Posted on 12/01/2005 7:13:41 AM PST by Andyman
Morris, if one of these atheists was a family member of a deceased atheist Trooper, I'd agree. If the family objected to a cross because the deceased was Jewish, Muslim, etc...I'd back them 100% and I'd hope that the state would respect their wishes and erect an appropriate memorial.
But these guys are raising the issue because the crosses offend THEM! It's not a matter of respect for the dead troopers.
And folks like you are making me appreciate the wisdom of our fathers.
Those Hitler quotes sound like the current atheists, are you sure these are not urban myth?
I guess he had a few million relatves and friends and fellow atheists killed for no reason other than hate by the Highway Patrol.
What an idiot.
In fact, ironically enough, the charge against early Christians was often atheism.
Now there is a word combination I never thought I'd see.
Wonder how hard someone had to work to put that set together?
The one thing that separates this nation from all other nations is that foundation upon which this nation was established.
Rights endowed by the Creator no man/government can take or give. Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness, protects each and every one of US. No where does that say the Creator demands any individual to accept Him or is required by others to reject Him.
So these that are so very anxious to remove any mention of the Creator or God, ignore they are free to reject the Heavenly Father and they are Constitutionally protected. Once they remove that foundation then we become no different than any other nation and what ever a majority decides that becomes the required belief. Now that is faith whether one can see it or not, that human beings are not going to take matters into their own hands from the left to the right.
Moral Absolutes Ping.
Anyone have any doubt as to the actual motive of aggressive atheists like these? One hand is raised, a lurker perhaps?
Okay. Here it is. I, personally, am not offended by religious symbols that I don't identify with or use. Not a whit. In fact, I'm glad that such symbols help people remember God, even if it's in a different manner than me. Do I dislike seeing houses of worship that are not ones I might attend? Nope. I like seeing them, knowing that at least some of the people are being helped to rememeber God. How about people who call God by a different name, or read different holy books? Fine with me. Worship on a different day? AFAIC, any day is fine - how about remembering Him and praying every day?
Why are atheists (the professional kind) so hateful about OTHERS remembering God? Why are they so intolerant, angry and vengeful?
They're envious. They don't want to be reminded that Someone Else is the Supreme controller, knower, and owner. They don't want to be reminded that they are not really the master of their own lives. That Someone else is more powerful than they are. Pure, unadulterated envy.
Freepmail me if you want on/off this pinglist.
Note: I only extend my tolerance to Muslims who do not in any way support Islamic jihad, the goal of dominating the world, and think most of the Sharia laws such as the illegality of Muslims converting to other religions wrong. If they do adhere to those beliefs or practices, my tolerance stops at that point.
>> There is nothing in the theory of universal gravitation to oppose Nazism either. I don't believe in a god. Why should that bear on any political movement? <<
I'm sorry; I need to re-assert my context more as I drift from one respondent to the next. Please believe me that I am not trying to assert either that (1) atheism inherently leads to atrocities like Hitler, (2) any individual's atheistic belief system bears similarities or vulnerabilities to Nazism, or (3) any given atheist belief system inherently is responsible for Nazism.
The context was whether Hitler was Christian or Nihilist, and whether such Nihilism as Hitler's can be considered a subset of Atheism. Since Christianity is defined by rejecting certain actions inherent to the Nazi system, one doesn't need to get bogged down in debates over Hitler's contraditory and dishonest statements. Hence, we can eliminate the possibility that Hitler was a Christian. There is nothing in atheism which similarly inherently precludes the possibility that Hitler was an atheist, so Hitler may, on the basis of his actions, be an atheist.
That alone does not prove such a case. I also admitted the possibility that Hitler's nihilism may reject atheism as having certain beliefs, even those beliefs are in the absence of something (a god), or that Hitler may subscribe to some sort of Roman self-deificiation.
Well, you've certainly convinced me that you know nothing about Christianity but you certainly don't let that stop you from hating it.
So putting crosses or jewish stars on the graves in Arlignton National Cemetary is not allowed either?
It's the same.
>> There is nothing in the theory of universal gravitation to oppose Nazism either. I don't believe in a god. Why should that bear on any political movement? <<
Incidentally, I have a quite very Catholic Yugoslavian great uncle (his ethnic group is "Gotscheer.") He did enthusiastically support Hitler, volunteering for the army. Apon capture by the allied forces, he was so disgusted by what he heard of Hitler, that, when the allies were faced with a counter-offensive, he grabbed a rifle and fought side-by-side with his American captors, was recognized as a hero, and was granted a visa, and eventually citizenship, in America.
I'm sure he would quite vigorously refute all of the notions: that Yugoslavs expected Hitler to establish Orthodox Christianity in Yugoslavia (in fact, he fought because he expected that Hitler would establish something more German over the Yugoslavs which oppressed him); that it was Christian to support Hitler (he would also say that his support of Hitler was quite very much in spite of, and not because of, his Christianity.) And that the Serbs were among the Yugoslavs who tended to support Hitler.
Following the Gotscheer's general support of Hitler, the Serbs were so angry at the Gotscheer's fascism, that they they committed a very successful genocide against the Gottscheer. The people today exist only in the UK and the US.
>> What is there in Christianity to oppose Nazism? <<
(*filed under, "Questions not worth responding to," and "Evidence that there ARE stupid questions, not just stupid answers."*)
>> It established the German Christian Church, for heaven's sake! <<
Yes, it invented a false church to mimic, but oppose Christianity. The Maoists did the same thing.
"atheism stands for the principles of reason, freedom and individual rights."
Not to mention the bloody single-minded excess of the French Revolution.
That is a load of total and complete hogwash. Whenever atheism has become a political force it has been totalitarian.
Well, you just lost me, there, Mr. Andrews.
Martin Luther preached the enslavement of the Jews and the mass execution of Rabbis. Following the logic above, one concludes Martin Luther was not a Christian. That makes the fact that major Christian denominations are to this day named after Martin Luther a bit problematic, no?
It's that "properly understood" thing that is problematic.
Atheism throws the baby out with the bathwater. Lots of nafarious things move into the resulting void.
Like drunk driving and car crashes, atheism and nihilistic totalitarian idiocies just seem to go together. Which is not to say some drunks don't manage to drive home safely and some atheists are harmless. But you have to admit there is a correlation, no?
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