Ancient gold unearthed in Sudan

BBC ^ | Tuesday, June 19, 2007

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

The Kush kingdom was conquered by the Egyptians

A team of archaeologists has discovered a huge ancient gold processing centre and a graveyard along the River Nile in northern Sudan.

They were part of the 4,000-year-old Kush, or Nubian, kingdom.

The scholars say the finds show the empire was much bigger than previously thought and rivalled ancient Egypt.

The archaeologists are racing to dig up the Hosh el-Geruf area, some 225 miles from the capital, Khartoum, before the Merowe dam floods the area next year.

The dam is due to create a lake 100 miles long and two miles wide, forcing some 50,000 people from their homes.

Tribute

"Nubia was renowned for its gold deposits," said Geoff Emberling, from the University of Chicago's Oriental Institute, according to National Geographic News.

"Even today, panning for gold is a traditional activity in the area," said his colleague, Bruce Williams.

Ancient Egypt conquered Kush some 3,000 years ago and took "hundreds, if not thousands, of pounds of gold each year" in tribute, Mr Emberling said.

The new discoveries show that ancient Kush extended for up to 750 miles along the River Nile.

Near the gold processing centre, the archaeologists found some 90 graves.

"We found one laughably tiny gold bead in the burials, but that was the only gold we found," Mr Emberling said.

"It seems certain that the gold was not used locally. Very likely the gold was for the benefit of the ruler and his circle in Kerma," 225 miles upstream from Hosh el-Geruf.

[Lurker]

Ping

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

	pan-Africa pinglist.* This pinglist covers a broad range of topics relating to Africa: culture, current events, politics, science, history, arts, etc. Warning: This could be a low volume pinglist. Ping if you see a pertinent thread.
*To get on or off this list, freepmail with the subjects Africa on or Africa off . No message is necessary. To get on or get off this pinglist, freepmail here, with the appropriate subject.
There is also a: pan-Asia pinglist. pan-Europe pinglist. pan-Latin America pinglist. John 3:16 (New King James Version): "16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
This pinglist can terminate at any time, without notice.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

If you want on/off, PING. At least for the time being.

[Mr. Lucky]

Wouldn’t pretty much all gold be about the same age?

[onedoug]

I’m surpised islamists don’t blow it up.

[picard]

I’m surprised islamists don’t blow it up.

That my friend is a very interesting point.

The modern day Muslims like to brush over the fact that their own ancestors were infidels. Muslims are the children of Infidels. The very objects and monuments to point toward to glorify their past, is the very evidence that they are descended from heathens.

Although they claim the heritage of Abraham, ancient Arabs and Persians worshiped Ra and Isis in Egypt and Zoroastrianism in Persia (Zoroaster/Zarathushtra) Jew and Christians do not have this problem as they both claim a direct heritage to Abraham and have always worshiped one God without aberration.

So, according to the modern day idiotic version of Islam that is going around, it is, in fact, incumbent on the Muslims to destroy the Sphinx and all the other Egyptian monuments constructed before Islam, as they are representations of a God other than Allah or worship of a false God.

In a stricter interpretation of the current idiotic Islam, modern Muslim should declare Jihad against themselves as they are all descendants(bastard children) of unholy infidels and therefore they themselves are impure and unholy.

I compliment you on the way you think. I like that.

[Red_Devil 232]

I think the title would imply that the gold is “archaeologically ancient”, meaning it was discovered/mined in ancient times. But your observation is correct.

[sentis1]

Most Christians are descendants of Europeans or Native Americans both which worshipped multiple Gods before the introduction of Christianity. The Jews also had a pantheon of Gods before the Babylonian captivity and their exposure to Zoroastrianism.

[knarf]

There's gold in that thar valley ... and they're gonna' flood the damned thing.

Heeerrre's your sign.

[picard]

before the Babylonian captivity? really? what do you mean? i do believe that is not correct. The practice of Judaism began with Abraham and was ongoing from then on.

Of course there have always been apostate Jews, but over time they cease to be Jewish.

You might refer to Terach the father of Abraham who was an idol worshiper and I’m pretty sure he was not eating kosher.

So, the conclusion is that the inception of Judaism is when God told Abraham to leave his father and is furthered by the Akiada (the non-sacrifice of Issac).

