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To: cpforlife.org
I really hate to write what I think about all this Terry Story. As a physician I can only say you can not judge each case by what you hear on T.V. Unless I could review all the notes etc. I refuse to comment on these types of cases. Surely you all know that you can not base your beliefs on what you hear from the media. To make a educated opinion you would have to have been this person's physicians from the beginning of their disease. I am sorry but there are many different dimensions to these cases to boil them all down to such simple answers. I as a physician have taken care of many terminal patients and care for many in a nursing home. Some things that modern medicine can do by technology are not humane in any way. I know this and I for sure as heck would not want to be kept alive with a feeding tube under certain circumstances. And I'm sorry but when you marry your spouse is your next of kin under law.Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions. I thought we supported marriage. I agree this case is awful because you have the husband and the womans family in court for over a decade arguing. You can hate all physicians as much as you want to but it will be a cold day in hell that I would want to be in her condition being keep alive by an artificial means with a tube placed surgically outside of my abdomen. And I admit she is probalby not brain dead(from what I have read) but her chances of getting better is 0%. I watched my Dad die a death he did not diserve but I would never have kept him "alive" for my own benefit.
18 posted on 11/05/2003 8:14:04 PM PST by therut
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To: therut
Watch the interview. Video is shown of this woman during her ordeal. As I said, you'd never know it now by looking at her, but she looked to be in as bad of shape as Terri, at one time.
19 posted on 11/05/2003 8:18:51 PM PST by RGVTx ("France seems to us an aging whore desperate to attract even the most diseased customers.")
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To: therut
BTW...her doctors were saying the same about her that you say about Terri...0% for recovery. She's a walking, talking, nice looking woman now.
20 posted on 11/05/2003 8:22:40 PM PST by RGVTx ("France seems to us an aging whore desperate to attract even the most diseased customers.")
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To: therut
I refuse to comment on these types of cases.

It seems to me that you just did.

you can not judge each case by what you hear on T.V.

That's very true ...... and "what you hear on T.V." includes such things as the fact that Terri is comatose and/or in a vegetative state, is on life support, and other mistaken information.

I thought we supported marriage.

I strongly support marriage .... therefore I find it abhorrent that the "husband" is living with a girlfriend (by whom he has one child already and another on the way) and pulling the ultimate in-your-face stunt by taking that girlfriend to the hospital to see Terri. It seems that he is the one who doesn't see Terri as his wife, to honor and to cherish til death parts them.

I am very sorry about your father. I will remember you in my prayers.

21 posted on 11/05/2003 8:32:45 PM PST by kayak (The Vast, Right-Wing Conspiracy is truly Vast! [JohnHuang2])
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To: therut
As a physician I can only say you can not judge each case by what you hear on T.V.

-----------------------------

And I am glad I am not your patient and never will be.

31 posted on 11/05/2003 9:18:24 PM PST by RLK
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To: therut
You can hate all physicians as much as you want to but it will be a cold day in hell that I would want to be in her condition being keep alive by an artificial means with a tube placed surgically outside of my abdomen. And I admit she is probalby not brain dead(from what I have read) but her chances of getting better is 0%.

For the record, I don't hate all physicians .. but I don't think all physicians are correct.

I had a friend, who keep going to her doctor because something wasn't right, she kept getting headaches and dizzy spells. He kept telling her one thing after another. It was an ear infection, she wasn't eating properly, blah blah blah. After some time and not getting the answers she needed, she finally bucked the ins. company and her doctor .. went to another doctor and paid for the visit and test herself. Turns out that she had a brain tumor. but it was to advanced to be operated on and she ended up dying at the age of 28 yrs. old on a Christmas Eve, leaving behind a 2 yr old son and husband.

The point of that story is that not all doctors are correct. In this case far more doctors have stated in their opinion that Terry could be rehabilitated then ones that say she can't. So why not give Terry the rehabilitation to see if it works before trying to kill her?

I may not agree with you on pulling the tube if it was you, but I can respect it. And as an educated person, I am assuming that you have instructions in writing should this occur to you.

Problem here is, Terry didn't leave instructions (unless you believe her husband to be an honest person) .. so should it not fall on the side of caution and let her live before trying to put her to death?

33 posted on 11/05/2003 9:22:58 PM PST by Mo1 (http://www.favewavs.com/wavs/cartoons/spdemocrats.wav)
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To: therut
You can hate all physicians as much as you want to but it will be a cold day in hell that I would want to be in her condition being keep alive...

Sorry about your dad, but those like you who have lost a loved one this way are OVERLY eager to justify death in ALL OTHER cases like these.

