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Beltway Sniper Shootings-FR Commentary-Thurs., Oct. 24,2002
Fox News, CNN, Press Conferences | October 24, 2002 | Fox News, CNN, Press Conferences

Posted on 10/24/2002 2:38:22 AM PDT by wewillnotfail

Overnite, two men arrested while sleeping in their car at a reststop in MD. John Mohammed aka John Williams and his stepson Lee Malvo. Mohammad is thought to be the likely shooter.


TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events; US: District of Columbia; US: Maryland; US: Virginia
KEYWORDS: dc; maryland; religionofpeace; rop; shootings; sniper; terrorism; virginia
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To: Miss Marple
Yes, I wondered why he wasn't given bail. On a charge such as that, usually you wil get bail even if you have a prior record. There was no mention of him being in violation of parole or anything.

There was an earlier report that he owed LE some back time.

381 posted on 10/24/2002 4:49:31 AM PDT by TexKat
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To: TexKat
Only half way through this thread but I found this:

Source: The Rabbit Goes Duck Hunting

The Rabbit Goes Duck Hunting

The Rabbit was so boastful that he would claim to do what- ever he saw anyone else do, and so tricky that he could usually make the other animals believe it all. Once he pretended that he could swim in the water and eat fish just as the Otter did, and when the others told him to prove it he fixed up a plan so that the Otter himself was deceived.

Soon afterward they met again and the Otter said, "I eat ducks sometimes." Said the Rabbit, "Well, I eat ducks too." The Otter challenged him to try it; so they went up along the river until they saw several ducks in the water and managed to get near without being seen. The Rabbit told the Otter to go first. The Otter never hesitated, but dived from the bank and swam under water until he reached the ducks, when he pulled one down without being noticed by the others, and came back in the same way.

While the Otter had been under the water the Rabbit had peeled some bark from a sapling and made himself a noose. "Now," he said, "Just watch me;" and he dived in and swam a little way under the water until he was nearly choking and had to come up to the top to breathe. He went under again and came up again a little nearer to the ducks. He took another breath and dived under, and this time he came up among the ducks and threw the noose over the head of one and caught it. The duck struggled hard and finally spread its wings and flew up from the water with the Rabbit hanging on to the noose.

It flew on and on until at last the Rabbit could not hold on any longer, but had to let go and drop. As it happened, he fell into a tall, hollow sycamore stump without any hole at the bottom to get out from and there he stayed until he was so hungry that he had to eat his own fur, as the rabbit does ever since when he is starving. After several days, when he was very weak with hunger, he heard children playing outside around the trees. He began to sing:

Cut a door and look at me; I'm the prettiest thing you ever did see.

The children ran home and told their father, who came and began to cut a hole in the tree. As he chopped away the Rabbit inside kept singing, "Cut it larger, so you can see me better; I"m so pretty." They made the hole larger, and then the Rabbit told them to stand back so that they could take a good look as he came out. They stood away back, and the Rabbit watched his chance and jumped out and got away.



382 posted on 10/24/2002 4:49:42 AM PDT by Tunehead54
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To: aristeides
It was the Seattle Times .... look down to the 6 paragraph or so.... (The Seattle Times: Local News: 2 from state arrested in D.C. sniper case)

2 from state arrested in D.C. sniper case

By Seattle Times Staff

Federal authorities released this photo of John Allen Muhammad, also known as John Allen Williams.
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A former Fort Lewis solider and a teenager described as his stepson were arrested early today near Middletown in Frederick County, Md., in connection with the sniper shootings that have taken 10 lives in the Washington, D.C., area.

John Allen Muhammad, 41, and John Lee Malvo, 17, were taken into custody at a rest stop on Interstate 70 about 50 miles northwest of the nation’s capital, an FBI source said.

The arrests came after a day in which federal agents tore up the yard at the Tacoma house where Muhammad had stayed earlier this year. Agents also searched a high school in Bellingham for Malvo’s student records , and reportedly were looking for samples of his handwriting.

The two were last known to be living in Clinton, Md., a Washington suburb, law-enforcement sources said. Muhammad, a Muslim convert who changed his name from John Allen Williams last year, lived in Tacoma from 1994 until 2000 and had visited there since. He was stationed at Fort Lewis in the 1980s, served in the Gulf War and was later stationed at Fort Ord, Calif.

