Keep Darwin's 'lies' out of Polish schools: education official

AFP via Yahoo! News ^ | October 14, 2006

[lizol]

Keep Darwin's 'lies' out of Polish schools: education official 2 hours.

WARSAW (AFP) - Poland's deputy education minister called for the influential evolutionary theories of Charles Darwin not to be taught in the country's schools, branding them "lies."

"The theory of evolution is a lie, an error that we have legalised as a common truth," Miroslaw Orzechowski, the deputy minister in the country's right-wing coalition government, was quoted as saying by the Gazeta Wyborcza daily Saturday.

Orzechowski said the theory was "a feeble idea of an aged non-believer," who had come up with it "perhaps because he was a vegetarian and lacked fire inside him."

The evolution theory of the 19th-century British naturalist holds that existing animals and plants are the result of natural selection which eliminated inferior species gradually over time. This conflicts with the "creationist" theory that God created all life on the planet in a finite number.

Orzechowski called for a debate on whether Darwin's theory should be taught in schools.

"We should not teach lies, just as we should not teach bad instead of good, or ugliness instead of beauty," he said. "We are not going to withdraw (Darwin's theory) from the school books, but we should start to discuss it."

The deputy minister is a member of a Catholic far-right political group, the League of Polish Families. The league's head, Roman Giertych, is education minister in the conservative coalition government of Prime Minister Jaroslaw Kaczynski.

Giertych's father Maciej, who represents the league in the European Parliament, organised a discussion there last week on Darwinism. He described the theory as "not supported by proof" and called for it be removed from school books.

The far-right joined the government in May when Kaczynski's ruling conservative Law and Justice (PiS) party, after months of ineffective minority government, formed a coalition including LPR and the populist Sambroon party.

Roman Giertych has not spoken out on Darwinism, but the far-right politician's stance on other issues has stirred protest in Poland since he joined the government.

A school pupils' association was expected to demonstrate in front of the education ministry on Saturday to call for his resignation.

[flipper999]

missed it again...someday I will get to be post 999

< /useless, fun, minutia >

[Elsie]

I rest my case! ;^)

[Elsie]

Except there was no OTHER stuff in Christian communities north of Antioch until after Paul had been killed.

Are you sure?

---

... Peter didn't have any doctrine that was at odds w/ Paul -- much less a doctrine that required a warning from Paul about corrupting the Church in Ephesus & Crete.

Seems otherwise...

Galatians 2:11

When Peter came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he was clearly in the wrong.

[Elsie]

Better early than never! ;^)

[Elsie]

I hope this is not quote mining ;^)

[Elsie]

missed it again...someday I will get to be post 999

 

;^)

 

 

John 5

 

 1.  Some time later, Jesus went up to Jerusalem for a feast of the Jews.
 2.  Now there is in Jerusalem near the Sheep Gate a pool, which in Aramaic is called Bethesda  and which is surrounded by five covered colonnades.
 3.  Here a great number of disabled people used to lie--the blind, the lame, the paralyzed.
 5.  One who was there had been an invalid for thirty-eight years.
 6.  When Jesus saw him lying there and learned that he had been in this condition for a long time, he asked him, "Do you want to get well?"
 7.  "Sir," the invalid replied, "I have no one to help me into the pool when the water is stirred. While I am trying to get in, someone else goes down ahead of me."

missed it again...someday I will get to be post 999

;^)

John 5

 1.  Some time later, Jesus went up to Jerusalem for a feast of the Jews.
 2.  Now there is in Jerusalem near the Sheep Gate a pool, which in Aramaic is called Bethesda  and which is surrounded by five covered colonnades.
 3.  Here a great number of disabled people used to lie--the blind, the lame, the paralyzed.
 5.  One who was there had been an invalid for thirty-eight years.
 6.  When Jesus saw him lying there and learned that he had been in this condition for a long time, he asked him, "Do you want to get well?"
 7.  "Sir," the invalid replied, "I have no one to help me into the pool when the water is stirred. While I am trying to get in, someone else goes down ahead of me."

[FreedomProtector]

"What you do not understand is that biological states are not specified in advance. There is no pre-specification, so the probability calculation is not relevant."


Those calculations do not assume to pre-specify any information....merely a chain of only left handed amino acids, or a chain or only right handed amino acids.
The probability calculations are indeed relevant. An additional difficulty would be would be a meaningful order of information to construct a meaningful protein, but there is no pre-specification of order in the calculations.

FYI....C.B. Thaxton, W.L. Bradley & R.L. Olsen, The Mystery of Life’s Origin is often sited as a reference in Answers in Genesis/Creation Ministries International articles.

[Fester Chugabrew]

Science should be taught in science class, and only science . . .

