Posted on 06/21/2011 3:51:29 PM PDT by NoGrayZone
Okay, here's the deal in a long story short. I was raised Lutheran, moved out to Long Island and continued to be raised in St. Paul's Lutheran Church.
Aunt Jeannie (my name sake) has been a member since. I decided years ago I wanted back, so I went.
I did not feel Him there, thought it was me. I kept looking around the congregation, thinking it was me. After a while, I realized it wasn't (a couple of things happened after that confirmed it wasn't me).
Anywho, the icing on the cake was my Aunt Jeannie stopped going as well. After almost 30 years she felt the change as well. I looked up our church and saw they were apart of the "accept homosexuals as Pastors" crowd. That was 1 of the things that confirmed it was not me.
But my Aunt Jeannie leaving was the icing on the cake.
Here's our delima. Both of us are July babies. She is the 2nd, I am the 18th. We decided on 7/17 we would find a church to attend (we both want one to belong to and believe in), then go have brunch to discuss.
She is much more open minded than I am, but I promised her I would be open minded, if just for an hour, on that day.
I said to her, during our conversation "how do we know if the "Pastor" is a homo or not. She believes He is with us no matter where we are. I agree....to a point. I don't believe a homosexual can be one of His Shepard's leading His herd if that is so.
There have been so many "demoninations" coming out for homosexual "Shepard's" I have NO idea where to begin.
I have called a few churches and left messages for the Pastor to call back so I can interview Him (no lady Pastors for me).
Any advise to where we can look? Anyone know anything about Presbyterians?
NGZ: I do, I always have. Whenever the pastor would say "take and eat, this is my body, given to you, do this in remembrance of me" I ALWAYS took it literally! Same with the wine.
But then look here, my sincere advice -- as you truly believe this, you will do yourself a dis-service if you go to a Presbyterian/Pentecostal/any group that does not believe in this -- and you will do them a dis-service
The belief that Christ is really with us -- when it finally struck home (I'm a very literal, logical, engineering type) was incredible to me -- you always believed this, mine was 'ok,ok' until it struck me
This belief, that we are in the true presence of God Himself, that we SEE His sacrifice, we are present at the cross, not symbolically, not metaphorically but truly, ACTUALLY seeing His sacrifice, that is incredible
That is a real personal relationship with God, at least to me
But back to my point -- you truly believe this, if I were you, I would look only at Churches that truly believe this
I myself am a cradle Catholic, but I can understand the cultural shock that many non-Catholics have when they think of The Church - a lot of misbeliefs etc., and I would really suggest one go and read the early church history, pray over the bible, etc.
BUT, I recognize that cultural barrier (reading Scott Hahn or Steve Ray who read and prayed their way into The Church, they couldn't believe that they were being led that way by God through the Bible) -- do go and visit an Orthodox Church -- firebasecody said that Eastern Orthodoxy, one of Christianity’s best kept secrets. well, not so much a secret in the place I've landed up in (Poland), but the Orthodox ARE, along with us the Holy Apostolic Church -- if you fall in love with God there in the solemnity, piety, deep, deeep belief in God, that is to me the same as if you graced the Catholic Church.
Failing that, the traditional Anglicans and Lutherans too are our brothers in Christ believing, as you do, in the True presence in the Eucharist. While I cannot honestly say we are one, we still share much of the core beliefs and indeed may recite the Creed together in sincerity -- that is brotherhood. So do pray with the Orthodox or the LCMS or WELS, that is my humble suggestion
Well said, Cronos.
it's not impossible -- we can always try! I try every day and I fail every day, but God picks me up. I confess my sins and in the sacrament of repentance I remember these and focus on my life and my sins and remember how small I am, how much I need God's love and grace and forgiveness. And I beg for forgiveness
For nearly a year after moving to Poland I didn't go for confession as I made the excuse that I didn't know Polish so I wouldn't understand the priest and he wouldn't understand me. I prayed daily, sometimes more, mostly less. I confessed my sins privately and begged forgiveness
yet, when I went to confession last Easter (to an American Dominican priest in Prague of all places) -- I can't tell you the relief, the spiritual, mental, physical relief. I knew all the dogmatic reasoning etc. but here I really felt it.
I know what He states will be the end all of the system of things, but there HAS to be a way to lesson the burden.
There is
God knows we are frail beings. He knows we try hard. His hand is always there to help us and He gives us these little "booster packs" to help us on our way -- the sacraments -- as you noted the Eucharist to nourish us, the sacrament of repentance to lessen the burden -- make no mistake, it is HE who provided and provides these, it is HE who lightens our burden. All we do is confess our sins and He erases the slate.
I know what you mean, I have been in some of those threads myself. My thread was not meant to be one of those. Sorry if it turned out that way.
I must say though, I'm glad I did it. I have received some great advice, and guidance, which is exactly what I was looking for.
