Posted on 04/14/2005 12:00:51 PM PDT by Dean Baker
Baptist church 'fake pope' sign attracting attention, criticism By JEANNINE F. HUNTER, hunter@knews.com April 13, 2005
NEWPORT, Tenn. - Two days after being posted, a church marquee message that questions the purpose of the papacy is still attracting attention in this small community.
"What I am trying to do is to let people know there's only one way to heaven through Jesus Christ," said the Rev. Cline Franklin, pastor of Hilltop Baptist Church. "There's no need for help. God sent his son, Jesus Christ. We're all priests if we're saved. I don't need to go to anybody else to pray."
The sign's side facing Broadway, the main thoroughfare in Newport, reads, "No truth, No hope Following a hell-bound pope!" On the other side, facing the church parking lot, it reads: "False hope in a fake pope."
The message appeared days after Pope John Paul II's funeral last week.
"It is unfortunate when it comes from within the Christian church. It's really sad," said the Rev. Dan Whitman, 54, pastor of Newport's Good Shepherd Catholic parish and Holy Trinity parish in Jefferson City. "You learn how to deal with it and pray not to be that way yourself."
It does not reflect mainstream Baptist thought, said Dr. Merrill "Mel" Hawkins, associate professor of religion and director of the Center for Baptist Studies at Carson-Newman College in Jefferson City.
"When you see signs like that, they are almost like relics or artifacts of a bygone era," Hawkins said.
He spoke about animus between Protestants and Catholics persisting after the Protestant Reformation and for centuries, during which "harsh things were said, couched within misperceptions, misunderstandings."
Among the major misperceptions is that Catholics "venerate the pope on the same level as Jesus," Hawkins said, and that "the pope is connected to their salvation in place of Jesus Christ."
Catholics make up about 12 percent of the population in the South.
"Catholics are a minority faith in the South, and there's often bias toward minority religious communities because people don't understand," he said.
James Gaddis, a lay speaker who also chairs the board at First United Methodist Church, said he had not seen the sign but had heard about it.
"I understand that it's very degrading," he said. "I think it's tragic that any church group would stoop to this posture."
Following Tuesday night's council meeting, Newport Mayor Roland Dykes Jr. said he was a little saddened by the message.
"It doesn't behoove any of us to determine who is going to heaven or hell. I think the pope is a highly, highly respected person," he said.
Franklin's church is a five-year-old independent Baptist church. When asked what the message meant, he said: "What does 'pope' mean? It means father. We have a heavenly father, and the Bible says we shall call no man a father. "
He said people have been driving by or taking pictures or calling to share their views. He said the intent was not to offend Catholics and people are misunderstanding the sign.
Copyright 2005, Knoxville News-Sentinel Co.
I believe The Baptist faith, being cleansed in the name of Christ and blessed with the Holy Spirit, is the only way and the beloved church of Christ, but I don't condemn others for their beliefs either. The beloved Church of Philadelphia was a small missionary Church much like the evangelical churches of today. He promised to give the people from the Church of Philadelphia the hidden manna. I'll follow the Church of Philadelphia any day!
It probably WASN'T a JW, for THEIR 'jesus' can't save ANYONE!
Thanks for the information. It is amazing that anyone would base an argument on a single misunderstood word from a foreign language that he or she does not speak.
Would you be so kind as to share this alternate translation?
And truly, do you honestly believe that we are never to judge others? Indeed I would say that even Jesus disagrees; a certain amount of judgement of others is necessary to satisfy, say, Matthew 18:15-17.
And I would not "condemn" a Pastor despite his error.
Poor choice of words on my part. "Rebuke" might have been better. And yes, I would rebuke a pastor; it can be done with respect.
HMmmm...,P>Why so LATE??
Why at ALL, after all that time??
Even if a person is mistaken or confused in some area of the interpretation of religious doctrine or biblical text that does not automatically translate into the conclusion that they are "bound for Hell." No living person knows who is or might be in Hell. If entrance to Heaven is limited exclusively to one denomination and only to those individuals in the denomination who have all the doctrines and biblical teachings straight in their minds, that would keep the Hell police awful busy keeping track of all the damned. Would that make sense in terms of a loving and merciful God?
