Posted on 11/19/2009 3:13:17 PM PST by GodGunsGuts
Creationists are ‘liars' (?): Geologist Donald Prothero doesn’t like the fact that we don’t agree with his ideas on evolution.
I love the attitude some evolutionists have toward professional, scientific debate. Because creationist scientists do not agree with their biased, subjective and unsubstantiated ideas they spit the dummy and call us liars.
The latest tirade from geologist Donald Prothero is in an opinion piece in NewScientist entitled ‘Evolution: What missing link?’1 I like that title.
His article was picked up by the Telegraph newspaper in the UK which reported, ‘Creationists “peddle lies about the fossil record”.’2
Lies? Are creationists really lying?
No!
It’s just that Prothero does not like the fact that we don’t agree with his ideas. It upsets him so much that he describes creationists in this way: ...
(Excerpt) Read more at creation.com ...
So is the Pope only “claiming” to be Christian and not believing God when he says that evolution is a truth which enriches our understanding of life and being and such?
Once more your ‘argument’ is nothing more than ‘I am a Christian, and unless you believe in what I believe scripture means, you are NOT a REAL Christian, you are only claiming to be a Christian; and you are going to HELL!’.
And it need not be pointed out that is is NOT a scientific argument against evolution.
Why do you feel that it is necessary to give naturalistic explanations for the wondrous events described in the Bible? I’m curious why you search for naturalistic explanations for these events rather than accept them as signs from God?
It doesn't hold true for Mendel, so it doesn't hold true.
Did you mean to ask me that question? My opinion is God spoke the world into existence and when he did, it left a mark. I believe all science is just the observations of the effects of what God does.
I’m not sure why you’re asking me that.
[[I’m curious why you search for naturalistic explanations for these events rather than accept them as signs from God?]]
We don’t even have to accept them as ‘miracles that canm’t be scientifically explained’ because there is actually a very large amount of scientific evidence that points to the NEED for an intelligent Designer, and points against the idea that nature did the act- infact, there is enough evidence to show that nature could not have accomplished these acts, that it’s beginnign to sink the Darwinian ship (but there are understandably holdouts that think the holes aren’t too large to sink the ship, but the evidence is showing quite the opposite unfortunately for them). We don’t simply have to close our eyes and just say ‘God did it’, We can actually show scientiifcally HOW God did it, and hsow how it’s impossible, scientifically, mathematically, biologically, for nature to accomplish the acts.
Good, now you have answered the question:
Do you think Darwin was qualified to found the theory of Evolution, a man who was not a scientist but a major on theology?
Obviously your answer is "YES." Now that it is YES, you have confirmed that even religious people can make valid points about science. Since, in the context of the post, you admit that they tell the truth; there is no reason for them to (your words) "...expect they would admit to lying!"
[[Once more your ‘argument’ is nothing more than ‘I am a Christian, and unless you believe in what I believe scripture means, you are NOT a REAL Christian, you are only claiming to be a Christian; and you are going to HELL!’.]]
Yawn- once again, (ad Naseum), Your ‘argument’ is ‘I don’t have to beleive What God said in His word, and I can save myself any old way I want to, and anyone that doesn’t agree with me is a ‘religious zealot’- .
I, the Pope, and many other Christians do not believe it the same way as you.
That so many have such hatred in their hearts for this difference in belief that they condemn the Pope to Hell, and deny the community of faith to their Christian brothers and sisters is truly a tragedy.
Religious people can make valid points about science. They can also lie.
Yes, it is an appeal to authority. Otherwise, you wouldn’t pick the pope for your argument.
You pick him because you think that no one would dare say the Pope is going to hell for not believing God and that if anyone on the planet is a Christian, he is.
Insisting on reading evolution into the creation account is reading more into it than it says.
Claiming that God used evolution to create man from lower creatures denies what the Bible and Jesus clearly say otherwise.
How anyone can claim to be a Christian and have faith in God and then go on to deny the truth of what He tells us in His Word is beyond me.
How someone can do the mental gymnastics necessary to reconcile believing God and calling Him a liar at the same time is beyond me, but it just doesn’t fit that someone who trusts Him enough for salvation doesn’t trust Him enough to take Him at His word, even when it doesn’t fit with what other people say.
And the ToE is nothing more than a human construct in an attempt to explain some of what they saw that doesn’t require belief in God. IT is not written in stone. Trying to adjust God’s Word to fit man’s explanations is a precarious position to be in.
If God and His Word are not trustworthy enough to believe when compared to human constructs, how can you consider it trustworthy enough to trust Him for salvation?
Interesting comment from someone who believes in the naturalistic explanation of evolution instead of accepting God at His word that He created life in separate creation events and not from each other.
Seeing the title of this thread made me read about it for the first time. I don’t know any creationists.
My question is to anyone, really. Why can’t you be devout in your religion AND believe in evolution?
If you think I am not “really” a Christian because I accept evolution and/or am going to hell; then reducing that argument to the absurd, the POPE isn't a “real” Christian and is going to hell with me.
I am not appealing to the Popes “authority” to settle a debate point. I am not saying ‘evolution is true because the Pope agrees with it’ or that ‘my interpretation of the Bible is correct because the Pope agrees with it’. THAT would be an actual “appeal to authority”.
And once again your only argument is an ACTUAL appeal to Biblical authority, and your supposed authority in correctly interpreting it.
All you can do is say ‘if you disagree with what I interpret the Bible to say, you are calling God a liar’. Sure, me and the Pope, we think God is a liar.
And once again this is NOT a scientific argument against evolution.
Come on, I’m trying to be serious here.
Why would that be absurd? If I really believed that anyone who believed in evolution wasn't really a Christian and was going to hell because of that belief, then it doesn't matter who you use, including the pope. You're working on the presumption that he IS a Christian by default or something with the kind of reasoing that if he isn't a Christian and won't make it, then nobody is.
And that's not a scientific argument in support of evolution.
All you can do is say ‘if you disagree with what I interpret the Bible to say, you are calling God a liar’. Sure, me and the Pope, we think God is a liar.And once again this is NOT a scientific argument against evolution.
I never claimed that belief in the Bible is a *scientific* argument against evolution. But the truth is the truth. It doesn't have to qualify as *scientific* to demonstrate that something is wrong.
The only point of evos making that demand is to restrict what they will or will not accept as evidence to disprove the ToE.
And as it stands at the present, evos are so dogmatic in their belief in the ToE that it is beyond their comprehension that any evidence would ever be able to disprove it. They automatically disallow anything that would reflect negatively on it.
The ToE will never be disproved to an evos satisfaction because they won't let it be disproved.
Everyone else has an open mind.
Does that mean you believe the earth is young?
Believing the universe is infinitely old, I’ve viewed evolution as a continuing project of God’s.
Why?
Creationists are incapable of an actual scientific argument against evolution, they rely upon the ULTIMATE appeal to authority as their one and only recourse.
I will only accept science in refutation of a scientific theory. What your religious beliefs are have no bearing upon the scientific discussion.
How dogmatic to not accept YOUR interpretation as the final word! Yes, it is WE who are being dogmatic in constructing a theory that explains the physical facts and enables prediction, but you who dogmatically insist that your interpretation of the Bible is correct despite any and all contrary data; sure it is YOU who have the open mind.
Laughable.
Does your church pay property taxes?
Why is that absurd?
How do you know he's really a Christian?
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