Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
GREAT post. Thank you.
>>Sorry, but most protestants don’t go for this stuff. Never heard of Stewart.<<
Just like when Catholics say we don’t worship Mary and certain posters say, “Yes you do.”
I saw it with my own eyes. Either the Bible is held up like a talisman, or miracle spring water or Green prosperity handkerchiefs. Yup.
>>I don’t keep that much track of such things though I agree strongly with you.<<
So did you see this yourself? I would really like to know the Catholic but it’s midnight her.
her=here.
Geez I have to go to sleep......
This is brotherly advice to hopefully enable you to stay a bit longer.
AVOID USE OF
“you” and “your” in all your posts hereon. Just weed them entirely out. Do NOT use them. That goes along way toward avoiding making a post personal. That’s a major offense here and sufficient for banning. Particularly after warnings.
It’s also wise to avoid any kind of personal assault. We really do NOT wrestle against flesh and blood.
Healthy bantering without teeth can be fine. Humor is good. But not caustic personal attack stuff.
God be with you and yours.
I don’t see it and it’s just not true. There.
I’ve said
in the root word meanings and in the context.
The translation used brothers for a reason.
It did not use uncles, cousins, best-mates or shoe-shine boys.
for a reason.
He is enough, but you are ommitting much of what He encompasses. Your "enough" is smaller than other's "enough".
Well put.
Thanks much.
As we have seen . . . there has to be a market for some truths, before there can be a sale.
You’re right. Without the Holy Spirit in us, the Bible is just another book with no understanding and no revelation.
We’ve noticed that for years hereon and in life now for 61 years.
LOL.
Oh, thank you! I appreciate that.
>>It did not use uncles, cousins, best-mates or shoe-shine boys for a reason<<
Why would they use any of those world if they were half-brothers?
They would however, use “brothers” for half-brothers if there was no other word to use. Just like people call my adopted sister, my “sister”.
We are all Christ’s brothers and sisters, are we not?
I can’t imagine . . . short of a StarGate or time machine
how the RC edifice could remotely do anything before its beginning around 395 AD.
I don’t believe in rubber calendars.
And I still have to go to bed!!!!!!!!!!!
Brazen blind bias fostered in dark hot places.
Right. My spelling is still the pits.
Yeah, but it’s not one of my favorite passtimes, LOL.
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