Posted on 07/08/2010 8:54:20 AM PDT by 0beron
Edited on 07/08/2010 9:57:44 AM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
"Vatican Officials" say a lot of things. This man who is said to be an expert in demonology also claims to be an expert on the phenomenon of intelligent extraterrestrial life. We say they are supernatural in origin and the appearance of strange and foreboding lights in the sky are unfavorable signs.
Monsignor Corrado Balducci, a theologian member of the Vatican Curia (governing body), and an insider close to the Pope, has gone on Italiannational television five times, including recent months, to proclaim that extraterrestrial contact is a real phenomenon. Balducci provided an analysis of extraterrestrials that he feels is consistent with the Catholic Church's understanding of theology. Monsignor Balducci emphasizes that extraterrestrial encounters "are NOT demonic, they are NOT due topsychological impairment, they are NOT a case of entity attachment, but these encounters deserve to be studied carefully." Since Monsignor Balducci is a demonology expert and consultant to the Vatican , and since the Catholic Church has historically demonized many new phenomena that were poorly understood, [Like the historical propensity for the press to be leftist deceivers who herald new phenomena like Communism as saviours of mankind.] his stating that the Church does not censure these encounters is all the more remarkable.
Balducci revealed to a visiting American professional that the Vatican is closely following this phenomenon quietly. My informant originally surmised that the Vatican is receiving much information about extraterrestrials and their contacts with humans from its Nunciatures (embassies) in various countries.
THANKS FOR YOUR KIND REPLY and affirmation.
PRAISE GOD.
WELL PUT.
THX.
TOOO TRUE.
As Legatus noted
The Fitzwilliam Museum Click to zoom should reveal the dove at the center of the halo.
Though I was on my blackberry it was as clear as could be.
It's hard, when the first big chunk o' evidence I CAN check on turns out to rely on a blurry reproduction of a painting for its forensic force. It casts the whole enterprise in doubt.
Nevertheless I will work through the thread.
1. Is there any evidence this fellow with the Stigmata has been vetted by the Vatican hierarchy as to any sort of pronouncement of authenticity etc?
2. Is there any evidence that the visitation/apparition is considered to be an authentic 'Mary' visitation/apparition?
3. Are there any FR RC's with relatives in that region of Italy who could give a report on the local reactions to such goings on?
4. What are your personal responses as you read such a narrative?
5. How do you integrate the associated UFO involvement with your construction on reality?
From post #704:
[....]
A day in April, on the 5th in 1989, around noon, Giorgio left work to go on his lunch break. He noticed a Lady that seemed to be waiting for him near his car. He was astounded by the shine radiated by this Being, because the spring sun was high in the sky.
When he got closer, he realised that the Lady was hovering above the ground. She greeted him, told him her name was Myriam, and invited him to prepare himself for future encounters. Giorgio Bongiovanni was ecstatic, but upset.
He returned home, told everything to Lorella and rushed to call Eugenio Siragusa on the phone, who calmed him down explaining him that he had been visited by the Madonna.
More apparitions followed on, more and more intense until the moment in which the Virgin invited Giorgio Bongiovanni to go to Fatima, where she would have given him a sign for the whole humanity.
On September the 2nd 1989, Giorgio, accompanied by two Spanish friends, was kneeling down, below the great oak tree that dominates the sanctuary square. He brought red roses as a gift and waited, praying silently.
As promised the Celestial Mother called him; Giorgio, gone in ecstasy, saw once more the Sublime Being that asked him if he was willing to carry part of the anguish of Her Son.
Giorgio Bongiovanni agrees to the offer of the of the Virgin, and observed two rays of light departed from her chest, decorated with a white rose, that hit the palms of his hands. Giorgio fell backwards.
His friends drew closer to assist him, and saw on the back of his hands a sort of bulge that burst little by little, as if a nail pushed from the inside to the outside, to open up a deep wound that went across the palms fully. The pain was excruciating with a profound spiritual trauma.
