The saint who opposed Luther

Catholic Herald ^ | August 7, 2012

[NYer]

St Cajetan (1480-1547) was, like his contemporary Martin Luther, deeply concerned by the worldliness and decadence he saw among the clergy. He, however, sought to reform the Church from within, founding the Order of the Theatines.

This was the first congregation of regular clergy. Its aims were to preach sound doctrine, to tend the poor and the sick, to restore frequent use of the sacraments and to inspire better priestly conduct.

Born into the nobility of Vicenza as Gaetano dei Conti di Tiene, Cajetan lost his father at two. His mother brought him up to be both studious and devout.

After becoming a doctor in civil and canon law at Padua in 1504, he was protonotary to Pope Julius II in Rome from 1506 to 1513. Ordained in 1516, he returned to Vicenza two years later.

In Rome he had been associated with a group of zealous clergy styling themselves the Oratory of Divine Love. Back in Vicenza, he entered the Oratory of St Jerome and founded a hospital for incurables.

“In the Oratory,” he said, “we try to serve God by worship; in our hospital we may say that we actually find Him.” He went on to create hospitals in Verona and Venice.

Distressed by what he saw of the clergy, Cajetan returned to Rome in 1523 to confer with his friends in the Oratory of Divine Love. These included Pietro Carafa, Bishop of Chieti, a fiercely intransigent prelate who would be elected Pope Paul IV in 1555. With Carafa, Cajetan established in 1524 a new order, naming them the Theatines, after the Latin name for Chieti (Theate Marricinorum). There was particular emphasis on poverty and on thorough biblical training.

Carafa became the first superior-general, though Cajetan filled that office from 1530 to 1533. Perhaps due to Carafa’s uncompromising nature, the order did not immediately flourish. Moreover, it had to flee to Venice when the Emperor Charles V sacked Rome in 1527.

After 1533 Carafa sent Cajetan first to Verona, and then to Naples, where the Theatines gradually became respected for their stand against the city’s corruption and indifference to the poor. Cajetan established pawnshops which were run purely for the benefit of their users.

Among the Theatines at Naples from 1547 was the Englishman Thomas Goldwell, who had fled from Henry VIII’s regime. In 1555, under Queen Mary, he was appointed Bishop of Asaph, before once again being obliged to leave England under Queen Elizabeth. From 1561 Goldwell was briefly superior-general at Naples. He would live to be the last survivor of Mary’s bishops.

For 250 years the Theatines flourished in western Europe, as well as conducting foreign missions. In the 19th century, however, they fell into decline. In 2005 they numbered only some 200 religious, mainly in Spain and South America.

[spunkets]

"1545-1564) ... Source please! This is nonsense. Bibles were copied by hand in those days.

The Gutenberg Bible was being printed from 1454 on in Mainz, Germany.

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“But we might note that reformers like Wycliffe were burned at the stake for translating it into the common language (English). This was a terrible policy and a terrible occurrence.”

And it never happened. Wycliffe was dead for more than 40 years (of a stroke) when his bones were burned. He was never charged with, tried for, or burned for translating the Bible since that wasn’t a crime.

It never ceases to amaze me how many Protestant anti-Catholics are poorly educated enough to actually believe Wycliffe was executed or executed for translating the Bible. Wycliffe was a heretic. And Protestant anti-Catholics are just ignorant.

[vladimir998]

That’s not the quote Iscool, but I give you credit for trying to save your buddy from the embarrassment of being caught out. The quote in question is apparently a bogus one. It is not in the text. None of the keywords appera in the text in that combination. Only anti-Catholic books and websites cite the quote. Anti-Catholics are known liars so this should not be a surprise.

[vladimir998]

You wrote:

“The Gutenberg Bible was being printed from 1454 on in Mainz, Germany.”

And yet people hand copied Bibles until. . . well, today. People in the last few centuries did it whe they had little money or as an act of devotion. The Brethren - a modern day cult - copies NTs by hand, for instance.

[OKSooner]

Good point.

I know someone who's living in a circular firing squad, complete with a certain professing christian talking about who ought to be "stood up and shot" or "strung up from the nearest lamp post" for this or that - aggravated littering, for example.

