Superior Swedish Sub Sinks American Nuclear Subs & Aircraft Carrier, USS Reagan (Video)

YouTube ^ | 12/12/10 | Chuck Henry

[OneVike]

Ever since WWII, America has been a dominant force upon the high seas. We have become so advanced in our military technology that the Soviet Union eventually collapsed, in large part because Ronald Reagan would not back down against them. In honor of his accomplishments and great leadership, congress named the worlds largest aircraft carrier after him, the USS Ronald Reagan. Well it has been 22 years since Reagan left office, and while we have been able to hold our status as the worlds most powerful military the world has ever seen, those days could be coming to an end.

Thanks in large part to the anti military sentiment that prevails in Washington, from both sides of the isle, America is losing the war of technical advancement. What you will see in this video is a submarine from Sweden the, NemoSaltadSobrius, that cannot be detected, and even worse it has repeatedly sunk our best and most powerful naval ships in mock war games. Check out this report out of San Diego by Chuck Henry, who reports that America is attempting to figure out how to catch in before our enemies discover the secret of its elusiveness.

Follow this link to see the video about the Swedish sub that could be the end America's domination of the
high seas. The Swedish sub "NemoSaltadSobrius" beats us in ever war game we played against it.
Swedish Submarine the NemoSaltadSobrius

[jveritas]

I still do not believe that a submarine is going to penetrate a carrier group and sink any vessel in the grouo and certainly not the carrier and not even cripple the carrier, don’t we have submarines that escort each carrier group?

[Ronin]

That must have been cool. The SLUF was a good bird. I wonder if VA-46 is still in commission somewhere. I doubt they could get away with being called the Clansmen in this day and age.

[Ronin]

The “every CVBG is escorted by an SSN” line is something that is passed around as a truism, but it’s not something I have ever heard a submariner confirm. I am sure they meet up and escort sometimes, but I doubt there is one in constant attendance around every carrier.

[rlmorel]

They were decommissioned after the First Gulf War.

When I was in, someone painted one of the planes with the word Klansmen. We always suspected it was someone from our sister squadron messing with us, but nobody ever found out who did it.

VA-46 was also the squadron that John McCain was in when his A4E Skyhawk was hit by that Zuni rocket on the USS Forrestal...

[rlmorel]

I respect jveritas and the things he has done well for the FR community, but I don’t know his base of knowledge on this...:)

That said, I am willing to bet money that our people are wringing a lot of tactics and experimentation out of their experiences with that sub. They have probably been trying out all kinds of new sensors or software.

I hope!

[Ronin]

When I was on the Connie, the SH-3 birds were all given American Indian (excuse me, Native American) names.

One of them was called “Rain in the Face”, and at least once a Westpac it was sneakily renamed “Pain in the Ass”, by some wag with stencils, black paint, and a sense of humor.

I doubt it was the Plane Captain, but hey — who knows?

[grey_whiskers]

I was thinking if the helo deployed ACTIVE sonar before the sub attacked -- granted, with the volume of ocean to cover, it's a long shot. But the heli is impervious to attack.

Cheers!

[Ronin]

Well, yes... but active sonar is range limited and it’s not something you want to be doing all the time. Even CVBGs like to hide (or try to). Hard to do that when you’re screaming WE’RE HERE!!! for hundreds of miles in every direction.

The time to use active sonar is when you already have a pretty good idea where the bad guy is and need a hard fix to lock in a weapon.

As for the helicopter being impervious to attack, don’t be so sure about that either. There has been talk about sub launched anti-air missiles floating around in fiction and literature for years.

Technically, there would not be that many obstacles as we have many years of experience in launching missiles from submerged vessels. However, such systems have never been considered practical because blowing away an ASW bird does a pretty good job of locating the submarine by itself.

Note here that while WE might not consider it practical, there is no guarantee that some other bright fellows working in other nations won’t come up with a usable system and put it to work.

[rlmorel]

The Connie, eh? That was the first aircraft carrier I went on when I was a kid.

I lived in Yokosuka, and I used to go down to the ships every chance I got. I remember looking at these huge gray ships with those white numbers on them. I would ask the sailors going on and off the ship if they would take me aboard to look around. I tried everything, destroyers, tugboats, tankers, cruisers, submarines, and got to go on nearly all of them. It was great. The coolest thing ever was when I went on a sub and they let me look through the periscope...I took that thing and looked all around the harbor, at all the structures I knew so well, the roads, the hills and so on.

The sailors were completely cool with me. They would take me all over the ship, into the machinery rooms and such. I was an altar boy, and when I went with the chaplain to perform a service aboard the USS New Jersey, they took me down to the chow hall and said “what would you like?” I asked what I could have, and the guy said “Whatever you want!” So I said: “Jelly donughts!”

They brought me a whole plate of the sugared jelly donughts...I ate five in a row and was removed by the Chaplain before I could finish the rest...:)

Anyway, I remember going down to the pier and seeing the USS Constellation there...as big as a city block. The planes all had their tails sticking out over the side of the deck, like too many birds trying to sit on the edge of a shed that was too small.

