Posted on 12/27/2013 8:33:08 PM PST by Colofornian
...For eight years, I had been a professor at Brigham Young University...
I looked down on Christians...They had part of the gospel, but I had the fullness of it. I kept the laws and ordinances of Mormonism.
Three weeks before the end of his two-year mission, Micah called to tell us he was being sent home early—a horrific disgrace in Mormon culture. He had been reading the New Testament. There he encountered a different Jesus than the one I was taught about in Mormonism—a God of grace, not of works, so that no one can boast...
To a roomful of missionaries at his parting testimony, Micah had professed faith in Jesus alone and not the Mormon Church. He told them he had found a deep and genuine faith—one that didn't include Mormonism. It did not go over well. Church leaders told us that Micah had the spirit of the Devil in him, sent him home, and subsequently, back in Utah, invited us to bring him before the high council...
Micah pleaded, "Mom and Dad, please read the New Testament." We commenced. As I read, I became increasingly consumed by reading about the God of grace. I barely ate or slept. It's all I wanted to do.
...In John's gospel, I read, "These are the very scriptures that testify of me yet you refuse to come to me to have life." Salvation did not require the Mormon Church, only Jesus...
...on a chilly October evening in 2006, Michael and I settled in with Katie in our basement to watch the movie Luther. My heart pounded as I learned of the reformer's struggle against the Catholic Church. I seemed to be facing a similar struggle: Did I believe the Mormon system of obedience to laws and ordinances would secure my forgiveness?
(Excerpt) Read more at christianitytoday.com ...
So many fish; such a little barrel!
I miss ol' PD!
HE was about useless when it came to defending his faith; but at LEAST he had a bunch of links that showed interested people where to find the MILK of MORMONism...
Here; in his memory; is The LIST:
“My witness and my testimony is between me and my Savior, Jesus Christ. I am thankful and humbled beyond measure that “
Actually, you post that deceptive write-up here frequently.
Catholics seem to NEVER tire of lambasting Luther.
“not the type of sanctimonious, judgmental spirit that you are displaying.”
1. Mormons judge EVERY Christian group EVERY DAY - so save the electrons.
2. We ARE supposed to judge FALSEHOOD as Christians -as JESUS, PAUL, PETER and ALL. The prophets demonstrated.
“But it is also not given to you or I to pass judgment on the heartfelt witness and testimonies of others.”
We are to judge perverse doctrines and half-truths
“The scriptures teach that no one confesses Christ Jesus”
Mormonism teaches a FALSE CHRIST, as CHRIST Himself warned against. Confessing a false Christ, even “sincerely”, leaves you unsaved.
Why not abandon the cultic teaching now, and be saved?
And not one of those popes taught heresy - I smell infallibility, even among popes who were very prone to sin.
TempleStudy.com Fireside Discussion – Introduction
http://www.templestudy.com/2012/08/05/templestudycom-fireside-discussion-introduction/
I am so thankful what the Lord has given us in these Latter Days so there is no confusion.
Temple Theology - An Introduction Margaret Barker (Author)
http://www.amazon.com/Temple-Theology-Introduction-Margaret-Barker/dp/028105634X
One of the reviews
Stunning Overview of Barker’s Prodigious Lifework
By Bay Gibbons VINE VOICE on February 11, 2009
Format: Paperback
This reviewer comes to Margaret Barker’s “Temple Theology” after nearly a decade of reading her great corpus of Biblical studies, including The Gate of Heaven: The History and Symbolism of the Temple in Jerusalem, The Older Testament: The Survival of Themes from the Ancient Royal Cult in Sectarian Judaism and Early Christianity, The Lost Prophet: The Book of Enoch and Its influence on Christianity, The Great Angel: A Study of Israel’s Second God, The Great High Priest: The Temple Roots of Christian Liturgy and The Great High Priest: The Temple Roots of Christian Liturgy. This vast and prodigious output is unparalleled in the field of Biblical criticism of the past century. However, it will be admitted that much of her work is so dense in its scholarship and explication, that it becomes exceedingly difficult to the specialist, let alone the lay person.
Now we come to the present work, “Temple Theology,” which is no more nor less than the reprint of a series of lectures given by Barker at the University of London in 2003, and reprinted in book form by the Society for Promoting Christian Knowledge in 2004. This plainly written text with a minimum of footnotes provides an excellent introduction to and a summary of the Barker corpus of scholarship.
As is shown by the attacks made in companion reviews on this site, Barker’s honest and courageous reexamination and reworking of centuries of Biblical scholarship—mostly German and chiefly Protestant—is not an easy task. Barker’s chief thesis is as deeply disconcerting to the traditional Biblical scholar as it is to the devoted Evangelical worshipper. Her central thesis—that Jesus Christ was essentially a restorer of a lost hierocentric religion rather than an inventor of something new—has successfully shaken the very foundations of Old Testament and early Christian scholarship.