It kinda bugs me and I'm inclined to think that with craziness mixed with christianity there might be some edifying history to look at.

Your point stands, though, it's probably way over my pay grade...

[DManA]

Amazing how these threads begin with an insulting frontal assault on Protestants and pretty soon it’s all about defending poor put upon Catholics.

[Religion Moderator]

Again, I need the source. When quoting a website, be sure to include the source information so that the moderators can enforce copyright restrictions.

[Alamo-Girl]

I suspect the quote may have been derived by someone's paraphrasing the texts from the Council of Trent and went from there to people quoting it as if it were an actual translation.

During Clinton's day people were saying "It's all about sex, sex, sex" as if that is what Starr said. It wasn't but repetition makes things stick.

The following text, for instance, may have been paraphrased that way from the observer perspective of a "Reformed" Christian reading it and summing it up:

The Council of Trent - Canons and Decrees - The Fourth Session

Celebrated on the eighth day of the month of April, in the year 1546.

DECREE CONCERNING THE EDITION, AND THE USE, OF THE SACRED BOOKS

Moreover, the same sacred and holy Synod,--considering that no small utility may accrue to the Church of God, if it be made known which out of all the Latin editions, now in circulation, of the sacred books, is to be held as authentic,--ordains and declares, that the said old and vulgate edition, which, by the lengthened usage of so many years, has been approved of in the Church, be, in public lectures, disputations, sermons and expositions, held as authentic; and that no one is to dare, or presume to reject it under any pretext whatever.

Furthermore, in order to restrain petulant spirits, It decrees, that no one, relying on his own skill, shall,--in matters of faith, and of morals pertaining to the edification of Christian doctrine, --wresting the sacred Scripture to his own senses, presume to interpret the said sacred Scripture contrary to that sense which holy mother Church,--whose it is to judge of the true sense and interpretation of the holy Scriptures,--hath held and doth hold; or even contrary to the unanimous consent of the Fathers; even though such interpretations were never (intended) to be at any time published. Contraveners shall be made known by their Ordinaries, and be punished with the penalties by law established.

And wishing, as is just, to impose a restraint, in this matter, also on printers, who now without restraint,--thinking, that is, that whatsoever they please is allowed them,--print, without the license of ecclesiastical superiors, the said books of sacred Scripture, and the notes and comments upon them of all persons indifferently, with the press ofttimes unnamed, often even fictitious, and what is more grievous still, without the author's name; and also keep for indiscriminate sale books of this kind printed elsewhere; (this Synod) ordains and decrees, that, henceforth, the sacred Scripture, and especially the said old and vulgate edition, be printed in the most correct manner possible; and that it shall not be lawful for any one to print, or cause to be printed, any books whatever, on sacred matters, without the name of the author; nor to sell them in future, or even to keep them, unless they shall have been first examined, and approved of, by the Ordinary; under pain of the anathema and fine imposed in a canon of the last Council of Lateran: and, if they be Regulars, besides this examination and approval, they shall be bound to obtain a license also from their own superiors, who shall have examined the books according to the form of their own statutes. As to those who lend, or circulate them in manuscript, without their having been first examined, and approved of, they shall be subjected to the same penalties as printers: and they who shall have them in their possession or shall read them, shall, unless they discover the authors, be themselves regarded as the authors. And the said approbation of books of this kind shall be given in writing; and for this end it shall appear authentically at the beginning of the book, whether the book be written, or printed; and all this, that is, both the approbation and the examination, shall be done gratis, that so what ought to be approved, may be approved, and what ought to be condemned, may be condemned.

Besides the above, wishing to repress that temerity, by which the words and sentences of sacred Scripture are turned and twisted to all sorts of profane uses, to wit, to things scurrilous, fabulous, vain, to flatteries, detractions, superstitions, impious and diabolical incantations, sorceries, and defamatory libels; (the Synod) commands and enjoins, for the doing away with this kind of irreverence and contempt, and that no one may hence forth dare in any way to apply the words of sacred Scripture to these and such like purposes; that all men of this description, profaners and violators of the word of God, be by the bishops restrained by the penalties of law, and others of their own appointment.