And as I have plainly stated, extrapolations from current data assuming common forms are indicative of common history, assuming the rate of change has been consistent throughout history, assuming evolution by definition results in increased complexity, i.e. evolution in the wide sense is not "science." It is a philosophy of history. Teach it in a philosophy of history class. No amount of wishful thinking will change the fact.

Please do not call yourself a constitutionalist when you promote your mislabeled delusion as the only acceptable view of history allowed in science classrooms by law. You give lip service to the Constitution, but disregard its substance and intent, neither of which prohibit discussion regarding intelligent design in public school science classrooms.

[Fester Chugabrew]

Come back when you find another school board willing to throw away its money.

There are plenty of those already. Especially the ones that hire science teachers who do not know the difference between science and philosophy.

[SoldierDad]

Every process required for evolution has been observed. If you wish to contradict this, please name one. Isaac Newton's "Rules of Reasoning in Philosophy" Rule I. We are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. Rule II. Therefore to the same natural effects we must, as far as possible, assign the same causes. Rule III. The qualities of bodies, which admit neither [intensification] nor remission of degrees, and which are found to belong to all bodies within the reach of our experiments, are to be esteemed the universal qualities of all bodies whatsoever. Rule IV. In experimental philosophy we are to look upon propositions collected by general induction from phenomena as accurately or very nearly true, notwithstanding any contrary hypotheses that may be imagined, 'till such time as other phenomena occur, by which they may either be made more accurate, or liable to exceptions

Great, so which journal published an observed evolutionary event that was demonstrated in a laboratory experiment?

[antiRepublicrat]

Do you really want drive across the incredibly improbable bridge or evolution?

This looks pretty sturdy, and quite un-designed.

[antiRepublicrat]

I'm sorry. And Biology is not a very useful science anyway.

Yeah, who cares about antibiotics.

[antiRepublicrat]

answers In Genesis -- not an evo site -- has investigated the Second Law argument and advises against using it.

That's only after that argument, continually used by AiG, got soundly defeated so many times that it was rightfully making AiG look stupid and completely ignorant about science. Even the AiG creationists can learn from their mistakes I guess.

[antiRepublicrat]

Perhaps you have a mathematical proof that invalidates Sewell's tautology..

Here is a physicist trashing it. The author has one hell of a set of credentials, including one doctorate in engineering physics and another in electrochemistry, hundreds of published scientific papers, and international recognition for his scientific contributions. All of that was prior to his turning his attention on IDers.

[FreedomProtector]

Nice picture. I have actually been there once, at it was at an unlikely time...

Rainbow Bridge on lake Powell. My family rented a house boat for a week there when I was growing up. The hobby of my family growing up was water skiing. I learned how to water ski the summer after kindergarten, learned how to barefoot (rope, not boom) in junior high, and have continued practicing Peter's school of surf ever since... Although not an ideal place for water skiing as the rhythmic disturbances of the water repeatably reflect of the rock walls without losing significant energy causing non-ideal water ski conditions (smooth water is better), Lake Powell is a beautiful lake. The area reflects the glory of God evident in His creation.

One scientific experiment that we performed there that I will not repeat: Drive houseboat to the greenest area of the desert by a body of water and try to sleep. It is evident, easily observed as the sun goes down that mosquitoes tend to congregate there....: )

The circumstantial evidence of a flood is everywhere you look around that area as well, I believe that the picture you presented is circumstantial evidence of a flood as well.

When we visited rainbow bridge, we just happened to be there when NBC news was filming pictures for closing credits. They shot film of us posing as ourselves group of tourists visiting rainbow bridge. This was an improbable event, but a whole lot more probable then then many improbable events required for evolution.

I am sure since you are very intelligent and very well designed, and you can trust your brain because it wasn't programmed by chance, that you know the difference between a sturdy stone bridge most likely made by a flood, and an easily collapsible bridge used as a metaphor...

Thanks for the picture! It brings back some great memories.

Thanks for the ping, antiRepublicrat!

[Dimensio]

Because it was a long time ago and my memory has been affected by diabetes.

Since you acknowledge that your memory may be adversely affected by a medical condition, why should it be trusted that your claim that he taught "creationism" in a public school not be dismissed as an artifact of a false memory resulting in part from your previously disclosed medical condition?

[FreedomProtector]

Thanks for the ping. I really do appreciate the presentation of articles and information.

Mark Perakh complains about Sewell's tautology as it contradicts his religious presuppositions, but he never disproves it or provides a mathematical proof that invalidates it, there is a difference.

[Elsie]

This looks pretty sturdy, and quite un-designed.

It only looks this because it's constantly falling apart!

[Elsie]

...Peter's school of surf ...

Chuckle...

[Elsie]

I love Utah!!!