MARK HARRISON / THE SEATTLE TIMES
Yesterday’s search resulted in the discovery of at least one possible bullet fragment that was found in a tree stump on the property, and the stump was removed for analysis, a law-enforcement source said.

Malvo, who authorities said is a citizen of Jamaica, attended Bellingham High last year.

Late last night, Montgomery County, Md., Police Chief Charles Moose, who is leading the sniper investigation, said a federal arrest warrant on an unrelated firearms charge had been issued for Muhammad. The warrant was issued last night in U.S. District Court in Seattle, said John McKay, the U.S. attorney in Western Washington. McKay said he couldn’t discuss details because a criminal complaint attached to the warrant was sealed.

Moose had said Muhammad and Malvo should be considered armed and dangerous, but had cautioned, “Do not assume from this John Williams is involved in any of the shootings we are investigating.”

Several federal sources said Muhammad and Malvo may have been motivated by anti-American sentiments in the wake of the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks. Both were known to speak sympathetically about the men who attacked the United States, the sources said.

But neither man was believed to be associated with the al-Qaida terrorist network, sources said.

Authorities had issued an alert for a blue or burgundy 1990 Chevrolet Caprice with New Jersey tags and a 1989 white Chevrolet Celebrity with Maryland plates. Earlier this month, police said they were looking for a burgundy Caprice seen near a fatal Oct. 3 shooting by the sniper.

The link to the two Washington men came in part from a call from the suspected sniper himself. In the call, the sniper told investigators to look into an incident in Montgomery, Ala., a federal law-enforcement official said.

After checking shootings in Montgomery, police discovered a shooting in which one woman was killed and another wounded near a liquor store Sept. 21. Ammunition from a .223-caliber weapon was used, the official said. That was the same type of weapon the sniper used.

MARK HARRISON / THE SEATTLE TIMES
Bags of possible evidence are removed from the yard of the Tacoma house searched yesterday by federal agents.

A fingerprint lifted from a piece of paper found at the Alabama shooting scene was traced to Malvo, the official said. Police then traced Malvo to a Tacoma house where he had been living with Muhammad.

Earlier yesterday, federal agents arrived at a fourplex in the 3300 block of South Proctor Street in Tacoma, carrying chain saws and calling in heavy construction equipment.

Yesterday’s search recovered at least one possible bullet fragment from a tree stump that agents removed from the Tacoma property, a law-enforcement source told The Washington Post.

“We recovered evidence of potential value,” said a federal official. “But the forensics people are going to have to look at it to see what it means.”

Dean Resop, who lives a block away, said he was there when agents arrived yesterday morning.

“They just moseyed up and started looking around like they owned the place,” he said.

“There’s been quite a few tenants been in and out of there,” said Resop, who has lived in the area seven years. “Makes you want to watch your neighbors closer.”

The task force in Maryland had received a tip from a man in Tacoma, a friend of Muhammad’s and Malvo’s, who said he “had suspicions” about the pair, a source said.

Both Muhammad and Malvo were at the Tacoma house within the past three months, a federal source said. The tipster described the pair as “transients” or “nomads,” who sometimes took target practice at the property, according to the source, even though it is in the middle of a densely populated residential neighborhood near Tacoma Mall.

ALAN BERNER / THE SEATTLE TIMES
The Tacoma intersection is filled with reporters, neighbors and officers.

While there, according to the tipster, the two fired a .223-caliber rifle similar to that used in the snipings. Chris Waters, who lives across the street from the house, said he often heard gunshots at night last January. The gunfire sounded like high-velocity rounds and would come two to three at a time, Waters said. But it wasn’t automatic fire, said Waters, 23, an Army private first class.

Brian Jones, 37, who has lived in nearby condos for eight years, also recalled hearing shots fairly regularly, and as recently as September. “It was three shots in a row — boom, boom, boom,” said Jones. “In Tacoma, you hear shots all the time. You don’t think much of it.”

Interviews with law-enforcement sources, former wives and acquaintances created an emerging portrait of Muhammad: A Muslim convert and former Fort Lewis soldier sympathetic to Islamic terrorists. A man who has gone through at least two wives, with bitter custody battles over his children. A neighbor who was friendly but a control freak who kidnapped his own children.

Classmates and officials at Bellingham High School said Malvo was an unremarkable but friendly young man who hadn’t been at school there for nearly a year.

