Measure could block Kennewick Man study

Seattle Post Intelligencer via AP ^ | October 1, 2004 | Matthew Daly

[Bernard Marx]

WASHINGTON -- Scientists hoping to study the ancient skeleton known as Kennewick Man are protesting a bill by Colorado Sen. Ben Nighthorse Campbell that they say could block their efforts.

A two-word amendment would change an Indian graves-protection law to allow federally recognized tribes to claim ancient remains even if they cannot prove a link to a current tribe.

Scientists say the bill, if enacted, could have the effect of overturning a federal appeals court ruling that allowed them to study the 9,300-year- old bones.

[Chad Fairbanks]

True. My only real problem with the Kennewick Man thing is the White Supremacist groups, such as the Astara Folk (or whatever it is they are called) that stuck their noses into it...

[fire_eye]

What could possibly define "heritage", other than racial origin? Racial origin would be the only thing you could subsatantiate. Cultural "heritage" is too nebulous to stand up to any sort of test; anyone can adopt cultural behavior. So, if Kennewick Man and the Europeans of today share a common racial origin, that would be all that would be possible, or necessary, to provide proof of common "heritage", if the matter were in dispute.

The Government entitlements which Indians receive are entirely race-based; they have nothing to do with economic status.

Actually, I'm curious - what does one have to do to prove one is "Indian" enough to receive the Federally run health care?

[Chad Fairbanks]

The bottom line is, you have absolutely ZERO evidence that "Kennewick Man" is anything but racially of Asian origin. That is the whole point, and there is nothing - NOTHING - about Kennewick Man that will end any Treaties, agreements, or any other arrangement that our Government has with the various tribes.

So chew on THAt for a while, and come back and talk to me when you can accept that fact :0)

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!!!

[Chani]

for later consumption

[fire_eye]

I'm not claiming I have evidence of anything - if anyone's got the evidence, it's those who have been reported in the media - and as pointed out in this thread - that Kennewick Man is suspected of being of European origin.

Meanwhile, it doesn't matter to me at all whether he's of Indian origin or not. The significance is in that there is an argument, with political consequences, over "his" racial origin. I.e., What does matter is that there are still Nazis among us, particularly on the Left, who equate race with culture and want to institutionalize Government preferences by race. The fact that the perpetrators are claiming to be "Doing Good", or that there are treaties which legalize these practices, does not in any way alter the fact that they are thoroughly evil.

[Chad Fairbanks]

I'm not claiming I have evidence of anything - if anyone's got the evidence, it's those who have been reported in the media - and as pointed out in this thread - that Kennewick Man is suspected of being of European origin.

Well, you are partially right - the initial person who studied Kennewick Man said it appeared Kennewick Man was "Caucusoid" - a politically-charged word that led people to assume "Caucasian". A minor point, but one that could mean that Kennewick Man was part of the Ainu of Japan, or perhaps from the subcontinent of India etc... "Caucasoid" doesn't automatically mean "European"... :0)

Meanwhile, it doesn't matter to me at all whether he's of Indian origin or not.

Same here - I just want to truth to be known about the various migrations to this continent - who came here, when, how etc...

The significance is in that there is an argument, with political consequences, over "his" racial origin.

Mostly by the white supremacist groups who, in a show of theatre, attempted to sue in order to get Kennewick Man returned to them as a "long-lost ancestor"...

I.e., What does matter is that there are still Nazis among us, particularly on the Left, who equate race with culture and want to institutionalize Government preferences by race.

I agree that the Nazis were Leftists, but that very little to do with Kennewick Man, except for what I mentioned above :0)

The fact that the perpetrators are claiming to be "Doing Good", or that there are treaties which legalize these practices, does not in any way alter the fact that they are thoroughly evil.

So, Treaties reached between sovereign nations, all constitutionally-valid, are "thoroughly evil". Ok... Maybe you need to go back and read the Constitution again, and check out what it say about the Indian Tribes. It has nothing to do with Kennewick Man, and anything found regarding Kennewick Man will have ZERO affect with regards to teh status of Indian Tribes, Treaties, or our Constitution...

And no amount of wishing will make it so.

[drhogan]

didn't the Native Americans also "stick their noses in it"? is that OK?
i'm not defending the white supremacists (and i doubt if the K-man was Euro), i'm just objecting to the way that some tribes and some politicians are blocking science.

[Chad Fairbanks]

I believe they did also "stick their noses into it" - the difference, however, is that the government implemented NAGRA, and NAGRA fell into play here, or so it was thought initially - that is what brought the indian tribes into it initially...

I agree with regards to people blocking science..

[SunkenCiv]

update:

Kennewick Man Scientists Protest Bill
by Matthew Daly
Associated Press Writer
Fri, Apr 08, 2005
reprised from Another Bone Of Contention Over Kennewick Man (John McCain)

Scientists hoping to study the ancient skeleton known as Kennewick Man are protesting legislation they say could block their efforts. They say a two-word amendment to a bill on American Indians would allow federally recognized tribes to claim ancient remains even if they cannot prove a link to a current tribe... The scientists successfully opposed a similar bill in the last Congress sponsored by then-Sen. Ben Nighthorse Campbell, R-Colo., chairman of the Senate Indian Affairs Committee. Campbell retired in January, but the bill has been revived in this Congress by the panel's new chairman, Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz... Four Northwest tribes — the Umatilla, Yakama, Nez Perce and Colville — had claimed they were entitled to the ancient bones under the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act. The tribes wanted the bones reburied without any scientific studies.

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[SunkenCiv]

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