INDICTION OF THE NEXT SESSION

Likewise, this sacred and holy Synod resolves and decrees, that the next ensuing Session be held and celebrated on the Thursday after the next most sacred festival of Pentecost.

Indeed, to a non-Catholic Christian of today this would read as a rough equivalent to "book burning."

God's Name is I AM.

[Persevero]

“Again, I need the source.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Luther

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/secrets/previous_seasons/case_bible/

http://www.greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/john-hus.html

[Persevero]

Quite right, I briefly confused Tyndale (murdered for his Bible translation and distribution) with Wycliffe.

Here was Wycliffe’s fate, also indefensible:

“The Council of Constance declared Wycliffe (on 4 May 1415) a heretic and under the ban of the Church. It was decreed that his books be burned and his remains be exhumed. The exhumation was carried out in 1428 when, at the command of Pope Martin V, his remains were dug up, burned, and the ashes cast into the River Swift, which flows through Lutterworth. This is the most final of all posthumous attacks on John Wycliffe, but previous attempts had been made before the Council of Constance. The Anti-Wycliffite Statute of 1401 extended persecution to Wycliffe’s remaining followers. The “Constitutions of Oxford” of 1408 aimed to reclaim authority in all ecclesiastical matters, specifically naming John Wycliffe in a ban on certain writings, and noting that translation of Scripture into English by unlicensed laity is a crime punishable by charges of heresy.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Wycliffe#Declared_a_heretic.3B_body_exhumed_and_destroyed

[Natural Law]

"Indeed, to a non-Catholic Christian of today this would read as a rough equivalent to "book burning."

I suppose that to those who have become accustomed to finding the meaning they desire in what is clearly written to mean otherwise that is an acceptable reason, but it is no excuse to repeatedly pillory the Church with falsehoods. One can only wonder what those very same "non-Catholic Christians" would do or would have done had someone published and represented the Book of Mormon as the Bible.

Furthermore, in order to restrain petulant spirits, It decrees, that no one, relying on his own skill, shall,--in matters of faith, and of morals pertaining to the edification of Christian doctrine, --wresting the sacred Scripture to his own senses, presume to interpret the said sacred Scripture contrary to that sense which holy mother Church,--whose it is to judge of the true sense and interpretation of the holy Scriptures,--hath held and doth hold; or even contrary to the unanimous consent of the Fathers; even though such interpretations were never (intended) to be at any time published. Contraveners shall be made known by their Ordinaries, and be punished with the penalties by law established.

Peace be with you

[Salvation]

You are a conservative, right?

Then why do you believe wiki and pbs? Both leftist sources????????

Oh my, where’s the credibility here?

[Persevero]

Salvation,

wikipedia is just a conglomeration of known, cited sources. The biographies I have cited are not opinion pieces. The facts are the Luther was excommunicated; subject to a papal bull; condemned as an outlaw which made him legal to murder. Wycliff was indeed persecuted, Bible translation into common languages was banned, people were killed for it, Tyndale was one of them, Wycliff was dug out of his grave and burned.

These are facts, no historian of any repute disputes them. They are a matter of written record. The fact that they are conglomerated on Wiki does not make them false.

As for PBS, the history series they do called “Secrets of the Dead” is very good. I used their synopsis for their Bible history episode because it is good and summarized the situation succinctly.

I watch all manner of things on PBS, including most of their war history, which I find to be excellent quality. I know they are political liberals, but do you find nothing of value to see on it? I do.

What fact do you dispute? Luther’s excommunication? The papal bull? The outlaw declaration? Tyndale’s persecution and death? Wycliff’s persecution and exhumation? Foxe’s Book of Martyrs? The Inquisition?

These are historical facts, substantiated by plenty of recorded evidence, and their being summarized on Wikipedia or by PBS does not make them lies.

[Natural Law]

"I briefly confused Tyndale (murdered for his Bible translation and distribution) with Wycliffe."

"It was not the Catholic Church that execute Tyndale, but the Church of England after Tyndale said that the king's divorce was unbiblical.