Muhammad is a 6-foot-tall, slender man who wears his pants pulled up tight and keeps his hair cropped very short, acquaintances said. He is the father of four children, including a grown son, and has spent much of his life moving about the country, said an ex-wife and close friends of his ex-wives.

Although Muhammad served in the Army for many years, he was never trained as a sniper, records show. He apparently has no felony record in Washington state, according to court records.

He converted to Islam many years ago, after his first divorce, about the same time he joined the Army, said Carol Williams, his first wife and the mother of his first son. The couple divorced 17 years ago.

Williams said she last saw her ex-husband in early August, for the first time in eight years. They both were in Baton Rouge, La., where she lives and he was visiting his brother, Edward Williams, who is married to her sister.

Williams also said Muhammad was outgoing and “had a good sense of humor. He wasn’t a quiet type. He liked to talk; he liked to mingle with people.”

“After he changed his religion, he called and told me what not to feed my child,” she recounted. “I told him as long as he (their son) lived with me, it was up to me.”

She wasn’t sure where he was living most recently or what he was doing.

“I know when he left here he moved to Tacoma,” she said. “From Tacoma to where, I don’t know.” When their son was in middle school, he visited his father in Tacoma. Carol Williams said she had to fight a legal battle to get him back.

But Muhammad was not a violent man, Williams said. The two met when they were both young. She was living at home with her mother, Muhammad had a car and the two had a three-month courtship before marrying. Muhammad would call her son every couple of years, she said, but aside from that had little contact. Muhammad married another woman, Mildred Green. They had three children and divorced in 2000 in Pierce County. Williams said Green called her a couple of years ago to tell her that Muhammad had kidnapped their children and to ask for help in getting them back.

“I know she called me and asked me if I would tell her if I heard anything,” Williams said. “I was really wanting to help her.”

Elaina Whitlock, 38, and her son Anthony, lived near the family for six years on South Ainsworth Avenue in Tacoma. Whitlock recalled that the couple had a bitter divorce and custody battle. After the divorce, he was granted weekend visitations, but at one point left with the couple’s children.

“Things were going OK with visitations and no one suspected he would take off with them, but then he couldn’t have her and he knew it would hurt her if he took the children,” said Whitlock. “Her life was her children.”

Whitlock said Green was reunited with the children about a year and a half ago.

Brenda Geyer lived across the street from the family for several years.

“I didn’t talk to him that much,” Geyer said. “I talked to Mildred more. They were a strong Muslim family and he was the definite head of the household — the authority figure.”

Geyer said that when she saw Muhammad’s photo on television last night, she immediately recognized their former neighbor.

“I am shaking inside,” Geyer said. “I feel weird, scary. How could it possibly touch this close to me?”

Leo Dudley, a friend who lived a block from Muhammad in south Tacoma, said Muhammad once provided security in Washington, D.C., for the Million Man March.

Muhammad was in excellent shape and knew karate, said Dudley, himself an ex-Marine.

“Any time he shook your hand, he would crush it,” said Dudley. “He was just country. He was from down South, and the military brought him up here.”

Less is known about John Malvo, who is reportedly Muhammad’s stepson.

Last year’s Bellingham High School yearbook listed a junior named Lee Malvo as unavailable for a yearbook photo.

A woman whose son is a junior there said Malvo attended classes there until last December.

“My son said he was a nice kid,’’ she said.

Mayor Robert Asmundson said he was told by investigators that Muhammad and Malvo stayed in Bellingham only for a few months and that, as far as city officials know, they have been gone for at least nine months.

Almost obscured by the news of the hunt for Muhammad and Malvo yesterday was the fact that the 10th death was positively linked to the sniper. Moose said ballistics evidence confirmed what police had suspected: Tuesday’s slaying of bus driver Conrad Johnson, 35 and a father of two, was the sniper’s work.

Also yesterday, leaders of the manhunt defended themselves against allegations that they’d made grave missteps in communicating with the killer.

Words delivered by Montgomery County (Md.) Police Chief Charles Moose at a news briefing last night


"We understand that you communicated with us by calling several different locations. Our inability to talk has been a concern to us, as it has been for you.

You have indicated that you want us to do and say certain things. You've asked us to say, quote, We have caught the sniper like a duck in a noose, end quote. We understand that hearing us say this is important to you.

However, we want you to know how difficult it has been to understand what you want because you have chosen to use only notes, indirect messages and calls to other jurisdictions. The solution remains to call us and get a private toll-free number established just for you.