We don't hate physicians. We LOVE and BELIEVE the 20 or so caring doctors and medical providers who swear under oath Terri RESPONDS, and even TALKS, and CAN get better with treatment.

We BELIEVE the witnesses who say Terri was about to ask her violently abusive and quick tempered husband for a DIVORCE.

We BELIEVE Terri's friend from work who warned her NOT to be home alone when her angry husband got home.

We BELIEVE the medical experts who testify she was most likely STRANGLED that night.

We BELIEVE the husband deliberately withheld ANY treatment or rehab after he won the money, because now, he just wants her dead.

We BELIEVE Terri deserves the DIVORCE she attempted to seek in 1990.

We BELIEVE Terri's parents and siblings love her and wish to take over her care and rehabilitation, even WITHOUT the money.

We BELIEVE Terri's BEST FRIEND Diane Meyer, who says Terri argued ANGRILY in FAVOR of keeping a comatose patient ALIVE, claiming "Where there's life, there's hope"

We BELIEVE Judge Greer is a monster who ignores all other testimony that disagrees with the husband.

We BELIEVE the husband has ordered Terri cremated IMMEDIATELY upon her death WITHOUT an autopsy.

We BELIEVE Terri is the WORST POSSIBLE poster-child for the right-to-die crowd.

36 posted on 11/05/2003 9:35:58 PM PST by Future Useless Eater (Freedom_Loving_Engineer)
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To: therut
The definition of terminal has been perverted by some to include people deemed useless or unworthy of life, instead of just people dying of disease or illness.

I know this and I for sure as heck would not want to be kept alive with a feeding tube under certain circumstances. And I'm sorry but when you marry your spouse is your next of kin under law.Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions.

You're making a common mistake. You're trying to apply your wishes to her life. Sure you might not want to live that way, and you might not believe that anyone would. But, what bearing does that have in regards to Terri's wishes? She made had no advanced directive. Which brings us to your statement about marriage. Setting aside the fact that the husband has extramarital interests that cloud his judgement as a guardian, Terri has rights. Rights are not nullified by marriage.

It is a contradiction we hear so often that Terri's right to die is being infringed upon with no mention of her individual right to life not to be denied by disability, as protected by the Florida Constitution. Being human and with rights, with no advanced directive, and not being terminally ill, for Terri to die requires intervention; i.e. someone has to kill her. This goes against the state law that disallows euthanasia. This is because this isn't about her right to die, but her husband's hope to have a right to kill her.

This is not about conservatives wanting government intervention in deciding life or death. The conservative in us is fighting a poorly written right-to-die law that is allowing some to pervert it into a tool for killing others. A right to die does not equal another's right to kill. The conservative opinion recognizes the sanctity of life and an individual's rights, including that of life.
39 posted on 11/05/2003 9:48:27 PM PST by kenth (Terri is human. Her life is no less valuable than yours or mine.)
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To: therut
And I'm sorry but when you marry your spouse is your next of kin under law.Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions.

1) This particular "spouse" is living with and has fathered a child by, another woman. 2) Yes, even conservatives want the government to protect the lives of people -- even when it's another family member who's threatening someone's life. ARe you saying that the government has no role to protect children if they're being beaten savagely by their parents, or old people if they're being subjected to elder abuse? Protection of life is one of the few things government is created to do. And that duty doesn't stop merely because the threat to someone's life comes from a spouse or blood relative.

46 posted on 11/05/2003 11:12:30 PM PST by churchillbuff
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To: therut
I agree with you that we conservatives are curiously standing too near the wrong side of the bed in this case. To let the government decide when you can't pull the plug on a spouse, whose condition would otherwise be terminal, also gives the government the power to decide when you must!
However, in this case we aren't being asked to have government decide whether to keep someone on extrordinary life-perserving machinery without which she would expire. We are being asked to have the state, through the courts, authorize the witholding of food as a method of inducing a "natural death"! Well shucks...we all could die that way, naturally. If she were on a heart-lung machine or being otherwise artificially supported I would agree that shutting off the power to allow death to occur does nothing unatural. But I must draw the line at starving people to death because their "mind done gone".
47 posted on 11/05/2003 11:40:35 PM PST by cartoonistx
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To: therut
Terri never got the therapy to find out how far she could come back. Her husband refused to let it happen. It is one thing if therapy is attempted and it shows that there is indeed no responsiveness, it is quite another for a patient to show responsiveness but to have had no physical therapy!

Your reaction doesn't show reasoned medical judgment but rather an emotional upset at the thoughts of haveing to endure the travails of a sick family member and then applying that en mass to an entire classification of patient.

