Posted on 12/14/2014 11:57:21 AM PST by ealgeone
The reason for this article is to determine if the worship/veneration given to Mary by the catholic church is justified from a Biblical perspective. This will be evaluated using the Biblical standard and not man’s standard.
Happens to me all the time.:-)
That tells me that he did die. Also God would not allow the Israelites to enter the promised land until Moses was dead.
Don't get me wrong, I'm speculatin just like everybody. But I need to align my speculatin with scripture. :-)
That's right, Jesus IS God in the flesh, which was why he could remain sinless while tempted in all points as we are, yet without sin. Mary is not God. It's kinda strange how you are more willing to believe Jesus sinned than Mary did. Astonishing, actually!
Now I haven't the slightest idea what that means, but...
All that said, the Lord is wonderful and digging into Scripture and reading what others report from having dug into it is a wonderful treat.
Thx so much for all your work on this thread.
I was born again of the spirit when I was baptized with the water and words I baptize you in the name of the father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
And again when I was confirmed in the faith and had hands laid upon me by both my sponsor and the Bishop.
that I have been saved by the death of our Lord,
that I am being saved by the continued work of the Holy Spirit within me
and that I will be saved if judged worth in my particular judgement.
Anima Christi
Soul of Christ, sanctify me.
Body of Christ, save me.
Blood of Christ, inebriate me.
Water from the side of Christ, wash me.
Passion of Christ, strengthen me.
O good Jesus, hear me.
Within your wounds conceal me.
Do not permit me to be parted from you.
From the evil foe protect me.
At the hour of my death call me.
And bid me come to you,
to praise you with all your saints
for ever and ever.
Amen.
For the Greater Glory of God
Please keep in mind that these are ALL printed Catholic Bibles and covers the period from 1469 AD to 1592AD
these are separate printings of the same Latin Vulgate Bible and were printed by Catholics.
and PS Gutenburg was a ‘gasp’ Catholic
Early Printed Bibles - in Latin 1454 onwards
http://www.bl.uk/reshelp/findhelprestype/prbooks/earprintbib/earlyprintedbiblesinlatin/earlyprintedbibleslatin.html
The first substantial book to come from a European printing press was a Christian Bible designed to be read aloud in churches and monasteries. This was the Gutenberg Bible (otherwise known as the ‘42-line Bible’ or ‘Mazarin Bible’).
The Gutenberg Bible was printed in the German city of Mainz in 1454-1455 by Johann Gutenberg, possibly working with Johann Fust and Peter Schoeffer. The ‘42 lines’ refers to the number of lines of text printed on each full page. About 180 copies were produced. The British Library holds two of the 46 complete copies known to survive [C.9.d.3,4; G.12226-27], as well as one fragment [IC.56a].
Leaf 1 of Gutenberg’s 42-line Bible
Leaf 1 of Gutenberg’s 42-line Bible (Mainz, 1455). BL shelfmark: C.9.d.4. Copyright © The British Library Board
Enlarge Enlarge
The two complete copies have been fully digitised and are free to view at Treasures in Full: Gutenberg Bible.
The version of the text reproduced in the Gutenberg Bible is St Jerome’s translation into Latin, which dates from the late 4th century AD. This is also the text used in the next two major Bibles to be printed:
the ‘36-line Bible’ (otherwise known as the ‘Bamberg Bible’), printed anonymously in Bamberg, Germany, 1458/59 [C.9.d.5,6];
the ‘48-line Bible’, printed by Johann Fust and Peter Schoeffer in Mainz, 1462 [IC.102; C.6.d.15].
The first printed book to cite its printer and date of production is also a Latin-language biblical text: a Book of Psalms printed by the same Fust and Schoeffer in 1457. The work is generally known as the Mainz Psalter, and the British Library holds copies of the first [G.12216] and later editions, which tend to vary in the arrangement of their content.
Continuing a long tradition found in manuscript Bibles, many of the earliest printed texts are ‘glossed’, or in other words contain a commentary either between the lines of text or in the margins. Important early glossed editions held by the Library include:
Latin Bible with the Glossa Ordinaria (Strasbourg: Adolf Rusch, 1480) [IC.813; IC.814; facsimile at RAR 220.571].
Latin Bible with the Glossa Ordinaria and the commentary of Nicholas of Lyra (Basel: Johann Froben and Johann Petri, 1498) [IB.37895].
Latin Bibles with the commentary of Hugh of St Cher (Basel: Johann Amerbach, 1498-1502) [IB.37901].
Further Latin biblical texts were also printed in Germany, Switzerland and Italy during the remainder of the 15th century. Copies are most easily identified by searching the Incunabula Short Title Catalogue. Detailed descriptions of copies in the British Library are given in Catalogue of books printed in the XVth century now in the British Museum (Library) (see Selected Bibliography).