Barker is much like the lone voice crying in the wilderness, facing an army of dead and living German Protestant scholars whose researches laid the foundation for a century and more of intertestamental scholarship, and whose life labors are now called into serious question by Barker’s stunning and groundbreaking labors. She also faces a vast multitude of Christians of every possible denomination who have been taught to believe in a strict trinitarian monothesism—a tenet which Barker devastatingly shows is inconsistent with both ancient Jewish religion centered on the First Temple and the Temple-centered religion which Jesus restored and revitalized. Nevertheless, Barker is not entirely alone in the wilderness. Her work is now admiringly and diligently studied by courageous Catholics, German scholars of the Protestant tradition, Russian Orthodox, Mormons and others. More than sixty careful reviews of Barker’s work have been published, including a lead review in the Times Literary Supplement in 2003.
That being said, Western academia is not yet sold on Barker, with complaints that while her work is remarkably convincing, it leaves too many unanswered questions. To this reviewer, that is to be expected in the groundbreaking work of any pioneer scholar—as the circle of knowledge grows, so does its outside edge of ignorance.
Here is an extension of that line of thought by Mormon leaders
| WHEN | WHO/WHAT | LINK/SOURCE | COMMENT |
1857-2013 |
Mormon leader proclamations where the 'confession' is about Joseph Smith – and usually mentions/implies Smith as the 'Way' |
This goes against Romans 10:9-10 and John 14:6 in the Bible |
|
| 2013 (Feb. 10) | Faith in God? Faith in Jesus? How about Faith in Joseph Smith! "Come and bring your friends to this annual event that is sure to uplift spirits, strengthen testimonies, and renew FAITH IN OUR BELOVED PROPHET JOSEPH SMITH. See you there! Doors open at 6 pm." | Joseph Smith Memorial Fireside | Prior to this event – the annual Joseph Smith Memorial Fireside – which, for the first 30 years of its annual existence (1944-1973) was held as a competitive eclipse of Christmas in December -- celebrating Joseph Smith and his birthday...the YSA 30th (Lds) Ward promotes in the event by encouraging attenders to renew their faith in Jesus Christ? (Nope!) |
| 1993 (July 3) | Lds "apostle" L. Tom Perry, Lds Church News: "He not only gave us joy, happiness and opportunity here, but also a great hope in the life to come." | p. 4 | So Joseph Smith is the source of our joy, happiness, opportunity and our "great hope in the life to come?" This is open idolatry! |
| 1982 (originally published 1954) | Making a Decision for Joseph Smith? Eventual "to be 'Prophet'" Joseph Fielding Smith: [There is] "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God" | Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190 | Joseph Smith as "the way, the truth, and the life" eh? Joseph Smith 14:6? |
| 1974 | Deseret Book Co. publishes a book of discourses and writings of one of its top three hierarchists from the 19th century, George Q. Cannon, who announces: "If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by him [Joseph Smith]; if we enter our glory, it will be through the authority he has received. We cannot get around him [Joseph Smith]" (Lds "apostle" George Q. Cannon) | Editor Jerreld L. Newquist, Gospel Truth: Discourses and Writings of President George Q. Cannon, Vol. 1, p. 255 Deseret Book Co. | |
| 1967 (Dec. 3) | Is God or Jesus or the Holy Spirit the source of the “greatest activity in the world?” (Think again!) Smithmas time again, 1967: Lds "Prophet" Ezra Taft Benson, speaking at the annual commemoration of Joseph Smith's birthday (Joseph Smith Memorial Firesides), proclaims: “The greatest activity in this world or in the world to come is directly related to the work and mission of Joseph Smith.” | Read more at "Praise To The Man": A Review Of The Annual Joseph Smith Memorial Sermons; see also “Praise To The Man”: A Review Of The Annual Joseph Smith Memorial Sermons [Mormon Merry Smithmas] | No credit to Jesus; no credit to the Holy Spirit. 'Tis Joseph Smith who apparently spurs "the greatest activity in this world", eh? |
| 1966 | After Lds "prophet" David O. McKay told one First President to review lds "apostle" Bruce McConkie's Mormon Doctrine book (1958), and another – Spencer W. Kimball – to be his mentor in implementing changes, McConkie comes out in his 1966 revision of the book: Therefore, this quote passed the muster of two Lds "prophets" (McKay and Kimball) and First President (Marion G. Romney): "If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation." | Mormon Doctrine, Bruce McConkie, p. 670, republished later by Deseret Book Co., owned by the Mormon Church. Last republishing date was 1978. | Well, there ya go! Joseph Smith as the savior of the world! |
| 1954 (Republished 1972) | Eventual "to be 'Prophet'" Joseph Fielding Smith: [There is] "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God" | Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190 | Yup. A response to (or decision for) Christ becomes "accepting Joseph Smith"! |
| 1944 | "Brother Chase’s intense interest in this topic was obvious, since in the same year, 1944, he published a small volume titled Joseph the Prophet, As He Lives in the Hearts of His People. " | Read more at "Praise To The Man": A Review Of The Annual Joseph Smith Memorial Sermons; see also “Praise To The Man”: A Review Of The Annual Joseph Smith Memorial Sermons [Mormon Merry Smithmas] | |