St. Thomas More commented that searching for errors in the Tyndale Bible was similar to searching for water in the sea. Protestant Bishop Tunstall of London, certainly no friend of the Catholic Church, declared that there were upwards of 2,000 errors in Tyndale's Bible. Tyndale translated the term baptism into "washing;" Scripture into "writing;" Holy Ghost into "Holy Wind," Bishop into "Overseer," Priest into "Elder," Deacon into "Minister;" heresy into "choice;" martyr into "witness;" evangelist into "bearer of good news;" etc., etc. Many of his footnotes were vicious. For instance, Tyndale referred to the occupant of the Chair of Peter, as "that great idol, the whore of Babylon, the anti-Christ of Rome."

But most offensive and heretical was the Prologue which specifically attacked Church doctrines and teachings. His most fatal flaw was secular. In his rants he opposed rule by divine right and claimed that true power and rightful ownership of riches were for the "elect" (of which he just happened to be a prominent member).

In 1530, Tyndale wrote The Practyse of Prelates, opposing Henry VIII's divorce on the grounds that it was unscriptural and was a plot by Cardinal Wolsey to get Henry entangled in the papal courts. This resulted in the king's wrath being directed at him: he asked the emperor Charles V to have Tyndale apprehended and returned to England. Eventually, Tyndale was betrayed to the authorities. He was seized in Antwerp in 1535, betrayed by Henry Phillips, and imprisoned for 16 months in the castle of Vilvoorde near Brussels. He was tried on a charge of heresy in 1536 and sentenced to death by the Holy Roman Empire. The heresy that he was charged with was opposing the head of the Church of England - Henry VIII, not the Pope or the Catholic Church. Tyndale's final words, spoken "at the stake with a fervent zeal, and a loud voice", were reported as "Lord! Open the King of England's eyes."

"To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant" - Blessed John Henry Newman (Former Protestant)

Peace be with you

[Salvation]

If you look closely, many Catholic articles on wiki have misinformation in them, since readers can submit info. (And many have submitted mis-information which wiki then displays as truth.)

I don’t care what the program is on PBS, you are getting a leftist point of view.

[Theo]

Roman Catholic FReepers are among the most ungodly people I’ve ever come across. Predictably antagonistic, predictably arrogant.

OKSooner — talking with vlad is not worth anyone’s time. Nasty, nasty, nasty.

[Persevero]

Fine, ditch PBS and its documentaries, and stick with history texts. You will find the same information.

The Roman Catholic church persecuted and killed people for such things as translating the Bible, distributing the Bible, distributing tracts, and preaching.

It’s also done a lot of good things. I am not a “Catholic-basher,” i.e., I will give credit where credit is due. For example I don’t believe the RCs helped Hitler, and I believe many helped the Jews, some heroically. More recently, I appreciated the RC’s role in helping pass Prop. 8 in California. Etc.

But you have to be honest about your history, and deal with it, as we all do. Where sins were committed, there must be repentance.

[Belteshazzar]

Thank you, Alamo-Girl, for going to the source and posting it. It does little good simply to argue without knowing who actually said what.

Let’s see if the discussion can become a little more objective and substantive ... and honoring of Him who is, indisputably, head of the Church, Jesus Christ.

[Persevero]

Natural Law, I stand with the martyrs (unworthily, but I’m there).

The blood cries out. The persecution and murders can not be denied. The RC church should confess it and repent of it and move on. I do not hate Catholics, and I don’t think the majority of Catholics today would support such behavior. It does no one any service, least of all the RC church, to try to obfuscate it or say it doesn’t count because PBS references it in a documentary; or because articles on wiki reference it.

I am not going to pretend the persecutions, Inquisition, and burnings at stakes etc. did not happen.

The martyrs deserve better than that.