At the Council of Trent (1545-1563), the Catholic Church commissioned a revision of St Jerome’s translation in order to standardize the text after numerous variations had been introduced during the Renaissance and Reformation. The first revision to emanate from this work was the Sistine Vulgate (Rome, 1590) [2.e.5]. This was withdrawn from circulation and re-issued in 1592 as the Clementine Vulgate [C.110.k.4; 5.h.9,10]. The Clementine version continued to be the usual Latin text found in printed Bibles of the Catholic tradition until the mid-20th century.
British Library - Incunabla Short Title Catalogue
http://istc.bl.uk/search/browse.html?operation=scan&numreq=25&fieldidx1=dc.date&fieldrel1=exact&fieldcont1=
Term Records
— start of index —
1 apr. 1469 1
1 apr. 1474 1
1 apr. 1477 1
1 apr. 1478 1
1 apr. 1478/79 1
1 apr. 1479 2
1 apr. 1480 2
1 apr. 1482 1
1 apr. 1483 1
1 apr. 1485 2
1 apr. 1486 1
1 apr. 1489 3
1 apr. 1490 5
1 apr. 1491 4
1 apr. 1492 2
1 apr. 1493 1
1 apr. 1495 4
1 apr. 1496 2
1 apr. 1497 4
1 apr. 1500 2
1 aug. 1471 1
1 aug. 1472 1
1 aug. 1475 1
1 aug. 1477 1
1 aug. 1479 1
please click the links above to see the actual works.
For the Greater Glory of God
folks what do you call a person who persists on bothering someone when they ask them to stop?
a good protestant?
don’t worry he’s just a harmless guy?
resident evil?
BTW, I didn’t ask you to OBEY me asked you indulgence in not posting to me.
just the fact that you use the word OBEY in response to my request and the other gentleman who has also requested your stop indicates you have some personality issues, maybe BPD?
maybe if all those who wish you to stop just say pretty please will that help?
or can you do it for:
The Greater Glory of God
do you even go to Church?
yes or No?
If you do go to Church did you hear that much scripture?
Yes or No?
AMDG
however you can’t find a scriptural reference that she is dead
so to believe your premise would be unscriptural.
AMDG
I am eternally happy to hear that.
I had a sneaking suspicion that you were a good guy from the very beginning of this thread.
We prots don't hate the Catholic Church or Catholics (however much we may disagree)...and please forgive us if we are rude and blunt.
So let's make peace and argue the fine print joyfully. It is Christmas soon after all.
Prots actually love Mary madly...we just fear that the old syncretism of Diana, Astarte, Semiramis, etc, is seeping back into the faith under the guise of Marianism.
I asked you first.
So if you believe Mary is dead your belief is entirely unscriptural unless you can come up with the scriptural text that SAYS MARY IS DEAD.
AMDG
I think that most protestants totally misinterpret Matthew 25...Most of the gospel is telling the sheep how their ACTIONS AND BEHAVIOR were major considerations as to which side they would be placed...The King would say to those on the right...come and be blessed by the Father...Inherit the kingdom BECAUSE.... when I was hungry, you fed me, when I was thirsty, you gave me to drink, you visited me in prison, you clothed me, you cared for me when I was ill,etc...and BECAUSE OF THESE ACTIONS TO THE LEAST BROTHERS OF MINE..you are saved...and the rest of you who didn't feed, clothe, visit, etc...you'll be considered goats and go wherever... The good sheep are the Christians who do the good things pointed out...The Christians, who tell a good story, claim a lot of credit for being "born again", but are all talk and no action are in a bit of trouble...
when did I not do good, visit, feed clothe, etc....when you didn't do it to the least of us, you didn't do it to me....seems clear to me that your behavior, your works of doing good, will be considered whether or not you are sincere in your devotion to Christ....Just saying "I am born again" probably won't cut it...
Same here. Not a clue that I have found.
>>All that said, the Lord is wonderful and digging into Scripture and reading what others report from having dug into it is a wonderful treat.<<
I certainly think so and appreciate your input as well.
Strong's lists two instances of this word kuriakos and your translation does not fit naturally. It is translated "Lord's" in both cases. A Fundamentalist you would never throw the KJV in the trash, so to speak, like that. Are you in a Worldwide Church of God or a Seventh Day Adventist faith group ? Since you seem to pose as a Greek linguist, just what are your qualifications and credentials ?
Thx much CB!
if it weren't for the Crusades, you'd be speaking in arabic and kissing allah's BUTT
You are right. Thank you for that. I will pray for patience!
when you did not know you conducted yourself in a very unworthy manner and I’m talking about unworthy to the Lord not me.