We still ask you to call or write us at P.O. Box 7875, Gaithersburg, Md., 20898-7875. If you are reluctant to contact us, be assured that we remain ready to talk, directly with you. Our word is our bond.

If we can establish communications with you, we can offer other means of addressing what you have asked us for. Let's talk directly. We have an answer for you about your option. We are waiting for you to contact us."

— The Associated Press

“Everything possible is being done on this case,” said Special Agent Michael Bouchard of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. “We’re all parents, and we’re certainly concerned about the safety of our kids.”

Citing unnamed law-enforcement officials, two newspapers reported that the sniper, in an angry letter to police seeking millions of dollars, wrote that he had tried to contact police six times but was “ignored.”

One official told The Washington Post that an FBI trainee didn’t realize an incoming tip-line call was from the sniper and cut the conversation short. “Five people had to die” because of it, the sniper’s letter reportedly claimed.

According to several news reports, authorities spent so much time trying to collect forensic evidence from the letter, which was retrieved from Saturday night’s shooting site in Ashland, Va., that they missed a deadline the sniper had imposed.

The mistakes probably emboldened the shooter, said forensic scientist Brent Turvey, author of the book “Criminal Profiling.”

“If I’m the sniper, I’m thinking to myself the only way to communicate with these people is bodies,” Turvey said. In addition, “He feels he’s not going to get caught.”

Gary Bald, the top FBI special agent in the sniper investigation, did not address specific allegations in the media yesterday, but acknowledged that the number of calls coming in to the tip hotline sometimes “will overtax the system.”

According to the FBI’s Baltimore field office, the special sniper tip line had received more than 70,000 calls.

Times staff reporters Ian Ith, Mike Carter, Christine Clarridge, David Heath, J.J. Jensen, Susan Kelleher, Steve Miletich, Cheryl Morningstar, Cheryl Phillips, Ray Rivera, Ralph Thomas, Christine Willmsen, Duff Wilson, Miyoko Wolf, Sarah Anne Wright, Phillip Buffington, Janet Burkitt, Justin Mayo and The Associated Press and The Washington Post contributed to this report.


383 posted on 10/24/2002 4:49:59 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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To: All
Good Morning everyone!! I just woke up - still waiting for my the coffee to finish perking - went to bed at 1:00 (on FR, of course) - trying to catch up now.
384 posted on 10/24/2002 4:50:22 AM PDT by MasonGal
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To: mware
Cool, so did I :) Really. But somehow I just can't see the perp wanting to treat us all to a nice fable. Then again, if that's all it is I'll be a happy camper.
385 posted on 10/24/2002 4:50:43 AM PDT by mewzilla
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To: mewzilla
I thought that Sheriff Moose was the one who made the comment???
386 posted on 10/24/2002 4:51:55 AM PDT by mware
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To: wewillnotfail
They need to be charged in VA - we have the death penalty, including for 17 year old. I don't think MD and DC do.
387 posted on 10/24/2002 4:51:58 AM PDT by CobaltBlue
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To: aristeides; Dog
I found it highly interesting that 1)Mohammad provided security at the Million Man March...when was that? 2)he has children by 2 former wives and had bitter divorces involving custody; 3) he has used their cars and the car of a 3rd woman....girlfriend; 4) kidnapped his own children; 5)which wife is the mother of the teenager with him?

Dog's question of how these two financed their travels is pertinent because they may have been responsible for other robberies as well.

388 posted on 10/24/2002 4:52:18 AM PDT by Carolinamom
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To: Caribou
"The woman who survived could probably identified who shot her"

No, the survivor said that she did not see them/him.

389 posted on 10/24/2002 4:52:21 AM PDT by blam
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To: MasonGal
Morning, MasonGal.

Obviously the Snipers weren't watching TV last night, because they were thinking they were "safe", that no one was looking for them in that particular car, so they decided to get some "shut-eye" at a rest stop, and got caught.

Amen.

sw

390 posted on 10/24/2002 4:54:01 AM PDT by spectre
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To: mware
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the perp indicated in one of his communications that he wanted the chief to read a message which contained the fable. That's why I wondered about whether or not the perp was sending a signal to someone and using, ironically, the chief to do it.
391 posted on 10/24/2002 4:54:14 AM PDT by mewzilla
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To: blam

Investigators probe possible sniper link to Alabama liquor store shooting

By BOB JOHNSON
The Associated Press
10/24/02 4:52 AM

MONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) -- Federal authorities are investigating whether a fatal shooting in Montgomery last September is linked to the sniper shootings in the Washington area, the mayor said.

