Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
Some of you will remember my recent decision to become a Catholic. I suppose I should be surprised it ended getting derailed into a 'Catholic vs. Protestant' thread, but after going further into the Religion forum, I suppose it's par for the course.
There seems to be a bit of big issue concerning Mary. I wanted to share an observation of sorts.
Now...although I was formerly going by 'Sola Scriptura', my father was born and raised Catholic, so I do have some knowledge of Catholic doctrine (not enough, at any rate...so consider all observations thusly).
Mary as a 'co-redeemer', Mary as someone to intercede for us with regards to our Lord Jesus.
Now...I can definitely see how this would raise some hairs. After all, Jesus Himself said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and that none come to the Father but through Him. I completely agree.
I do notice a bit of a fundamental difference in perception though. Call it a conflict of POV. Do Catholics worship Mary (as I've seen a number of Protestants proclaim), or do they rather respect and venerate her (as I've seen Catholics claim)? Note that it's one thing to regard someone with reverence; I revere President Bush as the noted leader of the free world. I revere my father. I revere Dr. O'Neil, a humorous and brilliant math teacher at my university. It's an act of respect.
But do I WORSHIP them?
No. Big difference between respecting/revering and worshiping. At least, that's how I view it.
I suppose it's also a foible to ask Mary to pray for us, on our behalf...but don't we tend to also ask other people to pray for us? Doesn't President Bush ask for people to pray for him? Don't we ask our family members to pray for us for protection while on a trip? I don't see quite a big disconnect between that and asking Mary to help pray for our wellbeing.
There is some question to the fact that she is physically dead. Though it stands to consider that she is still alive, in Heaven. Is it not common practice to not just regard our physical life, but to regard most of all our spirit, our soul? That which survives the flesh before ascending to Heaven or descending to Hell after God's judgment?
I don't think it's that big of a deal. I could change my mind after reading more in-depth, but I don't think that the Catholic Church has decreed via papal infallibility that Mary is to be placed on a higher pedestal than Jesus, or even to be His equal.
Do I think she is someone to be revered and respected? Certainly. She is the mother of Jesus, who knew Him for His entire life as a human on Earth. Given that He respected her (for He came to fulfill the old laws; including 'Honor Thy Father and Mother'), I don't think it's unnatural for other humans to do the same. I think it's somewhat presumptuous to regard it on the same level as idolatry or supplanting Jesus with another.
In a way, I guess the way Catholics treat Mary and the saints is similar to how the masses treated the Apostles following the Resurrection and Jesus's Ascension: people who are considered holy in that they have a deep connection with Jesus and His Word, His Teachings, His Message. As the Apostles spread the Good News and are remembered and revered to this day for their work, so to are the works of those sainted remembered and revered. Likewise with Mary. Are the Apostles worshiped? No. That's how it holds with Mary and the saints.
At least, that's how my initial thoughts on the subject are. I'll have to do more reading.
The wedding ring is a pagan artifact.
I don't flat out deny the Assumption, it is the type of language Pius XII used to warn/threaten I found “questionable”. But it is what it is.
Really have to go, wife never gets this “time wasting activity” (In her words) of punching keyboard letters to people I have never met.
Oh well.
Don't you realize these shabby assaults on Catholicism are deeply offensive?
180 copies isn't a lot... Can you show me that this was in fact an RCC commission?
I am not a very proper Calvinist.
Well, that is a new one on me...I had never heard that before...
But he built the box.
No, she isn’t. So why pray to her? She can’t answer your prayers and she’s not your intercessor.
It doesn’t say the Catholic church, however.
It’s this post that is in green, with some maroon. Dated today, July 3. M
For the same reason any Christian asks another Christian to “pray for me.”
***I’ve never heard any of that nonsense from any church or nondenominational church I’ve ever attended or visited. Tch, tch.***
Trust me, I have. http://churches-of-christ.ws/indextr.htm gives a slightly incoherent explanation of what I have heard so plainly and vehemently expressed.
***We worship God on the Lord’s Day, not on Sabbath.
I do too, but it is a practice I am very close to correcting. The Sabbath day is the Sabbath day. Sunday worship was instituted by Rome. ***
Pretty arrogant aren’t you? The Lord’s Day was specified by the Church of Christ. Are you saying that you are above the Church?
***Are you of the non-kneeling persuasion?
My church does not kneel***
I believe it. So when the Bible says: Luke 22:
41
After withdrawing about a stone’s throw from them and kneeling, he prayed,
are you claiming that you follow Christ’s example? Or are you simply too proud to kneel before God? Phillipians 2:
9
Because of this, God greatly exalted him and bestowed on him the name 7 that is above every name,
10
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bend, 8 of those in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11
and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, 9 to the glory of God the Father.
***Why, is that important somehow?***
Only for true Christians.
***Your faith prohibits wearing a wedding ring?
yes.***
Do you raise your hands in worship?
***But you’ve never availed yourself or approved of any of these, have you?
I may have once, but I do no more.***
Fascinating. No Christmas trees, no Easter eggs, no Halloween, and especially no St. Valentine’s Day.
The word “fear” is an interesting one. I know it says “fear” is found in the bible, but does it mean what it meant 1500 years ago when the first bibles were being written? Webster’s unabridged dictionary, second definition is to feel reverence for...” Not exactly what contemporaries generally think.
Yeah, the big dogs who can't even keep their replies straight. I am Gargantua. I am a male. I have a wife. I don't know who you think you're responding to, but that's okay, because apparently neither do you.
Big Dog. What a sad, self-important joke.
;-/
Dear Heart,
It’s abundantly clear . . . that a number of folks have sensitivities sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo sensitive . . . that we must trust their care and education to The Lord.
That sin no longer exists, and is as far from us "as the East is from the West." to quote Him. Nowhere does Jesus say "...confess your sins to a priest and then repeat memorized prayers over and over like the heathen."
So I'm just trying to figure out why it is that you Catholics think it's okay to make up rules about confession of sin and absolution which directly contradict what Jesus taught us about confession and absolution. Perhaps you think Jesus was mistaken? Maybe He didn't cover all the bases well enough?
Big dog?
;-/
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.