I had a sneaking suspicion that you were a good guy from the very beginning of the thread.
you and your protestant brethren have a very poor way of demonstrating that.
You automatically believe the worst about Catholics and the best about protestants (despite those who do not respect others wishes).
Try this Examination of Conscience just skip over the really Catholic stuff:
First Commandment: I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt not have strange gods before Me. (Including sins against Faith, Hope and Charity)
Have I neglected the knowledge of my faith as taught in the catechism, such as the Apostles’ Creed, the Ten Commandments, the Seven Sacraments, the Our Father, etc.?
Have I deliberately doubted or denied any of the teachings of the Church?
Have I practiced any superstitions (such as horoscopes, fortune telling, Ouija board, etc.)?
Have I omitted religious duties or practices through motives of human respect?
Have I recommended myself daily to God?
Have I been faithful to my daily prayers?
Have I been guilty of great irreverence in church, e.g., conversation, behavior, or dress?
Have I been indifferent with regard to my Faith — believing one can be saved in any religion, that all religions are equal?
Have I presumed on God´s mercy at any time?
Have I despaired of God´s mercy?
Have I hated God?
Have I given too much importance to any creature, activity, object or opinion?
Second Commandment: Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.
Have I sworn by God’s name falsely, rashly or in slight and trivial matters?
Have I murmured or complained against God (blasphemy)?
Have I cursed myself or others, or any creature?
Have I angered others so as to make them swear or blaspheme God?
Have I broken a vow made to God?
Third Commandment: Remember that thou keep holy the Sabbath day.
Have I missed Mass on Sundays or Holy Days of obligation?
Have I been late for Mass on Sundays or Holy Days of obligation or left early through my own fault?
Have I made others miss Mass on Sundays or Holy Days of obligation, leave early or be late for Mass?
Have I been willfully distracted during Mass?
Have I done or commanded unnecessary servile work on Sunday or Holy Days of Obligation?
Have I bought or sold things not of necessity on Sunday and Holy Days of obligation?
Fourth Commandment: Honor thy father and thy mother.
Have I been disobedient or disrespectful to my parents, or have I neglected or refused to aid them in their wants or to do their last will?
Have I shown irreverence to others in positions of authority?
Have I maligned or insulted priests or others consecrated to God?
Have I failed in due reverence to aged persons?
Have I mistreated my spouse or my children?
Have I been disobedient or disrespectful to my husband?
Regarding my children:
Have I neglected their material needs?
Have I failed to care for their early baptism? *(See below.)
Have I failed to care for their proper religious education?
Have I allowed them to neglect their religious duties?
Have I allowed them to date/go steady without the prospect of marriage within the near future?
Have I failed to supervise the company they keep?
Have I failed to discipline them when they need it?
Have I given them a bad example?
Have I scandalized them by arguing with my spouse in front of my children?
Have I scandalized them by cursing or swearing in front of them?
Have I guarded modesty in the home?
Have I permitted them to wear immodest clothing (mini skirts; tight pants, dresses, or sweaters; see-through blouses, short-shorts, revealing swim suits, etc.)?†
Have I denied their freedom to marry or follow a religious vocation?
Fifth Commandment: Thou shalt not kill.
Have I procured, desired, or hastened the death or bodily injury of anyone?
Have I borne hatred?
Have I oppressed anyone?
Have I desired revenge?
Have I caused enmity between others?
Have I quarreled or fought with anyone?
Have I wished evil on anyone?
Have I intended or attempted to injure or mistreat others?
Is there anyone with whom I refuse to speak, or against whom I bear a grudge?
Have I taken pleasure in anyone’s misfortunes?
Have I been jealous or envious of anyone?
Have I had or attempted to have an abortion or counseled anyone else to do so?
Have I mutilated my body unnecessarily in any way?
Have I entertained thoughts of suicide, desired to commit suicide or attempted suicide?
Have I become drunk, used illicit drugs?
Have I overeaten or do I neglect to eat properly, i.e., nutritious foods?
Have I failed to correct in Charity?
Have I harmed anyone’s soul, especially children, by giving scandal through bad example?
Have I harmed my own soul by intentionally and without necessity exposing it to temptations, e.g.: bad TV, bad music, beaches, etc.
Sixth and Ninth Commandments: Thou shalt not commit adultery. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor´s wife.
Have I denied my spouse his or her marriage rights?
Have I practiced birth control (by pills, devices, withdrawal)?
Have I abused my marriage rights in any other way?
Have I committed adultery or fornication (premarital sex)?
Have I committed any unnatural sin against purity (homosexuality or lesbianism, etc.)?
Have I touched or embraced another impurely?
Have I engaged in prolonged or passionate kissing?