Giorgio went back home where Lorella and Giovanni were waiting him, already eager to share the suffering and the blessing that the miracle of the stigmatas comprises in its mystery. Their lives changed forever.
The copious daily haemorrhage could even take place more than once a day and were extremely painful. It required a few hours for Giorgio to be able to recover.
Despite the attempts, he realised that he could not carry on with his job and was forced to sell his modest but profitable business.
From then on, every spiritual, physical, human and material resource of his, including what was lent or donated to him, was totally employed in the mission entrusted to him by the Virgin.
Thanks thanks.
Only portions are directly related to the Vatican, IIRC. Feel free to filter what you respond to but I would appreciate your take on many items—whichever ones you choose to comment on.
The post I just posted is one I’d particularly like your comment on.
Alleged Vatican official?
The folks in the beginning of the thread were actually Vatican Observatory personnel. There was plenty of truth about that. The headline writer evidently was hedging his bets.
I’m more interested in your comments on the excerpt I posted in the post I pinged you to.
The individual in question does not have stigmata (he claims to have a bleeding cross inscribed on his forehead, which is not stigmatic). There is no need for the Vatican to "vet" him, his local bishop has already identified him as a scam artist. It would only be reviewed by the Vatican if there was some belief in its possible authenticity.
Is there any evidence that the visitation/apparition is considered to be an authentic 'Mary' visitation/apparition?
None whatsoever. "Celestial Mother" has never been one of the titles ascribed to Mary by traditional Catholicism, and the "revelations" this hoaxter has made are contrary to the tenets of orthodox Christianity.
Are there any FR RC's with relatives in that region of Italy who could give a report on the local reactions to such goings on?
I have friends who live in Sicily and I doubt they've ever heard of him. I'll check.
What are your personal responses as you read such a narrative?
That this is an obvious scam.
How do you integrate the associated UFO involvement with your construction on reality?
Since it isn't real, it has no effect on my "construction of reality."
Thanks for your kind and informative reply.
Would appreciate your checking with Italy.
Do you have any evidence about the local Bishop labeling him a hoaxer? A link?
I’m hesitant to wipe him away with such a label because I have met Paola Harris and talked with her substantively. She’s a very solid researcher. She doesn’t per se scrutinize all her interviewees to the nth degree. However, she also doesn’t bother with plain crazies and hoaxers. She insures as well as she can by checking to see that they are reporting on real incidents that truly happened. She checks with associates, family etc. fairly routinely, IIRC.
The same is true for Timothy Good whom I’ve talked with more at length than I have even with Paola Harris.
>>Where do you find those exact that in your Bible?<<
Perhaps?
Luke 19:40 But he answered them, “I tell you that if they keep quiet, the stones will shout!”
I realize I am in way late so forgive me if …..
...And how does this relate to the the idea that quix had of God having a thought to pick someone else other than Mary or from a rock? God knows everything from eternity and God is immovable and cannot change or God would have made a mistake in knowing from eternity and thus be moved and changed
"For I am the Lord, and I change not"-Malachi 3:6
God's thought is not like ours that are successive. God does not think one thought one minute and another the next. Thoughts are not born to die and do not die to be reborn in the mind of God. All is present to Him at once since God is outside of time
>> ...And how does this relate to the the idea that quix had of God having a thought to pick someone else other than Mary or from a rock?<<
Because in Luke we are told that if God can find no one willing the rocks would actually cry out because He will not be denied.
You had asked quix why he would make that statement and I was suggesting that Luke 19:49 was perhaps where he did come up with that thought. I wasn’t intending to get into any theological discussion on the relevance to the virgin birth.
This may end up sounding more convoluted than it is, to me, in my own mental spaces . . . however . . . here goes . . .
1. I offered the business about God could have raised up a virgin daughter of David out of a stray rock to make a point.
A) It’s Biblically accurate to propose such given the Scripture about God raising up rocks to praise Him etc. as children of Abraham even . . .
