The Not So Secret Rapture

reformed.org ^ | W. Fred Rice

[topcat54]

Evangelical book catalogs promote books such as Planet Earth: The Final Chapter, The Great Escape, and the Left Behind series. Bumper stickers warn us that the vehicle’s occupants may disappear at any moment. It is clear that there is a preoccupation with the idea of a secret rapture. Perhaps this has become more pronounced recently due to the expectation of a new millennium and the fears regarding potential Y2K problems. Perhaps psychologically people are especially receptive to the idea of an imminent, secret rapture at the present time. Additionally, many Christians are not aware that any other position relative to the second coming of Jesus Christ exists. Even in Reformed circles there are numerous people reading these books. Many of these people are unaware that this viewpoint conflicts with Scripture and Reformed Theology.

[Quix]

It really shows the church was way far from God...actually off the Christian map entirely. Remarkable that with that history why would catholics today put so much importance into what any Pope might say.

The more I read of catholicism the more grateful I am for the reformation....in every way!

ABSOLUTELY INDEED.

We see the same sort of

RELIGIOUS, IN-GROUP, EXCLUSIVIST, AUTHORITARIAN,
OUTRAGEOUSLY ABJECT, TERMINALLY !!!!DEMANDING!!!!, OVER-THE-TOP
DEMONIZED
!!!!ARROGANCE!!!!

that was demonstrated by the evil and other popes demonstrated on FR 24/7/365 by the more rabid clique types of RC's. It seems to be genetically, philosophically, spiritually indemic to the INSTITUTION.

To be fair, the tendencies toward such are in the heart of man and in all RELIGIOUS institutions organized by man--which would be--uhhhh--all of them.

However, in the Vatican AIWSOTARM, such horrific spiritual, relational and organizational sins have been elevated to unprecedented levels and 'sanctified' with all manner of rationalizations, revisionist rubberized histories and Olympic Class Scripture mangling and fantasizing.

The incredible cheek is for such folks to think that

THEY HAVE FOOLED GOD!

What white-washed tombs, sons of satan, vipers, idiots!

GOD IS NOT MOCKED. WHATSOEVER A MAN SOWS, THAT SHALL HE REAP.

They seem to fantasize that such does not apply to them. What arrogance!

This is one of the reasons I've long been convinced that God has actually facilitated or at least blessed, in some measure, the plethera of Christian denominations.

I believe that discord and breaks in relationships grieve Him, for any reason.

However, I believe that He never intended any monolithic human organization as HE KNEW what a MONSTER that would be short of Christ's Millenial Reign.

Christ DIED FOR RELATIONSHIP

NOT for a tyrannical gestapo ran monolithic, glorifying man (graduated or not) monstrosity!

I think that's a LARGE part of what all the Maryolatry and praying to 'saints' is all about--it just buttresses the monolithic exclusivist mentalities and authoritarian dogma and rituals.

What a stench in God's nostrils.

May God have mercy and lead all of good authentic genuine hearts toward HIM into greater freedom--whether out of the horrific institution entirely or at least into a HEALTHY Charismatic RC group.

[Quix]

ABSOLUTELY INDEED.

PRAISE GOD FOR HIS FAITHFULNESS

TO THOSE WHO LOVE HIM

REGARDLESS.

[Cronos]

metmom:Do they sit down and actually READ it (the Bible)? How do you know?

Cronos:Here you got 3 on FR to tell you we do read the Bible and actually do READ it (we don't read a 14-page excerpted annoted version like what your group is handed out, we read the Bible)

And we celebrate The Word of God in the Mass, right from In the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. (Matt. 28:19) right up to People: Thanks be to God. (2 Cor 9:15)

metmom: That’s how many percent?

Cronos: Nah, 3 out of 3 Catholic posters here on this thread -- that's 100%

How many of your group's people actually READ the bible? do you have any links showing the accurate statistics for your group on reading?

Crickets......



It's very irritating when members of non-Christian groups start attacking Catholics and Protestants and fomenting discord.

