 posted on 11/30/2014 9:56:44 AM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: Cvengr
Actually, the remnant of 7000 refers to 1Kings 19:18, which happened in the past. The Romans 11 context refers simply to a modern day remnant, exact number not specified in that passage.

Yeah, it could be any number relative to the population today. I said earlier on this thread that even if it's in the hundreds of thousands, it's not much in a world of 7 billion.

883 posted on 11/30/2014 9:58:59 AM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
Rather than any cult being "the winner" in the end, we know that it is Jesus Christ who will win in the end and not a tiny, set-apart group that imagines they alone know the real truth.

Rom 11:4 says that only 7000 will not fall for antiChrist.

Actually, no, it doesn't say that. This has been explained to you already with numerous Bible verses to prove you are wrong to think it does. Ignore it if you wish. You can claim Arnold Murray doesn't "decide" who are among that 7000, but you yourself already claimed it WOULD be people who followed Murray, including yourself. If you misspoke, admit it, it would garner more respect than stubbornly holding on to a false assertion after being shown wrong.

Relax, you aren't being persecuted, nobody is coming for you to burn you at the stake. This is a forum where people can freely discuss what they believe and why they believe it.

So after 400 posts you're giving up on falsely painting me as a racist. lol

Show me where I did that, whiner.

884 posted on 11/30/2014 11:49:54 AM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: redleghunter
Where are the 7000 in Revelation? OT prophecies? Teachings of Christ? One verse out of context does not make an exegesis.

I guess it does if one is following a man who tells them it does. That's the danger of swallowing someone's teaching without doing due diligence - as Paul praised the noble Bereans who DID make sure to determine of what they were being told was so, that it matched up with what Scripture said.

But, whether one believes a fraction of Christians will not apostatize or not, what matters is that the gospel NEVER changes. We are saved by the grace of God through faith and not of ourselves or our works. I imagine the few who fall prey to false teaching on minor issues such as this claim of only 7000 being saved out of the Tribulation, will be pleasantly (I hope) surprised when they find themselves among the countless number of the redeemed in heaven. I doubt it will matter then.

885 posted on 11/30/2014 12:16:37 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: Elsie

Sad, isn’t it, when so-called “Christian” Conservatives resort to the same deceptive techniques as the Left?


886 posted on 11/30/2014 12:58:35 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
You believe in the rapture?

Yes, I do. I also know WHY I believe it and can prove it by Scripture. What's one more rabbit trail on a thread 800+ posts long?

887 posted on 11/30/2014 1:09:42 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: Partisan Gunslinger; Cvengr; redleghunter
>>Actually, the remnant of 7000 refers to 1Kings 19:18, which happened in the past. The Romans 11 context refers simply to a modern day remnant, exact number not specified in that passage.<<

Yeah, it could be any number relative to the population today. I said earlier on this thread that even if it's in the hundreds of thousands, it's not much in a world of 7 billion.

Now "it COULD be"? That has been our argument all along - that God ALWAYS has a remnant! It has been you, parroting Arnold Murray, who continues to assert it will only be 7000. Finally some clarity.

888 posted on 11/30/2014 1:36:24 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: redleghunter
redleghunter: "Let me ask a different way:
Where is ‘here’ for you? Meaning where can we as Christians and even Hebrews/Jews take the historical record of Scriptures as literally true?"

Hmmmmm... I answered your question the first time, apparently you didn't like the answer, so you repeat it, hoping to hear something different?

Well, first, by definition of the word "science", there's no possible way to prove scientifically what is or is not "literally true" in the Bible.
But what any reasonable person must conclude is that those who wrote it down did believe every word, and indeed had often themselves experienced it.
A question then, might be: "can we believe what they believed?"

Well, for starters, the Bible is not a "literal" document, period, but requires translations of translations -- i.e., ancient Aramaic to ancient Greek to Latin to modern English, or ancient Hebrew to Greek to English.
Indeed, most of the reason why we now have dozens of modern English translations is that each one hopes to more usefully **paraphrase** for modern readers what was intended by the ancients.
So, what the ancients themselves understood is often lost in translation.

However, since much of the Bible's history can be confirmed by archaeology and other ancient written sources, we know for certain, it's not like Greek mythology, but based in historical facts and real people.
Further, its message has nothing to do with science, but rather with our spiritual lives, and God's role in history, as the Master of nature, as Holy Spirit and even, as a Human.
So confirming the Bible has nothing to do with various branches of science, but rather in our spiritual quests learning how it can speak to, and direct, our searches for higher meaning & better life.
That makes the question not: "did it really happen precisely as described?", because we can't know that answer scientifically, but rather, "does the Bible's message still speak to our souls?" and that we can certainly answer, if we are ready for it.

Bottom line: I believe the ancients wrote down what they experienced, and their messages can be of huge benefit to our souls.
But if we use science to "disprove" the Bible, we do so at risk of losing our souls.
So Matthew 16:26 come to mind...

Now, FRiend, I've answered your question politely, twice.
If you like my answer, that's great, if not that's fine too, you might wish to explain yourself.
But if you go stupid on me, and ask it a third time, the third answer won't be so polite.

889 posted on 11/30/2014 2:04:59 PM PST by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective..)
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To: editor-surveyor
editor-surveyor: "were you a believer, and studied in the word of God, you would have known that there are no “natural explanations of natural processes."

Please stop projecting your own ignorance onto me.
Just because you don't grasp it, doesn't me I don't.

