Creationists say fossil discoveries back their theories

Most paleontologists look into the mouth of an allosaurus and see a prehistoric eating machine with a jaw full of flesh-tearing teeth.

Working from a business park about 80 miles north of Tampa, Fla., DeRosa and his family are hammering away at two bedrock principles of modern science: evolution and the notion that Earth is about 4 billion years old.

The DeRosas are part of a small but growing band of creationists using dinosaurs - the icons of an ancient Earth - to argue that the world is only 6,000 years old. The DeRosas' tool of choice? The fossilized bones of Ebenezer the allosaurus and other creatures cramming their makeshift laboratory.

"Everything we've found supports that." The DeRosas run Creation Expeditions, a ministry that relies on dinosaurs to spread what they say is the infallible word of the Bible.

The family operation includes Peter, his brother Mark, sister Leah, and parents Pete and Linda.

The DeRosas have no formal training but have studied dinosaurs and fossils for more than a decade. .......... The DeRosas' digs have produced impressive results. They have uncovered a 22-foot-long allosaurus - a smaller relative of the T. rex - and a 15-foot-tall edmontosaurus, a plant-eating, duck-billed dinosaur.

The DeRosas and their movement, in essence, are trying to turn science against itself.

By digging up fossils and interpreting their finds, some creationists hope to convince others that evolution and a 4-billion-year-old Earth are nonsensical notions unsupported by the data.

They maintain, for example, that they've found organic plant matter buried with fossils indicating the animals died only a few thousand years ago.

In fact, there is very strong evidence in the Bible that man walked the Earth long before Adam, even though he became extinct and left no progeny.

It's very disappointing when those claiming to be Christians are so very ill-versed in the scriptural Authority that legitimizes their faith.

Well, Nightdriver; you've not responded to any requests for chapter and verse of what you claim, so I'll just toss these in for all of us to think about.

Most Christians 'believe' Evolution because they do NOT know what their Bible says.

If, as they say, they 'believe' the words of Jesus and the New Testament writers,

they have to decide what the following verses mean:

Romans 5:12-21
12. Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned--
13. for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law.
14. Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who was a pattern of the one to come.
15. But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God's grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!
16. Again, the gift of God is not like the result of the one man's sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification.
17. For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ.
18. Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.
19. For just as through the disobedience of the one man, the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.
20. The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more,
21. so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

If there were no one man, that means SIN did NOT enter the World thru him.

If Adam was NOT the one man, that means SPIRITUAL DEATH did not come thru him.

If SIN did NOT enter the World thru the one man, that means Jesus does not save from SIN.

Are we to believe that the one man is symbolic? Does that mean Jesus is symbolic as well?

The Theory of Evolution states that there WAS no one man, but a wide population that managed to inherit that last mutated gene that makes MEN different from APES.

1 Timothy 2:13

For Adam was formed first, then Eve. Was Paul WRONG about this???

OK: there are ten commandments just by simple enumeration, but almost all the other numbers are hyperbole, or else just figurative.

Huh?

