Spanking: Discipline or violence

Not so, childhood experts say. Their version: Spare the rod to promote positive, effective discipline and prevent violent behavior by children.

“I really can’t say spanking is ever a good thing to do,” said Sherri Rubeck, who teaches common-sense parenting for Southeast Wyoming Mental Health.

“Spanking is just teaching a child another form of violence,” she said. “Kids are learning that it’s OK to hit. Mom and Dad do it, so it’s OK to hit someone to get what I want.”

Ronn Jeffrey, director of Youth Alternatives, said, “Spanking is something adults do when they can’t think of anything else to do. It’s a form of negative reinforcement. Spanking just proves you’re bigger and stronger.

“It is not usually done out of a great deal of thought about changing a child’s behavior,” he added. “It’s done more out of frustration or anger and has only a temporary effect. With other forms of punishment, you have to think about what you’re doing.”

But single parent Johnny Jones said he believes spanking can be effective in disciplining younger children when used appropriately.

Jones leads a single-parenting group in Cheyenne, in which single and divorced parents meet to help each other cope with parental challenges.

He also has used a spanking as a backup when two or three attempts at another form of discipline don’t work.

“I don’t have half the problems or concerns (with his children’s behavior) that other parents have who do not now, nor have they ever, spanked their children,” he said. “They have problems at home and school.”

Jones said he does not believe spanking, when used appropriately, contributes to violent behavior in children.

“When I grew up, and before then, spanking was recommended,” he said. “The way children acted then, compared to the behaviors we have now, is completely night and day. We didn’t have the school violence and shootings we do now.

“Alternative forms of discipline don’t always work,” he added. “I believe that contributes to a lot of the problems we have. Look at our society, look at newspapers, what’s happening at school. Talk to a teacher who is about to retire about the differences in behavior (when spanking was used to discipline students) as opposed to students now.”

Laramie County School District 1 Superintendent Dan Stephan said the LCSD1 board revoked corporal punishment, including spanking, in 1984.

“Educationally, that is sound judgment,” he said. “Our board decided clear back then that it was not prudent behavior to use that as punishment. There are other methods to discipline students.

“If we have behavior that is not appropriate by a student, we will work with the parents and the student in regard to what the desired behavior would be … rather than modeling something that is probably less than productive.”

But Dwayne Trembly, who taught math at McCormick Junior High for years before retiring in 1998, agreed with Jones.

When spanking was revoked in the district, “We saw an immediate change with lack of discipline,” he said. “We’ve been struggling ever since.

“Appropriate spanking promotes discipline – with heavy emphasis on appropriate. That is the key word,” he added.

Trembly said what happens after the spanking is more important than the spanking itself.

“When a child needs discipline, it needs to be immediate, then they need a positive build-up afterward. Leave them in a positive state. Never leave them down. If you do that, you lose discipline.”

“I think (spanking) instills a line of respect in moderation – but I can’t stress enough in moderation,” he said. “Everything does not merit a spanking.

“A spanking should be done with an open hand on the behind, not a slap in the face.

“I don’t believe in using foreign objects, such as belts, switches, spoons and so forth. (With those) you do not know how much force you’re delivering. If you can’t do it with your hand because it’s hurting your hand, imagine how it feels to that child.”

If used inappropriately or excessively, spanking could cause children to become introverted out of fear of being struck, Jones said.

“Once they get beyond 10 or 11, that child is pretty much set in their ways,” he said. “They are either going to continue on in their behavior, or they already know the consequences of their behavior.”

As children approach their teenage years, other deterrents, such as taking away television or computer privileges, work better, Jones said.

“My daughter has told me several times that she wished I would spank her as opposed to taking away her telephone,” he said.

Jeffrey said he understands that some parents feel the need to use spanking as a form of punishment.

“I’m not going to condemn every parent who has ever spanked a child,” he said. “A parent who believes in spanking is not a terrible person.

“Was I spanked? Yeah. Were most of us? Probably. But I will tell you it should be the last line of discipline. The hand should be used, and it should be on the bottom. It should never be done with any object.”

Jeffrey referred to last week’s televised videotape of a young woman who put her daughter in a van and began spanking her. The spankings quickly escalated to what appeared to be a brutal beating.

“That is an indication that the person doing the spanking is usually out of control,” he said.

Jeffrey cited other problems with using spanking as a primary disciplinary measure.

“If you use physical ways of controlling your children, what happens when your kid gets bigger than you? If that’s the only method you’ve developed to control their behavior, you’re kind of in bad shape.”

Rubeck said parents need to retrain themselves to use more positive ways to discipline their children. That can be accomplished by taking a parenting class or reading good how-to books on changing children’s behavior.

Some good disciplinary methods include time-out, praising children when they do something good and revoking privileges as a consequence of bad behavior, Rubeck said.

When working with children, parents need to give “kid reasons” as incentive to behave, she added.