2. The RC’s seemingly assert that Mary was more or less always destined to be the QUEEN OF HEAVEN and all the other hoopla attached to her inexorably by more or less divine right—seemingly almost before God was.
3. THAT ATTITUDE was what the rock proposal was aimed at. It is a heretical attidued.
4. Mary was a willing servant of God along with thousands of others. Praise God for that. There’s ABSOLUTELY NO BIBLICAL BASIS for elevating her to anything else other than the mother of Christ’s earthly body.
5. Saying a common rock could have been raised up as a virgin daughter of David to do the same task is technically true. All this special hoopla for Mary is simply UnBiblical and unwarranted.
6. PERSONALLY—NO DOCTRINE HERE—JUST MY OPINION—I would not be surprised if as some have postulated, we all discuss with Father—at least Believers to be—[yes, I know, Dr E, sounds awfully predestined!]—meet with Father and layout a rough course for our life before we are born—with our awareness of such stripped from our essence, our consciousness, our understanding.
7. IF THAT’S TRUE, it would not surprise me that the same was true for Mary.
8. IF THAT’S TRUE, Mary would be no more PREDESTINED to any special role than the rest of us are. Certainly Christ’s mother was a unique Role. HOWEVER, HE TRASHED THAT UNIQUENESS WHEN HE NOTED THAT THOSE WHO DID THE FATHER’S WILL WERE AT LEAST EQUALLY HIS BLOOD RELATIVES ALONG WITH HIS BLOOD HALF SISTERS AND BLOOD HALF BROTHERS.
9. No, the cousin rationalization just does NOT WASH. There would have been no point, IN THAT CULTURE of saying cousins—there would have been so many cousins as to have made the point of emphasis the statement was designed to be—pointless. The statement ONLY MAKES SENSE WHEN BLOOD BROTHERS AND SISTERS OF JESUS, CHIDLREN OF MARY ARE MEANT.
I understood and I agree on all points.
GWARSH, BLUSH.
Am humbled and blessed by your kind reply.
Thanks tons.
God’s best to you and yours.
You must be trying for the impossible—making me fingerless/speechless. You’ve almost succeeded. LOL.
HERE’S AN INTERESTING GLEANING FROM ATS:
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread612785/pg1
POSTED BY:
DCDAVECLARKE
Unscheduled UFO documentary aired from Disney,,March 1995......
In March of 1995, Walt Disney Television aired a most intriguing one-hour television special on UFOs titled Alien Encounters from New Tomorrowland. This highly unusual UFO video special presents UFOs and alien visitation to our planet as a matter of fact. Though the film’s existence is acknowledged by the respected website of the Internet Movie Database, you will not find it available anywhere for purchase.
Those who tracked this incredible production state that it was shown only once, and with no advance notice on stations in only five US cities. Thanks to a viewer who was able to roll the VCR and capture it, we have a record of the startling statements it contained. You can watch this
fascinating 45-minute program at the link below.
LINK TO VIDEO:
http://www.personalgrowthcourses.net/video/ufos_disney_alien_encounters_video
At first glance, this unique Disney television special appears to be an elaborate promotion of a scary New Tomorrowland ride on alien encounters which was about to open at Disney World. But on closer inspection, it is much more. The entire program, which opens with a short segment by Disney CEO Michael Eisner, does not even question the existence of UFOs and a major UFO cover-up. In fact, at times it has a tone of ridicule towards those who still deny the existence of UFOs.
Considering the very limited showing and audience, and the highly unusual stance on UFOs taken, many suspect that this program was a probe to measure public reaction to news of the reality of visitation and interaction with various forms of non-human intelligent life on Earth. The 10-minute section on alien abductions seems particularly designed to scare viewers.
>>You must be trying for the impossible—making me fingerless/speechless.<<
As long as there’s no tingles. :-)
>>The 10-minute section on alien abductions seems particularly designed to scare viewers.<<
Setting up the scenarios for the rapture. They are probably oblivious.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.