What you don't "get" is that the US was Founded by men of the Age of Enlightenment, for whom the word "science" was just short for their term "natural science", which is expressly defined by the idea of "methodological naturalism", meaning: "natural explanations for natural processes".

The whole ideal of our Founders' "natural science" was to separate it from anything spiritual, metaphysical or supernatural, and limit science to those processes & explanations considered "natural".
Of course, our Founders never denied the existence of God, they were all at least "Deists".
But they believed that much of nature is ruled by natural laws, and they thought that was the proper realm for "natural science".

And indeed, "natural science" has proved amazingly powerful in transforming our material lives from that of our Founders' time to today.
But it has also come at an equal and opposite cost to our spiritual lives, which cannot be denied.
But for you to claim that "natural explanations for natural processes" just don't exist, is just to deny everything you see around you.

So, do I believe that God operates in and through "nature"?
Absolutely, in every conceivable way, but that is not to deny the fact that natural-science usefully explains things in terms which are consciously intended to exclude a supernatural component.

editor-surveyor: "The universe is not something that occurred by “natural” means, but by a deliberate work of special creation.
The fact that all that has been promoted in favor of “natural processes” has been shown to be fraudulent should give you pause."

Of course the Universe was created by God, according to logic and my faith, but natural-science is by design intended to exclude such explanations.
That does not make science a "fraud", unless you wish to claim that every modern convenience & technology is also somehow a "fraud".
I'd disagree.
But if you take your search for God to natural-science, then you must find Him there yourself -- all by yourself, with no help, no assistance, no obvious "pointing the way" from science.

editor-surveyor: "All things physical that exist were planned.
No understanding is evident in your posts."

Agreed with the first, as for the second: huge ignorance is obvious in your posts.

890 posted on 11/30/2014 2:43:54 PM PST by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective..)
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To: boatbums
Actually, no, it doesn't say that. This has been explained to you already with numerous Bible verses to prove you are wrong to think it does. Ignore it if you wish. You can claim Arnold Murray doesn't "decide" who are among that 7000, but you yourself already claimed it WOULD be people who followed Murray, including yourself.

No, I said in those 7000, there would be a lot of students who learned from him since he is the only one that teaches how to recognize the antiChrist.

Show me where I did that, whiner.

Racist, cult, same difference.

891 posted on 11/30/2014 3:18:22 PM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: BroJoeK

The ignorance is deliberate, and all yours.

Creation is not a “natural process.”

The age of enlightenment will be when you and the rest of the unbelievers stand in awe of the first resurrection, knowing that the ten days of the wrath of Yehova are about to be poured out on the world.

Trying to manipulate the word of God to create room for natural processes to replace acts of special creation is not an industry of promise.


892 posted on 11/30/2014 3:18:48 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: boatbums
Yes, I do. I also know WHY I believe it and can prove it by Scripture. What's one more rabbit trail on a thread 800+ posts long?

Believe what you wish. I'd be careful throwing that "cult" name around though when the rapture doctrine didn't come around until the 1800s.

893 posted on 11/30/2014 3:20:38 PM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: boatbums
Now "it COULD be"? That has been our argument all along - that God ALWAYS has a remnant! It has been you, parroting Arnold Murray, who continues to assert it will only be 7000. Finally some clarity.

If it's so important to you, why don't you remember me saying it on this thread? The point is that the whole world will fall for antiChrist, except the 7000.

894 posted on 11/30/2014 3:23:09 PM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: Partisan Gunslinger; boatbums

>> “there would be a lot of students who learned from him since he is the only one that teaches how to recognize the antiChrist.” <<

.
Gibberish!

The word of God tells us in clear terms how to recognize the antichrist.

It says that he will stand on the “holy place” and declare himself to be God.

Do you have even the foggiest notion what the “holy place” is? Holy means “set apart.”

It is the unused side of the “mercy seat” of the ark of the covenant.

It will be unmistakable.

The fact that it happens at Purim will also be a huge clue.

What does Mr “Mud People” teach?
.


895 posted on 11/30/2014 3:28:37 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: boatbums
Now "it COULD be"? That has been our argument all along - that God ALWAYS has a remnant! It has been you, parroting Arnold Murray, who continues to assert it will only be 7000.

Arnold has also said it doesn't have to be exactly 7000. The "7000" identifies the people we're talking about, the very elect. You let these little things become such stumblingblocks to you.

896 posted on 11/30/2014 3:28:41 PM PST by Partisan Gunslinger
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To: Partisan Gunslinger
"Where did I say that? I just asked for proof, in your own words. Looks like you don't have any proof."

No, you didn't. You said you'd never heard of it, and when I told you it was easily found online, said, "Okaaaay."

So far you've dismissed everything folks have offered you about your leader. What reason do I have to think you'd respond differently this time?

Google it if you want the truth.

897 posted on 11/30/2014 3:45:28 PM PST by CatherineofAragon ((Support Christian white males---the architects of the jewel known as Western Civilization.))
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To: Partisan Gunslinger

Revelation tells us that the very elect will be 144,000.


898 posted on 11/30/2014 3:47:16 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: CatherineofAragon

Ya gotta love the tap dance he does in the corner!

.


899 posted on 11/30/2014 3:48:48 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Freepers: Not as smart as I'd hoped they'd be)
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To: Elsie; Partisan Gunslinger
See!

you canNOT fight emotion with logic!"

I have to hand it to Partisan Gunslinger...he's taught me the absolute truth of that.

900 posted on 11/30/2014 3:55:04 PM PST by CatherineofAragon ((Support Christian white males---the architects of the jewel known as Western Civilization.))
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