Posted on 06/11/2019 8:45:31 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
And just so we’re clear, I may have extreme wariness of the Talmud, but that does NOT mean I’m an anti-Semite. If anything, I’d defend Jews from actual anti-Semites and have no tolerance for anti-Semitism.
Help from whom....Rabbi....?
Sorry, the post was so stupid and ignorant I was giving you the benefit of the doubt that you come from a disadvantaged situation.
I didn’t know you were stupid by your own volition.
Look, the Talmud is the oral law, written down. Imperfectly. It conflicts and has issues because it was written down in a hurry to preserve knowledge that was going to be lost.
It is not for the unwary, not for those who don’t have many learned teachers helping them avoid rabbit holes, and not for the unintelligent.
Nonetheless, the Talmud contains almost all of the moral teachings of the Christian testaments, and, indeed, is quoted extensively by Paul and Jesus for theological reasons already noted on this thread.
If you claim to be a Christian and you claim the Talmud is a fraud, you are claiming Jesus and Paul are fraudsters.
So maybe reconsider the trailer park excuse.
Or, stop cutting-and-pasting crap from Stromfront and other Nazi sites.
Greetings_Puny_Humans, for one thing. There’s also Yossi Gurvitz, who last I checked was not only Jewish, but also a student of the Talmud, and also Nicholas Donin, aka the Jewish convert to Catholicism who first made the Church aware of the passages in the Talmud. That said, I may have seen a few quotes by Rabbis confirming as much, though, like here: http://www.chabad.info/index.php?url=article_en&id=26288 also, the Jewish Encyclopedia gives this article as well: http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/9443-kol-nidre/ You can also look up the 1994 60 Minutes interview with Rabbi Meir Kahane as well. Also, Rabbi Tzvi Marx admitted in 1994 in Tikkun: A Bi-Monthly Jewish Critique May-June, 1994 that there were two Talmuds issued, one authentic, the other for conning non-Jews, and specifically indicated one difference between the two regarding Maimonides’ teachings: The publically consumed one mentioned that one transgressed the law by killing a human being, the actual one specifically states “Israelite”. There’s plenty more here with full annotations: https://goyimgazette.com/truth-talmud/
It would be in the best interests of Jews to toss out their Talmud, it only harms them more than helps them. Even Jesus condemned it.
I won't pretend that anything I say will disuade you from rejecting Yeshua the Messiah. Before anyone goes off on the use of the name Yeshua, know that it is simply a Aramaic/Hebrew to English translation of Jesus. There is no 'deception' in its use as so many have asserted.
By your statement, you take great pride in the fact that Judaism is older than Christianity and that is one of the reasons Christians are 'irked' at Jews. Frankly, I know of no Christian who feels this way. Possibly, you're reflecting your Jewish pride when you make such an assertion.
Christians embrace both the Torah and the New Testament because they are the Word of God. I can say with virtual certainty that Judaism being older than Christianity is not why Jews irk some Christians.
You've also stated that Christians are irked because Jews reject the gospel. This may be true for a few Christians but from my experience, Christians generally fall into two camps when it comes to Jews. The first camp is, "they are Jews and Jews reject Christ - don't bother with them." The second camp is, "they are Jews and the good news about Jesus the Messiah is to be preached to the Jew first, therefore I will share the gospel and/or my testimony concerning my Christian experience with Jews."
There are nuances that Christians might embrace that you may not understand. One of them is from the New Testament scripture, where Jesus instructs Believers to "not throw your pearls before swine, lest they turn and tear/hurt you". This admonition is concerning anyone hostile to the gospel - not just unbelieving Jews. Jesus also told his disciples to go into cities and teach them about Him and if those places reject them, that they (disciples)are to kick the dirt off their shoes and go to the next city. Essentially what Jesus is saying is that if people reject me, don't further waste your time. In addition to Scripture, Christians 'should' be led by the Holy Spirit (Ruach Hako'desh) who indwells the Christian. Again - no deception here. Ruach Hako'desh is Hebrew for Holy Spirit.
What am I saying, Christians are commanded to evangelize the world, to the Jew first and then the Gentile. However, this there are nuances to this command previously explained.
I bid you sincere Shalom through the Prince of Prince (Sar-shalom). His name is Jesus (Yeshua).
Ooops!! It should have read, "English to Aramaic/Hebrew translation of Jesus."
Jewish Encyclopedia isn’t even from Stormfront or Nazi sites. If anything, it’s written BY Jewish people. Specifically being written Funk and Wagnalls and compiled by Isidore Singer. And it was written in 1907, long before Nazism was even a concept, let alone Stormfront. And Jews for Jesus, which also backed that claim up, are Messianic Jews as implied by the title, so they obviously aren’t of Stormfront.
And just as an FYI, if I were that stupid, I would have quoted from the Protocol of the Elders of Zion, which actually IS a forgery. Note that I never mentioned quoted from them at all, because I know that’s a forgery and thus inapplicable.