“Instead of saying, ‘You need to go to bed on time because Mom’s really tired and needs some rest, find a kid reason,” Rubeck said. “A kid isn’t going to care if Mom is tired. A kid reason would be, ‘If you go to bed early tonight, maybe you can earn a reward for the weekend, such as inviting a friend over.’”

It also is helpful to involve the children in the process when deciding what their punishment should be.

“If you let the child set the consequences, they’ll usually make the punishment worse than that parent would. Maybe that’s an indication that we need to be nicer, if they feel they’re deserving of such terrible punishment.”

So far, we have managed to raise a great kid to the age of 4 years old without using corporal punishment even once.

I really don't think spanking is an effective technique for discipline. Not that I think it should be outlawed.

But personally, I just could not smacking or spanking my little daughter for any reason.

I know a lot of Freepers disagree with me. Flame away.

I really don't think spanking is an effective technique for discipline

It's not. It's for punishment, pure and simple, not discipline, and should not be used in anger.

Your experience and view might be different if you had several kids close in age. Mine aren't perfect, but other parents and coaches talk about how well behaved and polite my kids are when I'm not around.

For those who don't know the difference between spanking and beating then one shouldn't use corporal punishment at all.

I raised 2 children to adulthood and never had to hit them. And they were never out of control, or rude in public (or at home). I think that a foundation of well established rules from the get-go, helps. When the kids pushed me to the limit I always found that getting down to eye level and firmly communicating my displeasure was usually enough for them. Kids grow used to idle threats and some may even be bold enough to risk being spanked if they can get the upper hand for even one minute.
I know parents who used spanking and I did not see that they had any advantage over controlling their kids than those of us who chose verbal communication.

Jones said he thinks it is appropriate to give young children a light slap on the hand or the bottom when they are doing something that could harm them, such as playing with outlets or running into the street.

I believe this is the only time when spanking is warrented. In situations like this it is more important to send a strong message, something the child will NEVER forget. I remember very little of my early childhood, but I do remember how I got my butt spanked for pushing my little sister down a flight of stairs. Ain't done it since.

Bribery. Yeah, that's brilliant, Doc. (By the way, you changed your example from "on time" to "early" in midstream.)

Flame away.

I don't see any reason why anyone should "flame" you. I think each child needs to be handled on a case-by-case basis. It sounds as if you have a case where physical correction was not needed; that is a good thing.

Bribery. Yeah, that's brilliant, Doc.
It's a brilliant way to raise a self-centred little sociopath. I've seen a few examples.

I think that a foundation of well established rules from the get-go, helps.
It's absolutely essential. "Yes" and "No" must mean exactly that. "Maybe" should be rare, and converted to "No" in response to any begging, pleading, or whining. Idle threats are disastrous; I've seen too many parents threaten their children with consequences they have no intention of inflicting; the kids learn pretty quickly that their parents' word is worthless. Discipline goes down the drain, and you've another household run by a 4 year old brat.

It's not. It's for punishment, pure and simple, not discipline, and should not be used in anger.

I don't see the distinction between punishment and discipline when it comes to kids.

Ideally, we punish our kids to teach them internal discipline, and to teach them that there are negative consequences when they break family and social rules. In other words, we use punishment to instill in them the discipline necessary to learn self control, and to deal properly with parental, social and legal authority.

I just don't see how spanking contributes to that process at all.

Punishment is after the fact, after they have transgressed.

Discipline is instruction and teaching, ideally BEFORE a transgression. They have to be taught right behavior, reproved when they violate those standards, and corrected to bring them back to right behavior, always in a teaching mode. Discipline is part of being a disciple. Children should be disciples of their parents.

IMO, corporal punishment, spanking should only be used in matters of defiance, not for simple disobedience.

Personally, I've not met many parents with multiple children who don't or haven't spanked. I've met many parents of spoiled children who didn't spank or didn't spank properly.

Spanking is an effective technique when used properly, but is ineffective, even destructive, when improperly used.

I've named my right hand "Ritalin". Neither one of my kids want Ritalin. That being said, there is a line between discipline and violence/beatings. Corporal punishment is used when attempts at reasoning fail. Violence/beatings are used when the parent is mad, therefore unreasonable him/herself, or when they are just animals themselves

Reasoning with toddlers? By definition they are unreasonable!

Sorry, there are times to be a dictator, not a negotiator. Promises and bribery teach children that there is an immediate payoff for 'good' behavior instead of doing 'right' simply because it is right. It also weakens the authority of the parent and teaches children that parents need to sell or explain everything they do or demand from their kids, and they don't.

Flaming probably is not necessary here but, 4 years old? Keep your chin up, you haven't even started your descent into the abyss yet.

Maybe not. But I'm betting that as my daughter grows older, she will require more sophisticated modes of discipline than can be delivered by a smacking hand or a belt strap.

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