Is December 25th Special?

marbren

[marbren]

December 25th has traditionally been celebrated as Jesus’ birthday. When you start to examine this closer you find that a September date makes more sense for the actual birthday. December 25th may be special however. I am looking for answers to a few questions. Is December 25th related to Kislev 25 ( the first day of Hanukkah in the Jewish Calendar)?. There might be some neat analogies to the candle lighting and Jesus being the light of the world. Was Hanukkah celebrated around 10 BC ? If we project back our current calendar to the time of Christ’s birth do Kislev 25 and December 25th ever fall on the same day? Was Jesus conceived on Kislev 25/ December 25th? Do the nine candles on the menorah have anything to do the nine months of Mary’s pregnancy? I am not trying to prove anything I was just hoping some of you may have some answers to these questions. God might be behind the December 25th date. This may also help the pro-life position of life beginning at conception. God became man when Jesus was conceived in Mary’s womb.

[marbren]

In heaven Jesus will answer all my questions. For now we see through a glass dimly.

[Texas Yellow Rose]

Thanks for the post David.  I have an article on the Course of Abia on my profile page which was written by E. W. Bullinger. (See Below)

III. "THE COURSE OF ABIA" (Luke 1:5).

This was the eighth of the priestly courses of ministration in the Temple (I Chron. 24:10), and occurred, as did the others, twice in the year.

The "Courses" were changed every week, beginning each with a Sabbath.  The reckoning commenced on the 22nd day of Tisri or Ethanim (Ap. 51. 5). This was the eighth and last day of the Feast of Tabernacles = the "Great Day of the Feast" (John 7:37), and was a Sabbath (Lev. 23:39)

The first course fell by lot to Jehoiarib, and the eighth to Abia or Abijah (1Chron. 24:10).

Bearing in mind that all the courses served together at the three Great Feasts, the dates for the two yearly "ministrations" of Abiah will be seen to fall as follows:

     The first (*1) ministration was from 12 - 18 Chisleu = December 6 - 12.
     The second ministration was from 12 -18 Sivan = June 13 - 19.

The announcement therefore to Zacharias in the Temple as to the conception of John the Baptist took place between 12 - 18 SIVAN (June 13 -19), in the year 5 B.C.  After finishing his "ministration", the aged priest "departed to his own house" (Luke 1:23) which was in a city (*2) in "the hill country" of Juda (verse 39).

The day following the end of the "Course of Abia" being a Sabbath (Sivan 19), he would not be able to leave Jerusalem before the 20th.

The thirty miles journey would probably occupy, for an old man, a couple of days at least.  He would therefore arrive at his house on the 21st or 22nd.  This leaves ample time for the miraculous "conception" of Elizabeth to take place on or about the 23rd of Sivan (*3) - which would correspond to June 23 -24 of that year.  The fact of the conception and it's date would necessarily be known at the time and afterwards, and hence the 23rd of SIVAN would henceforth be associated with the conception of John the Baptist as the 1st of TEBETH would be with that of our Lord.

But the same influences that speedily obscured and presently obliterated the real dates of our Lord's "Begetting" and Birth, were also at work with regard to those of the Forerunner, and with the same results.  As soon as the true Birth day of Christ had been shifted from its proper date, viz. the 15th of Tisri (September 29), and a Festival Day from the Pagan Calendars substituted for it (viz. December 25), then everything else had to be altered too.

Hence "Lady Day" in association with March 25 (new style) became necessarily connected with the Annunciation.  And June 24 made its appearance as it still is in our Calendar, as the date of  "the Nativity of John the Baptist", instead of , as it really is, the date of his miraculous conception.

The Four "Quarter Days" may therefore be set forth thus: first in the chronological order of the events with which they are associated, viz.:
 

The Conception of John Baptist	on or about	23rd SIVAN	=	June 24	in the year	5 B.C.
The Gennesis (Begetting) of our Lord	on or about	1st TEBETH	=	December 25	in the year	5 B. C.
The birth of John Baptist	on or about	4th-7th NISAN	=	March 25-28	in the year	4 B. C.
The birth of our Lord	on or about	15th TISRI	=	September 29	in the year	4 B. C.

or, placing the two sets together naturally : --
 

The conception of John	23rd SIVAN	=	June 23-24	in the year	5 B. C.
The birth of John	7th NISAN	=	March 28-29	in the year	4 B. C.

The Miraculous "Begetting"	1st TEBETH	=	December 25	in the year	5 B. C.
The NATIVITY	15th TISRI	=	September 29	in the year	4 B. C.

