Posted on 09/03/2002 12:16:14 PM PDT by Aliska
Miracle Cure: Priest's recovery brings sainthood to Polish nun
By Caryle Murphy/The Washington Post In 1995, the Rev. Ronald P. Pytel, just 48, had resigned himself to an idle life and early death. His heart was so damaged that simply walking made him winded. His complexion was pallid, his weight a gaunt 140 pounds. His quality of life, he recalls one doctor saying, "wasn't worth a plug nickel." But the pastor of Holy Rosary Catholic Church in Baltimore, like many of his parishioners, had long been devoted to Faustina Kowalska, a Polish nun and mystic who died in 1938. At a healing service in October 1995, he and a dozen church members were praying to her for his health when Pytel fell to the floor and, although conscious, couldn't get up for 15 minutes. "I could talk, but I couldn't move a muscle," he recalled. "It was as though I was paralyzed." When he finally stood up, he felt so fit he began laughing. Nowadays, the blond Pytel has the rosy cheeks of a choirboy, weighs a hearty 170 pounds and swims with abandon. His pumping machine is so robust he jokes of having "the heart of a 19-year-old." He and his parishioners call what happened a miracle. And so does the Catholic Church.
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(Excerpt) Read more at detnews.com ...
Now you are communicating! At least effectively enough for me, this time. I confess to being quite lost through much of this thread....
I can certainly see how you think this. I think it involves more, however, the concept of sobornost among the members of the church. This concept is not highly rated among the protestant churches, as I understand it. You are more vested in individualism and western values. The RC church has retained some eastern qualities and I believe this to be one they have kept.
Think of it like Drushenka's onion. Maybe that will help.
1 Cor 15:52 (KJV) In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1 Cor 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1 Cor 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
1 Cor 15:55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
1 Cor 15:56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
1 Cor 15:57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Amen
Our pastor recently told the story of his trip to Israel. While he was there, he rented a car and drove out into the countryside. He saw shepherds with their flock. Reflecting on the wealth of scripture relating to shepherds, he pulled over to watch them.
He was most intrigued to note that the shepherds lead their flock to different pastures that were "fenced" in on all sides EXCEPT for the gate. There was no gate. Once the sheep were gathered inside the pasture, the shepherd "himself" became the gate.
It truly brought new meaning to all of these scriptural passages. I am the door; by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and go out, and shall find pasture.
Yep God will do as God will do...He does not need to punch my time clock:>)
Be sure to use this tripe during your particular judgment. Particularly the "God is irrelevant" part.
If the Saints are not omnipresent How can they be worshiping God (as scripture tells us )AND hear the prayers of men all over the world?
Your finite mind has difficulty comprehending the power of God and the nature of heaven. The Saints in heaven are outside the limitations of time and space and those constraints which impede our comprehension. Scripture tells us that with God all things are possible. Since there is no sin in heaven then what are the prayers of the Saints about and who are they for? 1 Corinthians 13:12 "We see now through a glass in a dark manner; but then face to face. Now I know in part; but then I shall know even as I am known." If we are all saints as you contend, then how is it that believers on earth can intercede for one another by praying for each other and not destroy Christs's role as the one mediator but glorified Saints in heaven cannot? James 5:16 "Confess therefore your sins one to another: and pray one for another, that you may be saved. For the continual prayer of a just man availeth much."
The church has made mini gods of them ...messengers and servers of man not those worshiping God
Not true. Can you cite that section of the Catechism which elevates the Saints to mini gods? Who makes up the cloud of witnesses over our heads as Paul wrote in Hebrews 12:1?
Your prayers to them are an abomination to God! You steal the Glory of God ...and deny Jesius His role as mediator
Again untrue. You do realize that you'll have to answer for these remarks, don't you? It's truly sad that you've strayed, like so many others, so far from the truth.
1 Timothy 2:1-5 "I desire therefore, first of all, that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men: For kings, and for all that are in high station: and that we may lead a quiet and a peaceable life in all piety and chastity. For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour, Who will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus:"
Still waiting for you to provide that quote from Scripture stating those in heaven are dead. Did Elijah and Enoch die after being taken to heaven?
So you are saying that saints are omnipresent and mini gods . You ascribe the traits of God to his creation
Your prayers to them are an abomination to God! You steal the Glory of God ...and deny Jesius His role as mediator Again untrue. You do realize that you'll have to answer for these remarks, don't you? It's truly sad that you've strayed, like so many others, so far from the truth.
Deuteronomy 18:9-12, "When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations. There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch, Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer. For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee."
Exodus 20:2-3, "I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt have no other gods before me."
We speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory, but as it is written, eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for them that love Him. But God has revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searches all things, yes, even the deep things of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is of God, that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teaches. but which the Holy Ghost teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. We have the mind of Christ.
Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant. Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant. Wherefore brethren, covet to prophesy.
We are to be aware of the gifts of the Holy Spirit and are not return the talent without interest, at the least.
Yes, thank you! A mystery, incomprehensible for most of our human minds. Which is why faith is so difficult at times, I suppose.
Not I. My words were "what if..?" It was a question, not a declaration. I was asking your opinion, believe it or not.
So are you saying that all spiritual gifts are from the Holy Spirit, then? In what way should we return the talent?
Never said any such thing, in fact I stated that Saints are not omnipresent. The fact that you have resorted to lying shows that the man-made foundation you argue from is constructed of sand. You've been seduced by the purveyors of evil.
Still waiting for you to provide the passage from Scripture that says those in heaven are dead.
Scripture proves that you are both ignorant and a liar.
Praying to the Saints
"‘And as for the dead being raised, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the passage about the bush, how God said to him, "I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob"? He is not God of the dead, but of the living . . .’" (Mark 12:26-27)
"Pray at all times in the Spirit with all prayer and supplication. To that end keep alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints, and also for me . . ." (Eph. 6:18).
"Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely . . ." (Heb. 12:1).
"And when he had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints . . ." (Rev. 5:8).
What does ominpresent mean to you? If only God is omnipresent then He is the only one that can hear all of us as we pray..only He is present to each of us
Your answer on this was doubletalk..no they are not omnipresent BUT...eithor they are or they are not..If they are which is what you indicate with your belief that can worship God and at the same time be aware of every prayer said by man...that is a mini god you are describing
Still waiting for you to provide the passage from Scripture that says those in heaven are dead
1 Cor 15:52 (KJV) In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1 Cor 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1 Cor 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
1 Cor 15:55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
1 Cor 15:56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
1 Cor 15:57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
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