These are NOT Protestants as our Protestant brethern are Christian believing in Christ as Lord, God

[Joya]

God is certainly not going to ignore such forever.

Quix, I agree. Day of Reckoning scheduled.

[caww]

And it can not be changed or over-ruled...

Yes, they state that but they do not practice that. There is always a road to branch off from, full of twists and turns and loaded with obstacles of deception that the laity has little hope of wading thru these to discover what really is. IMO a tactic to keep the laity in the dark.

You know our government introduces masses of regulations daily, so much that no one can stay abreast of it all. So too with the catholic church and their edits and such. You never realize how corrupt and devious it is until you start to peal thru the layers. Then you step back time and again in absolute astonishment in what you discover.

[Joya]

Good one. Thanks.

[caww]

Of course their are good ministers within the body of Christ....but we are speaking of those who are not and why they remain so long within the catholic church when it is more than apparent they are bad individuals....as well as those who keep them either in office or excuse them.

[topcat54]

What about Catholic priests who drink, smoke, commit adultery, are homosexual, and/or molest children?

Not to butt in (no pun intended), but there is a biblical distinction between drinking and smoking (adiaphora) and the others, which are all sin according to the moral law as embodied in the Ten Commandments.

Some sects purposely turn adiaphora into sin, which as the net effect of minimizing the real sins as they are given to us in the Bible.

[caww]

It does appear so, but then we have to consider what it would mean if they were to otherwise, which they have not much freedom to do, under the conditions which their church places on them...and or the beliefs they’ve been indoctrinated to hold to.

I winder, if their laity did what the leadership has done...how would they address them? It seems there are differences of what’s allowed for the leadership, but would not go unchecked if the laity?

[Quix]

Thanks.

I think.

I TRY to avoid rewarding purrrrrdeeeeee obnoxiousness

whenever I can manage it.

[Quix]

It is conceivable
to me
That God could have done with Mary's body
as He did with Moses' body.

It's NOT conceivable to me that Mary was a perpetual virgin; ascended into Heaven without dying; ascended into Heaven to be Queen of Heaven etc. etc. etc.

[caww]

Christ's unique role as Man and God remains and is not blemished by the sub-shepherds/pastors/priests.

There is a vast difference between catholic Priests and Pastors. As an example: We do not confess to our Pastors but to Christ who as our Priest He alone has the authority to forgive sin and states so as the only mediator between God and man..... I could not imagine any man Priest making the decision if I am to be forgiven or not and how I must "pay" for doing so when Christ paid it all.

Israel will one day have their blindness removed and they will see Christ for who He really is to them..... Christ absolutely "fulfilled" the law which none can keep....and there is now therfore no condemnation for them who are in Christ Jesus. We are free from the law of sin and death.

[Quix]

Now, now, Dear Heart,

Evidently

SOME of us Proddys need to keep in mind

our station, our place

compared to the ‘holy’ water washed IN-GROUP.

Some of us are evidently not worthy courtesy pings, in their eyes.

LOL.

I’ll take God’s eyes any day, instead!

[caww]

I think that's a LARGE part of what all the Maryolatry and praying to 'saints' is all about--it just buttresses the monolithic exclusivist mentalities and authoritarian dogma and rituals.

Yes, it does seem so Quix. Layers and layers of "stuff" but in their minds gives them a sense of religous practice...rather than seeing the face of Christ thru it all. So much just gets in the way IMO.

I'm afraid one day the laity will see they are simply getting crumbs from the banquet table they were otherwise offered....but the leadership is certainly feasting.

[Religion Moderator]

You can ask a poster what he believes about an issue. That is fair play in Religion Forum debate.

But if you ask a poster what church he attends or what religious group he belongs to and he declines to answer, you must leave it alone. Continuing to badger that poster for personal information even by presuming his group membership and therefore beliefs is not only making it personal, it is flame baiting and trouble making.

It will not be tolerated.