Numbers 1

1. The LORD spoke to Moses in the Tent of Meeting in the Desert of Sinai on the first day of the second month of the second year after the Israelites came out of Egypt. He said:
2. "Take a census of the whole Israelite community by their clans and families, listing every man by name, one by one.
3. You and Aaron are to number by their divisions all the men in Israel twenty years old or more who are able to serve in the army.
4. One man from each tribe, each the head of his family, is to help you.
5. These are the names of the men who are to assist you: from Reuben, Elizur son of Shedeur;
6. from Simeon, Shelumiel son of Zurishaddai;
7. from Judah, Nahshon son of Amminadab;
8. from Issachar, Nethanel son of Zuar;
9. from Zebulun, Eliab son of Helon;
10. from the sons of Joseph: from Ephraim, Elishama son of Ammihud; from Manasseh, Gamaliel son of Pedahzur;
11. from Benjamin, Abidan son of Gideoni;
12. from Dan, Ahiezer son of Ammishaddai;
13. from Asher, Pagiel son of Ocran;
14. from Gad, Eliasaph son of Deuel;
15. from Naphtali, Ahira son of Enan."
16. These were the men appointed from the community, the leaders of their ancestral tribes. They were the heads of the clans of Israel.
17. Moses and Aaron took these men whose names had been given,
18. and they called the whole community together on the first day of the second month. The people indicated their ancestry by their clans and families, and the men twenty years old or more were listed by name, one by one,
19. as the LORD commanded Moses. And so he counted them in the Desert of Sinai:
20. From the descendants of Reuben the firstborn son of Israel: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, one by one, according to the records of their clans and families.
21. The number from the tribe of Reuben was 46,500.
22. From the descendants of Simeon: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were counted and listed by name, one by one, according to the records of their clans and families.
23. The number from the tribe of Simeon was 59,300.
24. From the descendants of Gad: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
25. The number from the tribe of Gad was 45,650.
26. From the descendants of Judah: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
27. The number from the tribe of Judah was 74,600.
28. From the descendants of Issachar: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
29. The number from the tribe of Issachar was 54,400.
30. From the descendants of Zebulun: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
31. The number from the tribe of Zebulun was 57,400.
32. From the sons of Joseph: From the descendants of Ephraim: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
33. The number from the tribe of Ephraim was 40,500.
34. From the descendants of Manasseh: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
35. The number from the tribe of Manasseh was 32,200.
36. From the descendants of Benjamin: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
37. The number from the tribe of Benjamin was 35,400.
38. From the descendants of Dan: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
39. The number from the tribe of Dan was 62,700.
40. From the descendants of Asher: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
41. The number from the tribe of Asher was 41,500.
42. From the descendants of Naphtali: All the men twenty years old or more who were able to serve in the army were listed by name, according to the records of their clans and families.
43. The number from the tribe of Naphtali was 53,400.
44. These were the men counted by Moses and Aaron and the twelve leaders of Israel, each one representing his family.
45. All the Israelites twenty years old or more who were able to serve in Israel's army were counted according to their families.
46. The total number was 603,550.
47. The families of the tribe of Levi, however, were not counted along with the others.
48. The LORD had said to Moses:
49. "You must not count the tribe of Levi or include them in the census of the other Israelites.
50. Instead, appoint the Levites to be in charge of the tabernacle of the Testimony--over all its furnishings and everything belonging to it. They are to carry the tabernacle and all its furnishings; they are to take care of it and encamp around it.
51. Whenever the tabernacle is to move, the Levites are to take it down, and whenever the tabernacle is to be set up, the Levites shall do it. Anyone else who goes near it shall be put to death.
52. The Israelites are to set up their tents by divisions, each man in his own camp under his own standard.
53. The Levites, however, are to set up their tents around the tabernacle of the Testimony so that wrath will not fall on the Israelite community. The Levites are to be responsible for the care of the tabernacle of the Testimony."
54. The Israelites did all this just as the LORD commanded Moses.

Yeah... them bad ol' creationists really want yer money all right.....

PROJECT ARCHAEOLOGY
TEACHERS INSTITUTE

Dates: August 8-14, 2004
Location: Kelly Place, Cortez, Colorado (kellyplace.com)
Contact Hours: 45
Cost: $750 (does not include airfare)
Click here for printable Registration Form

Spend a week in beautiful Colorado with the Bureau of Land Management (BLM) and the Institute of History,Archaeology, and Education (IHARE) as part of Project Archaeology. The program includes all meals, lodging, and ground
transportation.