There is debate about your point. Noah is by all means considered Jewish, and spoke to the God of Abraham. Jewish linage is commonly traced back to the sons of Noah. (anti-Shem-ite for example) But Noah was, in a literal interpretation not circumcised and did not observe kosher. A spiritual interpretation would say that Noah instinctively knew these rules or was told by God and it is just not documented.

Jews have alway protected their lineage from the time of Abraham to the point of murder hence the actions of Pinchas.

As for the Christians, they have in their religion been washed by the blood of Christ and hold no guilt. Mormons, e.g., take this point very seriously.

So, Regardless of the status of Christians or Jews, in terms of heritage the Islamist are in fact the descendants of idolaters and infidels. And there is no question that according to their own rules and previous actions, the Sphinx and the pyramids must be destroyed as they represent other Gods and are an offense to Allah.

[Androcles]

They’re not alone in being affected by other earlier religions. Despite your optimism re Judaism and Christianity, we absorbed a few influences from pagan religions of our own too.

Obvious ones include a lot of the Easter rituals and even Christmas customs, but lesser known ones make you wonder about how Mithras influenced us. Remember him? Born of a virgin on 25 December with shepherds in attendance...

What about Ut-pan-Napishtim in the Gilgamesh epic? Saved his family at the orders of the Gods from the flood that destroyed all Mankind...versions of this predate our earliest Judaic flood stories.

Now, I’m cheerful Christian and my faith isn’t shattered by earlier influences.

I just don’t have enough hubris to pretend Christianity and Judaism are immune to them or that other religions are lesser because we can spot earlier influences in them.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

Most Christians trace their (genetic) ancestry to peoples as pagan as the forebears of the Egyptians and Persians (some are Egyptian and Persian).

Many Arabs are descended from Abraham, some are descended from Lot. This what the Bible states.

Furthermore, converts to Christianity (which are many) haven't always always worshiped one God (double always intended).

Unless you have other information, even the islamofascists aren't out to kill people because of the religion their ancestors followed. So they wouldn't kill themselves because of their pagan ancestors. Even they recognize that they had pagan ancestors, something which you don't seem to (if you're a non-Jewish-descent Christian or Jew).

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Sudan is rich in natural resources. They’re the Mexico of Africa. Blessed with land and resources, crappy socialist government.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

The Jews turned from God occasionally, were persecuted, and then turned back. Not to be hypocritical, it seems that the United States is starting to turn from God.

There have been followers of the one God (be they Jewish or Christian or generic followers of God before the word Jewish/Hebrew/Israelite was made). Even from the atheist/non-Judeo-Christian view, Jewish monotheism is descended not from Zoroastrianism, but from Akhenaton's monotheism in Egypt--which is bunk.

[fish hawk]

Hold on sparky! You don’t get to paint everyone the same color with the same brush. My tribe had some tricksters and demigods but worshiped a higher being. One who was there but not seen. A higher power or Great Spirit, if you will. Some tribes did have many gods but don’t paint us all in your frame of mind. By the way all Indians are not alcoholics and lazy.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

The 'establishment' of Christianity around the world has been affected by paganism, as you've pointed out, but the Christianity of the Bible hasn't. That is why it is imperative for all Christians (Protestant, Roman Catholic, Orthodox, and the others) to base their Christianity solely on the Bible, and not on traditions.

Christmas especially, with the date (related to Saturnalia), Christmas trees and yule logs (Germanic paganism), mistletoe (actually secular--the kissing under it was diplomatic kissing originally) being blessed by Druids in 1800s UK, many 'patron saints' in towns or cities for denominations of Christianity who make saints to be special people rather than all Christians (as is the case) being uncannily similar (in power/behavior) to those towns/cities' earlier pagan era patron deity. Amerindian mixing their paganism in. Oddly, potentially because many Eastern religions are more philosophies than what could be considered religions, many Asian Christians--especially recent ones--tend to be not quite as tainted by their pagan past. This could also be that conversion was almost completely voluntary--they had little to gain, and oftentimes much to lose (being denounced and ostracized by their families). In contrast, Latin Americans were at least pressured into Christianity, and European largely adopted it when their leaders did (or in the Roman Empire, after Christianity became the state religion, it helped to climb the social ladder if you were Christian--government posts being given to Christians and such).

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

Opinion: sentis1 didn't seem to be intending to offend Amerindians. His basic point was that many current Christians are descended from pagans--which is the case.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

the italics were supposed to end after UK.

[fish hawk]

I was not offended. Just maybe correcting a thought.