You do the thing you set out not to do(apply one recovered coma patient's experience to other coma patients) by mentioning your father!
58 posted on 11/06/2003 5:14:51 AM PST by mdmathis6
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To: therut
Terri is not terminally ill. She is disabled.
60 posted on 11/06/2003 6:03:19 AM PST by MarMema (KILLING ISN'T MEDICINE)
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To: therut
Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions

The government already decides such things.

62 posted on 11/06/2003 6:07:53 AM PST by syriacus (Casual comments about tubes, made after watching a 3 handkerchief movie, do not justify euthanasia.)
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To: therut
If you are a physician, I am Queen Marie of Rumania.
71 posted on 11/06/2003 9:28:05 AM PST by T'wit
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To: therut
And I'm sorry but when you marry your spouse is your next of kin under law.Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions. I thought we supported marriage.

I hope you are just saving your critical thinking skills for when you are on the job, and that you really can do better than this.

It is the purpose of the law to protect innocent human life. LAW: It is the basic justice system for THE PEOPLE, so each invidual is equally protected, whether or not that person is a minor, or married or a priest. I hope someday the status of a person's age, whether 16 weeks post conception or 16 weeks post onset of puberty, won't affect the legal protection of life either.
As for supporting marriage as a covenant recognized by the law, we also must judge whether the husband and wife are honoring the covenant. To legally honor a sham adulterous union is to harm marriage, not support it.
Barfing up GOVERNMENT as if it is the bitter enemy when it seeks to protect a vulnerable life when you are defending an unrecognized right to starve someone is not conservatism.

79 posted on 11/06/2003 10:11:10 AM PST by ValerieUSA
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To: therut
As a typical doctor, you don't listen when people are talking to you explaining something OR read anything you should to make a proper diagnoses.

It would not surprise me to learn that patients of yours died from medical neglect. You really don't listen at all do you"

Terri was NEVER terminally ill. The hospice used by her husband should have told him NEVER to bring her there. He dumped her there to make sure she died.

Read the facts before looking stupid.
83 posted on 11/06/2003 10:41:16 AM PST by atruelady
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To: therut
As a physician I can only say......

I know this and I for sure as heck would not want to be kept alive with a feeding tube under certain circumstances. And I'm sorry but when you marry your spouse is your next of kin under law.Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions. I thought we supported marriage....

Really. How we all suffer from a lack of knowledge. Attempt to follow the suggestion to review her bone scan results and picture yourself as one of her parents.

Take the time to go to the link below-cut and paste it up on your go to area, and take the time to review the bone scan findings of Terri dated 3-5-1991. Of course this does not mean anything to you, but ya know, I bet if Terri were your dtr, and YOU were fighting a spouse who has behaved a MS has, especially considering he REMEMBERED she wanted to be put down if artifically helped to live, EIGHT YEARS AFTER her injury!!! And that, after taking over a million dollars for her rehabilitation!!! Which, of course, went to $$$ for a hired attn working to put her to death. So...each individual case....RIGHT, therut? Put a little time where your posted opinion is...and report back.

http://www.cnsnews.com/storyimages/2003/terrischiavobonescanreport.jpg

Therut, I was stunned at how many bones were injured. (But I think you know someone who could interpret the paragraphs on the findings-perhaps, yourself? Maybe-a little? It would be the report YOU would recieve from the radiologists, after all.)

The thoracic injurys are what concerned me most...I just don't understand how a judge could overlook something this overwhelming...it crys out for justice! But the ribs, other vertebrae, and other evidence of bone injury are pretty damning.

Here is the email address again, of Terri's bone scan findings:

http://www.cnsnews.com/storyimages/2003/terrischiavobonescanreport.jpg

As one Freeper wrote-"She was beat to a pulp....more than once"

89 posted on 11/06/2003 11:00:16 AM PST by Republic
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To: therut
And I'm sorry but when you marry your spouse is your next of kin under law.Conservatives are crapping in their own pampers wanting the GOVERNMENT to decide life and death decisions

Well Doctor, if we as a nation are going to " err"....lets " err on the side of caution and life"!!!!!

91 posted on 11/06/2003 11:16:44 AM PST by pollywog (Psalm 121;1 I Lift mine eyes to the hills from whence cometh my help.)
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To: therut
For a physician, you sure write like an uneducated person.

"Physician, heal thyself!"
99 posted on 11/06/2003 2:15:53 PM PST by Babalu ("Tracer rounds work both ways ...")
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To: therut
"I refuse to comment on these types of cases. "

Looks like you just did.

"I really hate to write what I think about all this Terry Story."

Then don't.
100 posted on 11/06/2003 2:57:02 PM PST by honeygrl (Surgeon General's Warning: This FReeper hasn't slept through the night in over a year.)
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