Have I engaged in petting?
Have I sinned impurely by myself (masturbation)?
Have I entertained or taken pleasure in impure thoughts?
Have I indulged in lustful desires for anyone, or willfully desired to see or do anything impure?
Have I willfully indulged in any sexual pleasure whether complete or incomplete?
Have I been an occasion of sin for others by wearing tight or otherwise revealing and immodest clothing?
Have I done anything to provoke or occasion impure thoughts or desires in others deliberately or through carelessness?
Have I read indecent literature or looked at bad pictures?
Have I watched suggestive movies, TV programs, or Internet pornography or permitted my children to do so?
Have I used indecent language or told indecent stories?
Have I willingly listened to such stories?
Have I boasted of my sins or taken delight in past sins?
Have I been in lewd company?
Have I consented to impure glances?
Have I neglected to control my imagination?
Have I prayed at once to banish such bad thoughts and temptations?
Have I avoided laziness, gluttony, idleness, and the occasions of impurity?
Have I attended immodest dances or indecent plays?
Have I unnecessarily remained alone in the company of someone of the opposite sex?
Note Well: Do not be afraid to tell the priest any impure sin you may have committed. Do not hide or try to disguise any such sin. The priest is there to help you and forgive you. Nothing you say will shock him, so do not be afraid, no matter how ashamed you might be.
Seventh and Tenth Commandments: Thou shalt not steal. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor´s goods.
Have I stolen anything? What or how much?
Have I damaged anyone’s property?
Have I negligently spoiled anyone´s property?
Have I been negligent in the stewardship of other people’s money or goods?
Have I cheated or defrauded others?
Have I gambled excessively?
Have I refused or neglected to pay any debts?
Have I acquired anything known to be stolen?
Have I failed to return things borrowed?
Have I cheated my employer of an honest day’s work?
Have I cheated my employees of their wages?
Have I refused or neglected to help anyone in urgent need?
Have I failed to make restitution for my stealing, cheating and frauds? (Ask the priest how to go about making restitution, that is, returning to the owner what you unjustly took from him/her.)
Have I been envious of another because I don´t have what he has?
Have I been jealous of what another has?
Have I been stingy?
Have I been grasping and avaricious, placing too great importance upon material goods and comforts? Is my heart set on earthly possessions or on the true treasures of Heaven?
Eighth Commandment: Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.
Have I lied about anyone (calumny)?
Have my lies caused them any material or spiritual harm?
Have I rashly judged anyone (i.e. believed firmly, without sufficient evidence, that they are guilty of some moral defect or crime)?
Have I injured the good name of another by revealing true but hidden faults (detraction)?
Have I disclosed another´s sins?
Have I been guilty of talebearing, (i.e. reporting something unfavorable said of someone by another so as to create enmity between them)?
Have I lent an ear to or encouraged the spreading of scandal about my neighbor?
Have I taken false oaths or signed false documents?
Am I, without necessity, critical, negative or ever uncharitable in my talk?
Have I flattered others?
The Spiritual and Corporal Works of Mercy
Have I neglected to do the following whem circumstances obliged me:
The Seven Spiritual Works of Mercy
1. To admonish sinners. 2. To instruct the ignorant. 3. To counsel the doubtful.
4. To comfort the sorrowful. 5. To bear wrongs patiently. 6. To forgive all injuries. 7. To pray for the living and the dead?
The Seven Corporal Works of Mercy
1. To feed the hungry. 2. To give drink to the thirsty. 3. To clothe the naked.
4. To visit and ransom the captives. 5. To harbor the harborless. 6. To visit the sick. 7. To bury the dead?
Remember our Holy Catholic Faith teaches us that … as the body without the spirit is dead; so also faith without works is dead. (James, 2:26)
The Seven Deadly Sins and the Opposite Virtues
Pride............................................................Humility
Covetousness..............................................Liberality
Lust.............................................................Chastity
Anger..........................................................Meekness
Gluttony.....................................................Temperance
Envy............................................................Brotherly love
Sloth............................................................Diligence
Five Effects of Pride
Vainglory: a. Boasting b. Dissimulation / Duplicity
Ambition
Contempt for others
Anger / Revenge / Resentment
Stubbornness / Obstinacy.
Nine Ways of Being an Accessory to Another´s Sin
a.Have I knowingly caused others to sin?
b.Have I co-operated in the sins of others:
By counsel.
By command.
By consent.
By provocation.
By praise or flattery.
By concealment.
By partaking.
By silence.
By defense of the ill done?
The Four Sins which Cry to Heaven for Vengeance
Willful Murder.
The sin of Sodomy or Lesbianism.
Oppression of the poor.
Defrauding the laborer of his just wages.
For the Greater Glory of God
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