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The Worship of Mary? (An Observation)

Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007

Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.

There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.

Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).

Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.

Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.

I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.

But do I WORSHIP them?

No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.

I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.

There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?

I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.

Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.

In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.

At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.


TOPICS: Apologetics; Catholic; History; Theology
KEYWORDS: catholic; mary; rcc; romancatholic
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To: Judith Anne

Where do you get the idea we’re raised to hate Catholics? Not true. When I was born again, I knew there were differences in our theology but until I got on here, I never realized how much difference there really is. My folks never sat me down and told me all about those wicked Catholics. It would probably be more the other way around, the Catholics didn’t want anything to do with protestants.


1,681 posted on 06/03/2008 5:49:00 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: tiki

Well, I’m shoving off. Things to do, places to go, money to spend! (I’m shopping for a riding mower. Hope to have one here by Saturday, the side lawn is getting LONG, and I just get exhausted pushing that mower over this acre of lawn.)


1,682 posted on 06/03/2008 5:51:14 PM PDT by Judith Anne (..)
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To: Judith Anne

Maybe some of the Catholics are as well, Judith Anne.


1,683 posted on 06/03/2008 5:51:14 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: netmilsmom
Blood siblings are not half-siblings nor step siblings.

If, and I say if, Mary had children by Joseph her children would be blood siblings of Jesus. Are you going to quibble whether they were 1/2 blood siblings?
1,684 posted on 06/03/2008 5:52:09 PM PDT by OLD REGGIE (I am most likely a Biblical Unitarian? Let me be perfectly clear. I know nothing.)
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To: trisham

I grew up Protestant and I was taught that Catholics worship Mary and idols, yeah, same ole, same ole.

Our next door nieghbors were Catholic and when their father came home every evening they rang a bell and everyone went running for prayers no matter what they were doing and if you were there you were expected to join them. After I became a Catholic and looked back I feel the HS was working in my life, pulling me to the Church even back then.


1,685 posted on 06/03/2008 5:52:54 PM PDT by tiki (True Christians will not deliberately slander or misrepresent others or their beliefs)
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To: big'ol_freeper

The Catholic church is NOT the church founded by Jesus Christ. Sorry. Wrongggggg. The entire Body of Christ who follow Him and are committed to Him -— THAT is the one true church.


1,686 posted on 06/03/2008 5:53:20 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: big'ol_freeper

Well, BOF, we’re all praying for yours as well...LOL.


1,687 posted on 06/03/2008 5:54:11 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: Marysecretary
Hmm, seems like that road goes both ways, Mad Dawg.

There's no question that some on our side give as well as they get.

But if you're saying there is no collaboration among some on your side to make posts designed NOT to tell the truth, to put forward real arguments in a real quest for the truth, but to irritate, I won't believe you.

1,688 posted on 06/03/2008 5:54:56 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: big'ol_freeper; Alex Murphy; alpha-8-25-02; blue-duncan; Dr. Eckleburg; ears_to_hear; ...

In the face of the tired old

rubber histories
rubber Bibles
rubber logic
rubber calendars

we are obligated in behalf of the lurkers to keep responding with the truth . . . which is rather unchanging.


1,689 posted on 06/03/2008 5:56:24 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Judith Anne

Oh, really? Well, dear JA, we have it too. Sorry.


1,690 posted on 06/03/2008 5:56:31 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: Marysecretary
Jesus is our salvation also. We love Jesus and EVERYTHING about him. We love his mother who was obedient to God, we babtise our children following the Jewish tradition of the Jews who circumcised their children. St. Paul refers to babtism as a "circumcision not administered by hand" Colossians 2:11,

During our mass, we recieve Jesus' real flesh and blood, presented under the appearances of bread and wine. Joh 6:53-55. This was also prophecized in Malachi 1-11, "From the rising of the sun, even to its setting. . . they bring sacrifice to my name and a pure offerring. Earthly bread nourishes our bodies, Jesus, nourishes our souls.

We honor the saints who served our Savior. There is nothing wrong with that. We have a rich tradition and God encouraged that, why wouldn't you? "Stand firm and hold fast to traditions that you were taught, either by oral statement or by a letter of ours." 2 Thessalonians 2:15

1,691 posted on 06/03/2008 5:56:48 PM PDT by mgist (Thus in Psalm 103, we pray, "Bless the Lord, O you his angels, you mighty ones who do his word, hear)
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To: Marysecretary

You said: The Catholic church is NOT the church founded by Jesus Christ.

Yes it is. Scripture and history verify that.


1,692 posted on 06/03/2008 5:57:03 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Preach the Gospel always, and when necessary use words". ~ St. Francis of Assisi)
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To: trisham

I see the nature of such comments has not changed markedly.


1,693 posted on 06/03/2008 5:57:06 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Marysecretary

You keep saying that, and yet I don’t recall your making an actual argument to support your thought.


1,694 posted on 06/03/2008 5:57:16 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Judith Anne; Quix

Sorry, my sweet Judith Anne, Quix has already found Jesus and guess what? WITHOUT MARY’S HELP. Hallelujah.


1,695 posted on 06/03/2008 5:57:57 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: big'ol_freeper

I don’t know of any Prottys hereon the least bit attacking

The Church Universal founded by Jesus The Christ.


1,696 posted on 06/03/2008 5:58:01 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: big'ol_freeper

Amen!


1,697 posted on 06/03/2008 5:58:16 PM PDT by tiki (True Christians will not deliberately slander or misrepresent others or their beliefs)
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To: Quix

You said: we are obligated in behalf of the lurkers to keep responding with the truth . . . which is rather unchanging.

*snicker*...you can’t be referring to the unbroken chain of chaos called protestant exegesis can you?


1,698 posted on 06/03/2008 5:58:43 PM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Preach the Gospel always, and when necessary use words". ~ St. Francis of Assisi)
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To: Judith Anne

Try the Holy Spirit. He’s available for all who ask...


1,699 posted on 06/03/2008 5:58:47 PM PDT by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: Mad Dawg

There is no phoniness, They really don’t see what they don’t want to see.

- - -

I have to pinch myself and remind myself that the subject of the above is not some RC’s hereon.


1,700 posted on 06/03/2008 6:00:00 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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