Lawyers eye former pope's blueprint to shield clergy

Boston Herald.com ^ | Wednesday, July 30, 2003 | Robin Washington

[Land of the Irish]

A Latin document bearing the seal of Pope John XXIII outlined a 1962 Vatican procedure for shielding sexually abusive priests, two lawyers for plaintiffs in cases against the church maintain.

The ``Crimine Solicitationis,'' translated as ``Instructions on proceeding in cases of solicitation,'' states abuse cases are subject to the ``papal secret'' and threatens excommunication against victims who do not come forward within 30 days, according to the document given to authorities by Carmen Durso of Boston and Daniel J. Shea of Houston.

On Monday, Durso presented an English translation to U.S. Attorney Michael Sullivan.

``We gave it to the U.S. Attorney because we wanted him to understand what we mean when we say this has been an ongoing conspiracy,'' he said.

Added Shea, ``It's an instruction manual for a rigged trial for a priest accused of sexual crimes, including crimes against children.''

The document, which Shea said he had been trying to uncover for more than a year and recently received from canon lawyer the Rev. Thomas Doyle, allows victims one month to make their claim known to the supervising bishop.

``The penitent must denounce the accused priest . . . within a month to the (bishop) . . . and the confessor must, burdened seriously in conscience, warn the penitent of this duty,'' the document states.

``The confessor is the accused priest,'' Shea said.

``They're giving the priest the responsibility to tell his victim that the victim has to turn the priest in to the bishop within 30 days. If not, the victim is automatically excommunicated,'' he said, citing another passage.

A Boston Archdiocese spokesman could not be reached for comment and the Herald could not verify yesterday if the document was indeed genuine.

But both lawyers said they believed the Latin original to be authentic.

[Antoninus]

AmChurch: Where the Body of Christ is hidden in a closet, and the priests aren't!

Very good. Have you ever heard Fr. Corapi's story from his seminary days about "Jesus in the Closet"?

[narses]

As the offtimes difficult task of fraternal correction is indeed a spiritual work of mercy, true charity then is being displayed here.

[Saint Athanasius]

Did you read the article?

No...

Let us start off with a simple question

Are there any errors in the Council? No! Agree or Disagree?

I am not talking preference... aka Tridentine vs. NO...

I am asking about errors... are there any?

[ultima ratio]

Yes.

[Saint Athanasius]

Hey I got married on the same day you decided to join the FR family... great day! St. Thomas More's Feast Day!

fraternal correction by the way does not mean... you are an idiot!... which I see a lot of...

It's not about winning arguements; it is about winning souls.

[ultima ratio]

The Council stated the Church of Christ "subsists in" the Catholic Church, thus establishing that the two are separate. The Catholic Church has always claimed it IS the Church Christ founded, thus establishing they are one and the same. These two concepts are irreconcilable.

[Saint Athanasius]

Okay... so, you don't think Vatican II an Ecumenical Council... under your definition it can't be... because Ecumenical Council are error free...

I am correct with you thinking so far?

I am trying to find where we have common ground if that is okay.

[Saint Athanasius]

The Council stated the Church of Christ "subsists in" the Catholic Church, thus establishing that the two are separate. The Catholic Church has always claimed it IS the Church Christ founded, thus establishing they are one and the same. These two concepts are irreconcilable.

Is this the only error?

[sinkspur]

BTW, congratulations to you and your bride on the birth of your baby.

You can spend some of the sleepless nights here, as you feed and rock your little one.

Aren't kids fun?

[ultima ratio]

By the way, I had read the article before you posted it. I mention the "subsists in" of Lumen Gentium as an example of a teaching that is in conflict with traditional doctrine about the Church's identity.

[Thorondir]

fraternal correction by the way does not mean... you are an idiot!... which I see a lot of...

Who said that, exactly? And "a lot of" would mean more than once. I just can't find that phrase in this thread. Can you help me out in that regard? I know that our good brother sinkspur has been namecalling and even gang-namecalling, but he didn't use the phrase, "you are an idiot!" Not that I can see, anyway. Just curious.

[sinkspur]

I note you ignored the Gospel

No. I ignored you.

When you and Thorondir can stop acting like hyenas, heaping contempt on me, then we can talk.

Until then, both of you are on "ignore."

Study Antoninus. Though we disagree, he is civil.

[Thorondir]

Come on, my friend. That seems like word-parsing in the most Clintonesque fashion. Jesus christ is the Church and lives in his members who make up the Church on earth. I just don't see the huge problem with the words. To subsist in is to live in.

I wish so much that you and I could speak in person.

[Saint Athanasius]

Thanks... that is what I did last night... my wife thinks I am a freeperolic... and she is usually right.

[ultima ratio]

How many is enough for you? We can play this game all night.
In Dei Verbum the Council states the Church has always venerated Scripture AS she venerates the Lord's Body. Not true. We reverence the one, but worship the other. Granted the "as" is ambiguous, but the statement is a distortion of the truth.

[Saint Athanasius]

I was paraphasing on the "You are the idiot"... no one said it directly... it was more the indirect... you are an idiot... and your mom is Ugly...

I don't think you find that either, but you get the idea.

[Thorondir]

I have no contempt for you, a brother baptized into the mystical body of Christ, just for your unholy and destructive ideas that are ruinous to my Church. You always get to this "ignore" tactic when you are proved wrong or caught in duplicitous thinking.

Very well. I think we will be able to get along just fine without you.

Dominus vobiscum

[narses]

"No. I ignored you."

No you didn't, you stopped responding to me when I answered your question regards Our Lord and gold. You are the name caller and the one who claims the Church (prior to V2) failed the test of Christian behavior. Again. And now you lie about your behavior here vis-a-vis me. Why?

[Saint Athanasius]

two is enough...

I will do some reading and I will get back to you... I have to watch the little one (which I am not doing a good job), and I am sure you don't mind if we take a rain check on the discussion.

[Saint Athanasius]

Et Cum Spiritu tuo