[Persevero]

As to the Blessed Henry Newman, and his observations about learning from history, I recommend to him Foxe’s Book of Martyrs, an excerpt here from chapter IV, but one can read many accounts of the persecution of Christians by the Pope at the considered time, very awful, sustained, and bloody horror:

“Thus far our history of persecution has been confined principally to the pagan world. We come now to a period, when persecution under the guise of christianity, committed more enormities than ever disgraced the annals of paganism. Disregarding the maxims and the spirit of the gospel, the papal church, arming herself with the power of the sword, vexed the church of God and wasted it for several centuries, a period most appropriately termed in history, the “dark ages.” The kings of the earth, gave their power to the “beast,” and submitted to be trodden on by the miserable vermin that often filled the papal chair, as in the case of Henry, emperor of Germany. The storm of papal persecution first burst upon the Waldenses in France.

Persecution of the Waldenses in France.

Popery having brought various innovations into the church, and overspread the christian world with darkness and superstition, some few, who plainly perceived the pernicious tendency of such errors, determined to show the light of the gospel in its real purity, and to disperse those clouds which artful priests had raised about it, in order to blind the people, and obscure its real brightness.

The principal among these was Berengarius, who, about the year 1000, boldly preached gospel truths, according to their primitive purity. Many, from conviction, assented to his doctrine, and were, on that account, called Berengarians. To Berengarius succeeded Peter Bruis, who preached at Thoulouse, under the protection of an earl, named Hildephonsus; and the whole tenets of the reformers, with the reasons of their separation from the church of Rome, were published in a book written by Bruis, under the title of Anti-Christ.[54]

By the year of Christ 1140, the number of the reformed was very great, and the probability of its increasing alarmed the pope, who wrote to several princes to banish them from their dominions, and employed many learned men to write against their doctrines.

A. D. 1147, Henry of Thoulouse, being deemed their most eminent preacher, they were called Henericians; and as they would not admit of any proofs relative to religion, but what could be deduced from the scriptures themselves, the popish party gave them the name of apostolics. At length, Peter Waldo, or Valdo, a native of Lyons, eminent for his piety and learning, became a strenuous opposer of popery; and from him the reformed, at that time, received the appellation of Waldenses or Waldoys.

Pope Alexander III being informed by the bishop of Lyons of these transactions, excommunicated Waldo and his adherents, and commanded the bishop to exterminate them, if possible, from the face of the earth; and hence began the papal persecutions against the Waldenses.

The proceedings of Waldo and the reformed, occasioned the first rise of the inquisitors; for pope Innocent III. authorized certain monks as inquisitors, to inquire for, and deliver over, the reformed to the secular power. The process was short, as an accusation was deemed adequate to guilt, and a candid trial was never granted to the accused.

The pope, finding that these cruel means had not the intended effect, sent several learned monks to preach among the Waldenses, and to endeavour to argue them out of their opinions. Among these monks was one Dominic, who appeared extremely zealous in the cause of popery. This Dominic instituted an order, which, from him, was called the order of Dominican friars; and the members of this order have ever since been the principal inquisitors in the various inquisitions in the world. The power of the inquisitors was unlimited; they proceeded against whom they pleased, without any consideration of age, sex, or rank. Let the accusers be ever so infamous, the accusation was deemed valid; and even anonymous informations, sent by letter, were thought sufficient evidence. To be rich was a crime equal to heresy; therefore many who had money were accused of heresy, or of being favourers of heretics, that they might be obliged to pay for their opinions. The dearest friends or nearest kindred could not, without danger, serve any one who was imprisoned on account of religion. To convey to those who were confined, a little straw, or give them a cup of water, was called favouring of the heretics, and they were prosecuted accordingly. No lawyer dared to plead for his own brother, and their malice even extended beyond the grave; hence the bones of many were dug up and burnt, as examples to the living. If a man on his death-bed was accused of being a follower of Waldo, his estates were confiscated, and the heir to them defrauded of his inheritance; and some were sent to the[55] Holy Land, while the Dominicans took possession of their houses and properties, and, when the owners returned, would often pretend not to know them. These persecutions were continued for several centuries under different popes and other great dignitaries of the catholic church.”

Foxe’s Book of Martyrs is a long book, and historically authentic, and despite it perhaps being referenced on wikipedia or perhaps even public television, should be given the utmost credence.

Learn from history, indeed. We all should.