But here I was sitting each week for Mass in Polish and initially with a little hymnal in English, then slowly focusing on what was really happening -- I was born way after VII so I have no recollection of a mass in anything but English from when I was growing up, so this was like a new thing for me -- I was seeing and experiencing the mystery and the glory of the eucharist with new eyes and ears
And it was amazing
The way I look at a Pastor is that he is a “Shepard” of his flock. It is his duty to lead His flock, through leadership, to Christ.
Yes, he is a mere mortal, like the rest of us, but I believe they have that “calling” to do an almost impossible job.
My old church was a husband/wife team when I went back. For some reason I didn’t like when she preached. My Aunt told me she is no longer there, it’s just him now.
Growing up in that same church, we had Pastor Wayne. We loved that man! I was very involved w/ the youth group, we’d go on weekend trips, etc. He was a very cool guy to us kids, but also preached the Word to us in a way we could understand. He also got us to pay attention to him, lol.
I miss him.
I like that, thank you =).
True -- though now I call them "sub-shephards" :) as the true Shepherd is Jesus Christ and these ministers are just "aides".
believe they have that “calling” to do an almost impossible job. -- exactly, I don't envy them. To my mind, their failings will be judged more harshly as they affect the lives of others. Dante wrote that the road to hell is lined with the skulls of bishops
But my point was that if the minister-priest in front of you is bad, or maybe just weak, maybe a bad preacher, maybe even worse, that doesn't matter as we're not following HIM -- if a good priest pushes off somewhere else, we don't follow him, we follow Jesus Christ who is the High priest.
Good and bad minister-priests come and go, but the High Priest remains. He is there on the Altar, speaking through the Written Word, His cross telling us of His sacrifice and He, Himself in the Eucharist.
x
I must confess my problem with the Catholic Church. Praying to Mary and the Saints and to statues.
Jesus said “no one gets to the Father except through me”. I don’t, nor could I, pray to anyone but God, through His Son Jesus Christ.
That is one “hump” I simply cannot get over, well actually, not willing to.
I am a very literal person. If Jesus says the only way to the Father is through Him, I take it literally, as I do the body and blood of Christ.
I could be completely wrong but I don’t think I am. I expect to learn much on my journey. Trying to do it on my own isn’t working very well, lol.
FWIW, most traditional “Protestant” churches (Methodist, Lutheran, Presbyterian, etc.) have gone over the edge into accepting pastors who are homosexual, and women ministers.
Wherever we live, we end up in a Baptist church. Some say Southern Baptist, but we’re usually happier in fundamental independent Baptist churches where things are more traditional conservative than SBC, especially the music, the Bible version, and a more personal approach to missions.
We attend a Southern Baptist now because it’s better than the independent churches in our area. (As the name “independent” implies, each one must be checked out based on its individual merits; they’re different.)
He may erase my slate, but I have a hard time erasing my slate. I make some mistakes over and over, I must be getting on His nerves!
You are absolutely correct on that. That is 1 change I will make now...."sub-shepards".
I found a church that sounds good “on paper”.
“It is the hope of Island Christian Church (formerly Northport Baptist Church - read more...) to help people grow in their relationship with our Lord and connect with one another. We are dedicated to worshipping God in spirit and truth, teaching and proclaiming God’s Word and making disciples - all for the Glory of God!”
I wonder why they are now “formerly Northport Baptist Church”. I’ll have to call and interview the Pastor and ask him about that.
1. i sincerely meant that if Catholicism is not an option for you, we would be saddened, but imho, you should 'investigate' the Orthodox, or the LCMS or WELS
2. Asking our loved, departed ones to pray for us is not the main prayer by any means -- I, personally only ask the saints to pray for me when we all pray together and when I say "st. x pray for us". The rest of the time it's directly to God -- as it is for all us Catholics. Our main prayer, devotion to God, is the Mass which is a celebration of Him. Those who died in Christ are alive in Him, I believe that they pray for us. We can't have a conversation with them as they're in heaven and they can't do anything except pray for us, but our ancestors in faith are in the joyous presence of God -- they, themselves. They are not some disembodied people who have forgotten that they were once human, but they remember us, they pray for us -- like our parents would pray for us, they still do. Our friends, our benefactors, those who pass away into Christ's hands receive the eternal life that only He can give.
**He may erase my slate, but I have a hard time erasing my slate. I make some mistakes over and over, I must be getting on His nerves!**
Try the Sacrament of Reconciliation. It is God who forgives (and forgets) the sins. The priest only says the words.
You are welcome! :)
**I must confess my problem with the Catholic Church. Praying to Mary and the Saints and to statues.**
These are all falsehoods that you have been led to believe either through those wicked pamphlets or erroneous preaching of a Catholic-hating minister.
Investigate and find the truth! Are not you sinning by believing these lies.
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