Also, I think the fact that Nicholas of Donin, Yossi Gurvitz, and Rabbi Tzvi Marx’s own comments on the matter made it very clear that the Talmud is as compatible to Christianity as a fish is to Death Valley.
Also, what Jesus and Paul quoted was the written Torah (which I have absolutely no quarrel with due to it being the Old Testament), not the Talmud, aka, the Oral Torah, the Talmud is the one where they claim that God’s little more than a puppet who can’t do anything without a majority vote from the rabbinic council, or that Jesus is boiling in hot excrement (which, BTW, was verified in the Jewish Encyclopedia), something I certainly doubt Jesus would have approved of, or his father, or certainly Paul. In fact, Jesus if anything condemned the Talmud during his time on Earth, then called the Mishnah, citing it nullified the teachings of the Bible. If the Son of God condemns it, it’s pretty clearly not the Bible or equivalent of it. Read this if you don’t believe me: https://www.christianforums.com/bible/mark/7:1-13/ Also read this: https://www.christianforums.com/threads/what-the-talmud-says-about-jesus.1069951/
Should have read, "Prince of Peace (Sar-shalom)"
I really, really need to do a better job of proof-reading.
Rabbi GPH?
I also cited some actual rabbis who revealed this, like Tzvi Marx for example.
I am pretty sure the Got mit uns (God is with us) was sported by the Wehrmacht, while the SS had Meine Ehre heißt Treue (’My honour is loyalty’)
well, religiously Christian, but ethnically Jewish. Just as there are atheist Jews in New york who are religious not Jewish but ethnically so - incidentally, the Nazis killed folks who were ethnically Jewish - didn’t matter what they believed or didn’t believe in. Nazis were wackadoodles in any case, killing “Aryan” Gypsies, Poles and Russians as well.
Yeshua is the Aramaic name for yehoshua or jesus or ieosus or Jezu. No harm in using it
With the destruction of the 2nd temple, the sects that relied on the temple, the sacrifices and the priests (Cohens) were destroyed as their very core was destroyed. This was reinforced with the Bar kochkba revolt where Judaic peoples slaughtered the pagan gentiles in Cyrene and Cyprus - thereby bringing the wrath of the Romaoi Empire on themselves and getting themselves banned from their Holy Land
2nd temple Judaism died in 69 AD and it was succeeded by 3 sects - or daughter religions
The Sadduccee and Essene sects died out
Net-net -> Christianity and Modern-day Judaism are sister religions both arising out of 2nd Temple Judaism. In fact the Jewish canon was closed well into the Christian era at the Council of Jamnia where Christocentric texts were edited out.
None of this justifies in any way any kind of persecution of one by the other.
I have zero intention of persecuting Jews. Converting them, sure, converting them enmasse, certainly. But not persecution. I don’t even intend to wish them death.
Also, based on Jesus’s comments in Matthew, the Talmud was a bastardization of the Bible, divorced from actual Judaism, let alone Christianity (and quite frankly, I can never forgive the writers of the Talmud for making God the Father, weak and dumb). If you ask me, people should be more outraged at how they treated God the Father than their treatment of Mary and Jesus. Yes, it was disgusting, but it goes with the territory, as even Jesus said he’ll ultimately have enemies. But when they mock and denigrate Jesus’s father, who BTW is pretty much the reason they are a chosen race, I’m sorry, but that’s just unforgivable and something to condemn outright. I can forgive their desecration of Jesus and Mary, but I can never forgive their desecration of God the Father.
Don’t bother with the mouth breather.
He read some stuff on the Internet and stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, so he is practically a Rabbi.
Hence why my “one post” rule, which I am going back to now.
I didn’t say you did :) I just put it as a disclaimer for myself
Please could you elaborate on “and quite frankly, I can never forgive the writers of the Talmud for making God the Father, weak and dumb” — I don’t know enough about this
I’m referring to a passage in the Talmud, Bava Metzia 59b, which had a rabbi debating God, and said rabbi outright beating God in said debate, with God even blasphemously stating as much in that passage “He laughed [with joy], he replied, saying, ‘My sons have defeated Me, My sons have defeated Me.’”. The same passage said, and I quote, “Since God already gave the Torah to the Jewish people on Mt. Sinai we no longer pay attention to heavenly voices. God must submit to the decisions of a majority vote of the rabbis.” You can read it in full here:
http://www.angelfire.com/ak5/salafi/RabbiDebateGodAndGodAdmitsDefeat.htm
Bear in mind that God, that is to say, God the Father, is omnipotent and omniscient. He literally cannot be beaten in a debate or restrained, forced to submit to a majority vote by ANYONE, let alone mortals such as rabbis. If anything, if one were to even enter a debate with God, it would result in God utterly wiping the floor with his opponent before the first question is even delivered, no winning against him. And when God loses in a debate to a mere mortal, that effectively implies God is dumb, at least dumber than that mortal.
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