Mayor Bobby Bright said a caller to the sniper investigation tip line apparently claimed responsibility for both the sniper shootings and the Sept. 21 shooting outside a state liquor store.

He said investigators asked for files on the shooting and evidence, including a bullet found at the scene, and local authorities complied.

"We are fully cooperating, but we have no verification that anything here is related to the crimes in Montgomery County, Md.," Bright said.

The FBI in Mobile declined to comment on the mayor's remarks. Montgomery police also declined comment.

Earlier Wednesday in Maryland, police issued an arrest warrant for John Allen Muhammad on a federal weapons charge and said they wanted to question him about the sniper shootings. Montgomery County, Md., Police Chief Charles Moose said Muhammad may be traveling with a juvenile, identified by a law enforcement source as 17-year-old Lee Malvo.

The (Baltimore) Sun reported Thursday that Muhammad and Malvo have been linked to the sniper killings through a fingerprint traced to the Montgomery shooting.

A piece of paper found at the Montgomery scene bore Malvo's fingerprints, the newspaper reported, citing a source it did not identify.

 

In the Montgomery shooting, Claudine Parker, 52, and Kellie Adams, 24, were locking up the liquor store for the night Sept. 21 when they were shot. Parker was killed and Adams seriously injured.

Adams said her back was to the street when a single shot struck her just below the base of her skull. She said the gunman had not approached them.

"I never saw a face. I never saw him, period," Adams told the Montgomery Advertiser, adding that police contacted her late Wednesday about a possible connection to the sniper shootings.

No one has been arrested in the case. Earlier, police had said that the shootings occurred during an apparent robbery attempt.

Police Chief John Wilson said his department was cooperating with the sniper task force but told the newspaper that the two women were not shot with the same caliber bullet used by the sniper.

Bright said the caller to the tip line told authorities to contact Montgomery authorities if they didn't believe he was responsible for the sniper shootings, which began Oct. 2 in several Washington suburbs.

Copyright 2002 Associated Press. All rights reserved.

392 posted on 10/24/2002 4:54:44 AM PDT by Catspaw
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To: dinasour
Yep, I wouldn't doubt that that might be a coded message for other "misunderstood" moose-limbs to do their own infidel jihad around the USA! Stay tuned!!

393 posted on 10/24/2002 4:55:28 AM PDT by texson66
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To: TexKat
N I D A L
L A D I N
Like A Duck In (a) Noose.

And Nidal to Ladin represents over a quarter century of Islamic terror.

Don't mind me, I'm just musing about what it could mean(and I'm really creeped out too).

394 posted on 10/24/2002 4:55:50 AM PDT by hellinahandcart
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To: GRRRRR
Has anyone considered the concept that the "like a duck in a noose" phrase could be code for triggering further terrorist activity. According to Moose, it seemed very important to the perps that this phrase be repeated PRECISELY. This doesn't pass the smell test. The arrest of Muhamed & Malvo could possibly be just the tip of the iceberg. I hope I am wrong and just have too much tinfoil on this morning.
395 posted on 10/24/2002 4:56:54 AM PDT by GreyWolf
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To: wewillnotfail
I'm only up to your #55 on this thread. Somebody else may have mentioned it, but the pictures of the snipers got me to thinking. Do you suppose the guy who gave false witness is a racist - that he really saw the perp and did it to "help" another black?

And before I get flamed as being a racist myself for that statement, the flamer can just forget it. We are all equal in God's eyes.
396 posted on 10/24/2002 4:57:12 AM PDT by JudyB1938
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To: JudyB1938
I think there are a number of us who would like to have more info on Mr. Dowdy.
397 posted on 10/24/2002 4:58:27 AM PDT by berkeleybeej
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To: JudyB1938
That thought had also occurred to me.
398 posted on 10/24/2002 4:58:57 AM PDT by Carolinamom
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To: BohDaThone; wewillnotfail
-- not an olive pit in sight

Thanks, it's still early.
399 posted on 10/24/2002 4:59:23 AM PDT by dinasour
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To: GreyWolf
No, we all think it could be a signal for someone else to do something.... No tinfoil needed for that.
400 posted on 10/24/2002 4:59:55 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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