Posted on 04/14/2005 12:00:51 PM PDT by Dean Baker
Baptist church 'fake pope' sign attracting attention, criticism By JEANNINE F. HUNTER, hunter@knews.com April 13, 2005
NEWPORT, Tenn. - Two days after being posted, a church marquee message that questions the purpose of the papacy is still attracting attention in this small community.
"What I am trying to do is to let people know there's only one way to heaven through Jesus Christ," said the Rev. Cline Franklin, pastor of Hilltop Baptist Church. "There's no need for help. God sent his son, Jesus Christ. We're all priests if we're saved. I don't need to go to anybody else to pray."
The sign's side facing Broadway, the main thoroughfare in Newport, reads, "No truth, No hope Following a hell-bound pope!" On the other side, facing the church parking lot, it reads: "False hope in a fake pope."
The message appeared days after Pope John Paul II's funeral last week.
"It is unfortunate when it comes from within the Christian church. It's really sad," said the Rev. Dan Whitman, 54, pastor of Newport's Good Shepherd Catholic parish and Holy Trinity parish in Jefferson City. "You learn how to deal with it and pray not to be that way yourself."
It does not reflect mainstream Baptist thought, said Dr. Merrill "Mel" Hawkins, associate professor of religion and director of the Center for Baptist Studies at Carson-Newman College in Jefferson City.
"When you see signs like that, they are almost like relics or artifacts of a bygone era," Hawkins said.
He spoke about animus between Protestants and Catholics persisting after the Protestant Reformation and for centuries, during which "harsh things were said, couched within misperceptions, misunderstandings."
Among the major misperceptions is that Catholics "venerate the pope on the same level as Jesus," Hawkins said, and that "the pope is connected to their salvation in place of Jesus Christ."
Catholics make up about 12 percent of the population in the South.
"Catholics are a minority faith in the South, and there's often bias toward minority religious communities because people don't understand," he said.
James Gaddis, a lay speaker who also chairs the board at First United Methodist Church, said he had not seen the sign but had heard about it.
"I understand that it's very degrading," he said. "I think it's tragic that any church group would stoop to this posture."
Following Tuesday night's council meeting, Newport Mayor Roland Dykes Jr. said he was a little saddened by the message.
"It doesn't behoove any of us to determine who is going to heaven or hell. I think the pope is a highly, highly respected person," he said.
Franklin's church is a five-year-old independent Baptist church. When asked what the message meant, he said: "What does 'pope' mean? It means father. We have a heavenly father, and the Bible says we shall call no man a father. "
He said people have been driving by or taking pictures or calling to share their views. He said the intent was not to offend Catholics and people are misunderstanding the sign.
Copyright 2005, Knoxville News-Sentinel Co.
I think that's a bit of an artificial distinction. After all, if someone offends you, it stands to reason that they are sinning in the process. So you are necessarily judging that what they are doing is wrong.
Furthermore, if it gets to the point where you bring others, or the whole church, into the process, then they are judging whether you have a legitimate case or not---and therefore whether that person has legitimately sinned or not.
So I fail to see how Matthew 18:15-17 can be properly applied without exercising the very judgement that you claim Matthew 7:1-3 forbids entirely.
>>>>>>>ROFL -- why not both at once? We could speak in tongues and have a new wife for each new language we speak!
You nailed it!
"If you put up a Christmas tree and decorate Easter eggs, you're mixing Christianity with paganism." True story, but there is a huge difference between doing something like this and teaching/asserting that Mary was sinless.
"We know that Mary was sinless because the angel Gabriel declared her so ("full of grace")." To declare someone "full of grace" is not synonymous with being sinless. Stephen (in Acts) was a man full of grace also - I assume you believe he is sinless also? And by the way, where exactly does it say that Mary was "full of grace" in one of the 27 books of the New Testament?
Sorry for the two posts. Again, I just don't see the distinction here. As you know the 1 Cor 5 passage is in the context of a church member who Paul says must be excommunicated due to his sexual immorality. How can this be accomplished without exercising judgement?
Hopefully, all American Christians owe their religious allegiance to God. God is not an American, and he is absolutely authoritarian in nature. Deal with it.
Here's a hint, pal. Several hundred thousand American Catholics shed their blood under the flag of the United States of America for your freedom. When you imply that Catholics aren't loyal Americans, you impugn their honor.
I'm named after a man who was a childhood friend of my father. They were altar boys together back in the early 1930's, and best friends.
My Dad's Catholic altar boy buddy gave his life for you on a little piece of hell in the Pacific called Iwo Jima.
You're welcome.
"I would encourage all Catholics to embrace either Pentacostal Christianity or Mormonism."
Why Mormonism? That has as many pagan influences/teachings as Catholicism!
Those are incidental aspects - you know that as well as I!
The important thing is you should strongly consider embracing a Protestant faith, because in many ways, decrees enacted in Rome are not ideologically compatible with American conservatism
Luke 1:28. Actually it doesn't say she "was" full of grace; the angel directly addreses her as "kecharitomene", already-completely-graced-one, as though that were her name.
That isn't how Stephen is described in Acts 6:8. It says he is "plureon cariton" (something like that; the font's not right for Greek in my browser); filled with grace.
You can worship "American conservatism" if you wish. As for me and my house, we will follow the Lord.
Catholicism is incompatible with American conservatism? You might try telling that to William Buckley, who largely created modern American conservatism.
Just as Peter, along with all the Apostles taught the people what they needed to know for salvation so does the Magisterium today. I would say that we don't need that preacher either if Catholics don't need a pope.
I am an American, so that is a whacko suggestion.
A whacko suggestion ... you mean like suggesting I ditch my religion because it's not compatible with American conservatism?
You are an Ian Paisley style Protestant bigot. I think you would like Belfast. Lots of people there worry about Catholics holding allegiance to the Pope.
Wow! Thanks for that great solution. I'm on my way to the mormon tabernacle right now!
Robert Byrd and the Dems are against Catholics. They are your enemies - the liberals
I am for Catholics, I just want them to find a Protestant church.
That does not follow at all. She was only conceived without sin through the application of Christ's sacrifice. She was saved by her Son, just like the rest of humanity; it's just that the salvation was applied retroactively in time. Also, it was not necessary that she be sinless...this is simply a sign that she was the immaculate ark of the new covenant.
It's depressing, but instructive, that there is still an element of that sort of thing in America, even in the 21st Century, no?
:) You should strongly consider embracing Catholicism, because in many ways Protestant teachings are not ideologically compatible with God.
My political views are the offshoot of my faith, not the other way around.
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