One Freepmail complaint last night was that because some posters have said Catholicism is Satanic then therefore Catholics are justified in intentionally falsely accusing metmom’s group (presuming she even has one) and her by extension of believing in Kolob or "oneness” or anti-Trinitarianism and so on.

But the two accusations are not equivalent. And even if they were, two wrongs do not make a right.

When one belief spawns from another, it is common for both to condemn the other in the harshest terms, e.g. anathema, apostate, cult, demonism, Satanism. And those harsh condemnations often become part of the group's holy writ, doctrines or teachings.

In the Bible, for instance, both Jesus and the Pharisees accused each other of being Satanic. It happens frequently in "town square" type religious debate.

If a poster is at a loss on how to repond to such harsh condemnations he should read his own holy writ or the writings of his religious authorities and find on how they dealt with it because they most likely did.

And if a Religion Forum poster cannot deal with such harsh condemnations then he is way too thin-skinned to be reading much less posting on “open” Religion Forum threads.

If the Pharisees had knowingly falsely accused Jesus of believing in the Egyptian god Ra because he would not answer their questions, then there would have been equivalence to the behavior on this thread.

On this thread, an equivalent would have been if some non-Catholics here accused your faith group of believing in Xenu – an obviously false claim which can have no purpose other than to flame bait or make trouble. If they had done so, they would have been instructed to leave the thread.

So far, two posters have been instructed to leave this thread and have been pinged here as a courtesy (do not respond on thread but by Freepmail.)

I have been patient with you, Cronos, because you are an oldtimer and usually cooperative. But you continue to ignore my warning to stop accusing metmom of believing in Kolob etc. Knock it off or leave the thread.

[Quix]

All that God promises to Abraham through His Seed, Jesus Christ, is granted to all the children of Abraham. That means all former Jews and former gentiles who now make up one body, the body of Chirst, the Church of the living God.

Any other doctrine is foolishness, which is what you end up with when you read the Old Testament in complete isolation from the fuller revelation of the New Testament.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh, more SLICK WILLY REPLACEMENTARIAN ESCHATOLOGY!

Soooooooo underwhelming!

CERTAINLY all believing blood children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob WILL END up as part of The Body of Christ in ultimate terms.

PRETENDING that God has already MUSHED it all together when Scripture is plenty clear otherwise--is UNBiblical.

The Biblical indication is that AS A REGATHERED NATION with a new 3rd Temple and Jersalem as its capital--the Jewish NATION will not realize they've bee had by satan UNTIL he sets up his image to be worshiped in the new 3rd Temple Holy of Holies during the Great Tribulation of the END TIMES.

ANY other construction on the related Scriptures is unmitigated hogwash, UNBiblical and essentially mangling and disbelieving of God's Holy Word as well as--with REPLACEMENTARIANISM--making God out to be a liar about HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES TO THE NATION of Israel, the blood children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

Dispys do a FAR BETTER JOB of reading the Old Testament in concert with the New Testament than do REPLACEMENTARIANS. Sheesh!

[Quix]

WELL DONE, imho. Thx.

[Quix]

Well put.

Much appreciated.

Thanks for being accurate about me.

[Quix]

What is occasionally galling

is that very few to no

RC’s on FR ever acknowledge

as in ever

acknowledge

that there are INSTITUTIONAL FACTORS . . .

REWARDED, PERSISTENT, BRAZEN, ARROGANT

INSTITUTIONAL FACTORS

WHICH SET-UP, AID, PROPEGATE, PROTECT, RATIONALIZE ETC.

ALL MANNER OF EVILS FOR LONG EXTENDED TIMES

—circle the wagons—and fight off all out-group members whether civil authorities or others

and have through the centuries.

There’s NO Prody group with anything close to such a record.

Calvin at his worst didn’t approach that track record.

[Quix]

Twisting noses, !!!!DEMANDING!!!! particulars

is not kosher, not civil and now against the RM’s standards.

Give it a rest already yet!