I got a guy to take me aboard, up to the flight deck. It was the closest I had ever got to one of these planes I had been obsessed with as a model builder. Plus, I think I drew the things incessantly...:) So it was really cool to actually sit in a cockpit, look down the intake, look in the wheel wells and such. I remember sitting in the cockpit and thinking “I have to remember this perfectly so I know how to paint the cockpits on my models...”

When I lived in Subic Bay a few years later, I would go down to Cubi Point and just walk out on the tarmac to look at the planes. Just amazing. Eventually, a sailor would drive over in a jeep and tell me to keep away from the planes, but it was remarkably low key.

I did get busted for abject stupidity one time, though. The runway at Cubi Point extends like a finger into the water, with the Officer’s Beach on one side of the runway, and the Enlisted Beach on the other. I just wanted to go to the other one, and didn’t want to walk a damn mile or two just to follow the road out and around the end.

So I cut across the runway, walked right by all the signs. I stopped on the way to investigate the old bare carcass of a Hudson, stripped of everything, used for who knew what or why it was there...as I was halfway across the runway, a jeep with a flag came flying out, the two guys grabbed me by my arms and hustled me into the jeep. We went back to the control tower, and they grilled me about who I was, what was my phone number. I gave them a false name and number, and when they called it and nobody was home, they let me go. (My dad was the XO on the base at the time, and I would have got screwed if he had to come over to pick me up.) I am not proud of it, I wasn’t a bad kid (I don’t think) just brainless for the most part.

I think my parents were always worried about me, but not because they thought I would get into trouble with the law. I was accident prone, and wasn’t thinking too many steps ahead in many cases.

[SeminoleSoldier]

According to wikipedia, the top speed of the Gotland class sub is 22 knots submerged. At top speed it is still slower than a carrier, although maybe it could ambush the carrier from short distances before the carrier could get under way.

I’d think suicide boats would be more likely disguised as civilian vessels.

[grey_whiskers]

As for the helicopter being impervious to attack, don’t be so sure about that either. There has been talk about sub launched anti-air missiles floating around in fiction and literature for years.

But if the sub launches on the helicopter, they've just given a GREAT fix on their position.

Sux to be them if they're still out of torpedo range of the carrier...

Oops--I replied before I read your whole post. You just *said* that.

Apologies, I'm sure.

Note here that while WE might not consider it practical, there is no guarantee that some other bright fellows working in other nations won’t come up with a usable system and put it to work.

How about wire-guided? Spool it out five miles away as one does with a torpedo, then fire it vertically at the helicopter.

Or would the active sonar pick it up while it is being shot out the torpedo tubes, or spooling away?

Cheers!

[SeminoleSoldier]

Not saying the Swedes don’t have a great boat, but from what I’ve read it seems like a strictly littoral boat. That’s great for the Swedes but not for us, we need the range of the nuke subs. Unless we designed some kind of ship to carry the sub to theater. What do you think?

[bmwcyle]

The range on the sub if just fine. The ocean is still large and you can snorkel or surface.

[Palladin]

ROFL!

What...no bar?

[Quiller]

If this war game opens some eyes in leadership that's a good thing.

In many cases, war games tend to reinforce existing paradigms for the winners, and -- in ponderous bureaucracies -- result in little more than career damage for a few of the losers. On few levels is there significant, "Whoa, let's FIX that!" if it involves significant investment, counters long-embraced attitudes, or challenges the pet entrenched branches for resources.

IIRC, war games held by the French in the mid 1930s demonstrated that a force attacking from the east could simply move through the Ardennes and bypass the line. The reports were quashed, the idea pooh-poohed as unrealistic, and the officers responsible for embarassing the high command got reassigned to dead-end positions.

[Lou L]

I’m not worried about the Swedes, I’m worried about some 18 year-old jihadist, volunteering for a suicide mission. Could they be trained to use the sensor, navigation, and advanced weaponry? Possibly, but it’s a tall order.

[Non-Sequitur]

I’m not worried about the Swedes, I’m worried about some 18 year-old jihadist, volunteering for a suicide mission. Could they be trained to use the sensor, navigation, and advanced weaponry? Possibly, but it’s a tall order.

Sure they could. But to operate the sub and get it from point A to point B undetected takes experience and training.

[rfreedom4u]

My brother the former submariner always said, “There are only two types of naval vessels; submarines and targets.”

[ROCKLOBSTER]

Is it a Saab sub?

[Lou L]

That was my only point. It's a little different navigating an aircraft from Boston to NYC in the daylight--when you can see landmarks--than it is driving a sub underwater, undetected, no matter how quiet your sub is.

One other thing. Unless this propulsion technology drives other hydraulic systems, bilges, SW pumps, and other electro-mechanical systems on the sub, there WILL be other sounds with which to tract this boat.