(*1)  Reckoning of course from Ethanim or Tisri - the First month of the civil year.  The sacred year was six months later, and began on 1st Nisan.
(*2)  The "city" is not named (possibly Juttah, some 30 miles to the south of Jerusalem).
(*3)   The conception of John the Baptist was, in view of Luke 1:7, as miraculous as that of Isaac; but it is not necessary to insist upon the complete period of forty sevens (p.198) in the case of Elizabeth.  Therefore the birth of the Forerunner may have been three or four days short of the full two hundred and eighty days, - as indicated in the above table.

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[AppyPappy]

Chanakkuh is Biblical. It's in the Book of Maccabees which is excluded from our Protestant Bibles. It is a celebration of a Miracle from God.

The Feast of Christ's Birth was celebrated on Jan 6 because a Roman feast occurred at the same time. The Romans weren't happy about "other" feasts occurring at other times so the Christians held their feasts at the same time as the Romans so as not to arouse suspicion.

[BenF]

Chanakkuh is Biblical. It's in the Book of Maccabees which is excluded from our Protestant Bibles. It is a celebration of a Miracle from God.

Chanukah is biblical from a Christian perspective, not a Jewish one. The two books of the Maccabees are part of Christian canon, not Jewish. Hence, from our perspective, Chanukah is not biblical in origin.

[belivethetruth]

hello,
i thought that the link you gave was very interesting.note the conclusion at the bottom of the artical, now go to "danielstimeline.com" to get the rest of that conclusion. and i agree with the link you posted

[belivethetruth]

maybe you should look up the orign of christmas before you agree to celebrate Jesus' b'day on the same day as the birth of a pagan god. you need to understand that HE "God" said that you should have no other gods beside me. and the bible plainly states when He was born, so why not celebrate Him on that day and not on the same day as the world worships there false god santa clause "satans cause".

[SunkenCiv]

GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach	join list or digest view topics view or post blog bookmark post a topic subscribe
Thanks marbren. Note: this topic is from 12/20/2001. Blast from the Past. Just adding to the catalog, not sending a general distribution. To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.

[who knows what evil?]

The September date makes sense for Y'shua to have been born on the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles or Booths.

Many Christians acknowledge (not celebrate) the birth of Jesus Christ at that time...they ignore the holiday in December.

[who knows what evil?]

I have actually heard people say that the reason there was no room at the inn because everyone was in town celebrating Christmas...

Pick any facepalm gif you would like to insert here...

[roamer_1]

I would suggest that if there are any days that YHWH would *not* glorify in any way, they would be the days known today as christmas and easter.

Also in your search, you will save time by not following the Jewish calendar system exactly either - Since the Temple fell, their calendar was changed too, and can be as much as 29 days off.

[marbren]

The Star of Bethlehem movie says the wise men came on Dec 25

http://www.bethlehemstarmovie.com/

It is very interesting!

[marbren]

My views have changed in the last 10 years. Change is good. It means I am growing in Faith In My Lord Jesus Christ. With no change there is no growth.

At least I was seeking truth in 2001.

[marbren]

How do you get FR stuff out of the archives?

[roamer_1]

The Star of Bethlehem movie says the wise men came on Dec 25

Thanks for the link... I will have to go out and rent it or something... It may be a while, but I will watch it.

As to when the wise men stood before Yeshua, I cannot say - But I do know that dec 25 is invariably the birthdate celebrated for every one of YHWH's enemies (Nimrod, Baal, Ra, Apollo, etc.). I doubt that YHWH would desecrate His Son by connecting that particular day with Him at all. The same goes for easter, which has always been the celebration of the earth goddess.

If you are a student of the prophecy, you should well know by now that the Jewish holy days are not Jewish at all - they were appointed and ordained by YHWH - They are YHWH's Holy Days (holidays)... And they are established as signs... Shadows of things to come (Col 2).

1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
1Th 5:6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

(e-Sword: KJV)

The reason most will be taken by surprise at His coming (Just as Israel did not know the time of their visitation) is because they will not know the times or seasons. those times and seasons are described within the Torah and are marked (established) by the Holy Days of YHWH, to include also the Jubilee years and Great Jubilees. Which of the Christian nations/assemblies observe ANY of these things?

Those that don't KNOW will be left with nothing but the sign of Jonah - 3 days and three nights... if they can't get THAT right, they will not see the rest.

[roamer_1]

My views have changed in the last 10 years.

Me too - I have always been a bit of a prophecy buff, so I have also been ever interested in the OT, moreso than most of my brethren. The thing that I can't get anyone to see is that the hierarchy of YHWH's method means that older things MUST take precedence... The problem with that is that Yeshua could not have changed anything from before. That calls into question most of what the churches believe.

Change is good. It means I am growing in Faith In My Lord Jesus Christ. With no change there is no growth.

That is really pretty true, providing you are growing toward the light of Truth. : )