Aug. 8: Introduction and Overview (night)

Aug. 9: McElmo Canyon Research Institute
guided archaeological tour (morning)
Canyons of the Ancients National Monument guided archaeological tour (afternoon)
Ute and Navajo Music and Dress Presentation (night)

Aug. 10 & 11 BLM Project Archaeology Workshop (day)
Cortez Cultural Center presentation (night)
IHARE Archaeology Workshop Part I (night)

Aug. 12 Archaeology Excavation (day)
IHARE Archaeology Workshop Part II (night)

Aug. 13 Guided tours of Mesa Verde and Anasazi Heritage Center (day)
Wrap Up (night)

Aug. 14 Departure

REGISTRATION DEADLINE: MAY 3, 2004

For further information contact Dr. Peter Feinman at the Institute of History, Archaeology and Education at 914.933.0440 or email us at: feinmanp@ihare.org.

PROJECT ARCHAEOLOGY
Project Archaeology (ProjectArchaeology.org) is an education program
jointly sponsored by the United States Department of the Interior,
Bureau of Land Management (BLM) and Montana State University,
The Watercourse. The ultimate goal of this program is to educate students
to take responsible and thoughtful actions towards our archaeological
heritage. Our national lands contain a remarkable and important record
of past cultures, but this fragile record is increasingly threatened, The
problem is widespread, occurring throughout the United States (and the
world), and affecting all kinds of cultural resources from ancient ruins
to historic ghost towns. A primary means of reversing this trend is
through education, and actively reaching out to schoolchildren.
(Intrigue of the Past: A Teacher's Activity Guide for Fourth through
Seventh Grades, BLM).

From here----> http://www.ihare.org/programs_teachersummer2004.html

Adam didn't have any daughters until after Cain, until after Seth.

How do you KNOW that?

Genesis 4

1. Adam lay with his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, "With the help of the LORD I have brought forth a man."
2. Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.   Now Abel kept flocks, and Cain worked the soil.
3. In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the LORD.
4. But Abel brought fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The LORD looked with favor on Abel and his offering,
5. but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast.
6. Then the LORD said to Cain, "Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast?
7. If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must master it."
8. Now Cain said to his brother Abel, "Let's go out to the field." And while they were in the field, Cain attacked his brother Abel and killed him.
9. Then the LORD said to Cain, "Where is your brother Abel?"   "I don't know," he replied. "Am I my brother's keeper?"
10. The LORD said, "What have you done? Listen! Your brother's blood cries out to me from the ground.
11. Now you are under a curse and driven from the ground, which opened its mouth to receive your brother's blood from your hand.
12. When you work the ground, it will no longer yield its crops for you. You will be a restless wanderer on the earth."
13. Cain said to the LORD, "My punishment is more than I can bear.
14. Today you are driving me from the land, and I will be hidden from your presence; I will be a restless wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me."
15. But the LORD said to him, "Not so ; if anyone kills Cain, he will suffer vengeance seven times over." Then the LORD put a mark on Cain so that no one who found him would kill him.
16. So Cain went out from the LORD's presence and lived in the land of Nod, east of Eden.
17. Cain lay with his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch.
18. To Enoch was born Irad, and Irad was the father of Mehujael, and Mehujael was the father of Methushael, and Methushael was the father of Lamech.
19. Lamech married two women, one named Adah and the other Zillah.
20. Adah gave birth to Jabal; he was the father of those who live in tents and raise livestock.
21. His brother's name was Jubal; he was the father of all who play the harp and flute.
22. Zillah also had a son, Tubal-Cain, who forged all kinds of tools out of bronze and iron. Tubal-Cain's sister was Naamah.
23. Lamech said to his wives, "Adah and Zillah, listen to me; wives of Lamech, hear my words. I have killed a man for wounding me, a young man for injuring me.
24. If Cain is avenged seven times, then Lamech seventy-seven times."
25. Adam lay with his wife again, and she gave birth to a son and named him Seth, saying, "God has granted me another child in place of Abel, since Cain killed him."
26. Seth also had a son, and he named him Enosh.   At that time men began to call on the name of the LORD.

It's not well documented. There COULD have been girls BEFORE this boy, Seth, came along, and appears that there were, for Cain married SOMEONE.

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