There is a heresy within the assemblies of organized religion which has festered there for a long time and perpetuated by people who would like to see as many people in Hell as possible.
Me, too. More than enough. We have this discussion with a family member's in-laws. They seem blissfully unaware of the importance of Jesus in our faith. I'm asked if I've accepted Jesus. Of course I have. I remember, as a kid, how my mother would engage the Jehovah's witnesses and Mormons, rushing to get her Bible, lest they get away. I do the same now, and rush to get my Bible. Most leave at that point.
You say this:
"Each can choose their own faith as long as they don't bother the others about it."
But earlier you say this:
"You know why that is? Most people think you worship a mortal - Mary. Everything is Mary, not Christ. There's Mary's beads, statues, prayers, ornaments of Mary, but very little has to do with the one who bought you.
I always thought the Catholics made Mary their Goddess. That's all I ever saw. If one listens closely, they'll notice Mary is used to get to Christ in the end."
So why do YOU bother Catholics with this calumny?
To repeat an earlier post, the question is "What is Israel." Paul talks about how Jews that reject Christ are pruned from the branch (and gentiles who accept are grafted on). Here is my earlier response:
Well, not exactly. (I wish; I am an ethnic Jew.)
To quote Paul on this topic:
. . . For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham's children. On the contrary, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.” In other words, it is not the natural children who are God's children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's offspring . . . "
To make a long theological point very short, Christians are adopted into the promise, and Jews, while still the Chosen People, don't necessarily get the benfit of the promise, post-Christ, unless they accept Christ just like everyone else.
Sorry, but that's what they see. I'm just posting the message. Don't kill the messenger! That's what they say. I've heard the Pope, and he still believes in Christ. There's no argument here.
Just like your comment about Jews not believing in Heaven is patently untrue and I directed you to two sources with the correct answers.
It was on the History Channel, and that's why I posted it that way. The History Channel is often quite in the dark when it comes to religion.
How do Catholics accept Jesus as their Savior? Is it the same as we do - with a prayer?
Sorry, crazy Joe, but I'm exactly right about Carson-Newman regardless if it is your alma mater or not. Even the Tennessean newspaper has commented on this liberal baptist institution.http://www.tennessean.com/local/archives/03/11/42414642.shtml
As to inclusivism, as an MDiv student from the flagship Southern Baptist seminary, I am quite familiar with the doctrine and believe my biblical knowledge is adequate to judge whether or not such doctrine is genuine or heretical. Biblically, it is heresy. Emotionally, it makes folks feel better I suppose but is fraught with logical problems.
I have never heard of any Catholic considering themselves "born again." I do recall my former pastor stating that when asked if one has been saved, the Catholic response is that one has been "redeemed." Not sure if that helps, but I think you are mistaken on the "born again" aspect of Catholicism.
"It was then I realized that those of other religions simply don't consider "Being Catholic" as being enough."
Don't take it personally. JWs do that to everybody.
Ironically, I am told (have no knowledge) that there is some serious theological flaw in what JW believe (possibly rejecting Christ's diety-ness) that makes them not Christians. Don't really know, though.
Like any other program, the History Channel is bound to advertisers and time slots. Most religious subjects need more than any 1-2 hour program can offer.
That's what people say. That's why Catholics are often seen as "different." Don't blame me! It's not my job to teach them any different!!!
So why do YOU bother Catholics with this calumny?
Here's what I SAID...."That's all I ever saw. If one listens closely, they'll notice....(pay attention here)........ Mary is used to get to Christ in the end." "
redeemed = born again through the death of Christ.
It's 6 of one, half dozen of the other.
I am familiar with all of those verses. Perhaps you misunderstood me. The fear message used is that Catholics are going to hell merely for being Catholic. No other reason. No personal holiness or prayer life can possibly save them. Jesus has rejected them for no other reason. That falls way short. And, my personal favorite, no one who claims Jesus (and btw, Catholics regularly affirm their love for and faith in Jesus), regardless of any evil they do, whenever they do the evil, will go to hell. Jesus clearly warns each of us through the New Testament to avoid sin, to live as He taught us, by the examples He gave us. These verses do not say one is going to hell because one belongs to any Church that praises God and follows the teachings of His Son, Jesus. And following them is accepting them.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.