| 1925 | Confess Joseph Smith – or you're of the antiChrist: Lds "apostle" John A Widtsoe compiled Discourses of Brigham Young and these were published by the Lds Church under its book company, Deseret. On page 435: "Whosoever CONFESSETH THAT JOSEPH SMITH WAS SENT OF GOD to reveal the holy Gospel to the children of men, and lay the foundation for gathering Israel, and building up the kingdom of God on the earth, that spirit is of God;" and every spirit that does not confess that God has sent Joseph Smith, and revealed the everlasting Gospel to and through him, is of Antichrist, no matter whether it is found in a pulpit or on a throne... | Discourses of Brigham Young, p. 435 (Original Brigham Young, 1860) | All you billions of "antichrists" out there that don't confess Joseph Smith as God's sent one...go ahead, raise your hand. (I see those hands!) Note: see note on 1860 entry |
| 1862 (July 13) | Brigham Young: "I have taught for thirty years, and still teach, that he that believeth in his heart and confesseth with his mouth that Jesus is the Christ and that Joseph Smith is his Prophet to this generation, is of God; and he that confesseth not that Jesus has come in the flesh and sent Joseph Smith with the fulness of the Gospel to this generation, is not of God, but is antichrist. All who confess that Joseph Smith is sent of God in the latter days, to lay the foundation of his everlasting kingdom no more to be thrown down, and will continue to keep his commandments, are born of God" | Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 9 | This Joseph Smith as the consenter/passport/way to Heavenly Father was a common Brigham Young theme 1857-1862 |
| 1860 (Sept. 9) | Brigham Young: "For unbelievers we will quote from the Scriptures—"Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God." Again—"Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God." I will now give my scripture—"Whosoever confesseth that Joseph Smith was sent of God to reveal the holy Gospel to the children of men, and lay the foundation for gathering Israel, and building up the kingdom of God on the earth, that spirit is of God;" and every spirit that does not confess that God has sent Joseph Smith, and revealed the everlasting Gospel to and through him, is of Antichrist, no matter whether it is found in a pulpit or on a throne, nor how much divinity it may profess, nor what it professes with regard to revealed religion and the account that is given of the Savior and his Father in the Bible. They may say that they acknowledge Him until doomsday, and he will never own them, nor bestow the Holy Spirit upon them, and they will never have visions of eternity opened to them, unless they acknowledge that Joseph Smith is sent of God. Such people I call unbelievers. They tell about believing in Jesus Christ, but they might as well talk about birds understanding the Hebrew language. This statement is no more positive than true. The spirit that confesses that this is the kingdom of God and his Church has the Spirit that fills the heavenly worlds, and every other spirit is of Antichrist. All whom I call unbelievers, if they will repent of their sins, obey the requirements in the New Testament, be baptized for the remission of sins by a man who holds the key and authority to lead them into the waters of baptism, and receive the laying on of hands for the Holy Ghost, shall receive a witness that Joseph Smith was a Prophet of God, and that he was sent of God to build up his kingdom in this last dispensation." | Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses: 8:176-177 | See "Notice how Brigham Young quotes 1 John 4:2 then says he will give his scripture which was worded like 1 John 4:2 except for a change in names. Brigham Young changed the name of Jesus Christ to Joseph Smith and added that any spirit who teaches that Joseph Smith was not a prophet is of the anti-christ." (4:03 mark of YouTube clip above) |
| 1859 (Oct. 9) | Brigham Young: "Joseph Smith holds the keys of this last dispensation, and is now engaged behind the veil in the great work of the last days. I can tell our beloved brother Christians who have slain the Prophets and butchered and otherwise caused the death of thousands of Latter-day Saints, the priests who have thanked God in their prayers and thanksgiving from the pulpit that we have been plundered, driven, and slain, and the deacons under the pulpit, and their brethren and sisters in their closets, who have thanked God, thinking that the Latter-day Saints were wasted away, something that no doubt will mortify them—something that, to say the least, is a matter of deep regret to them—namely, that no man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith. From the day that the Priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding-up scene of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are—I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent. He holds the keys of that kingdom for the last dispensation—the keys to rule in the spirit world; and he rules there triumphantly, for he gained full power and a glorious victory over the power of Satan while he was yet in the flesh, and was a martyr to his religion and to the name of Christ, which gives him a most perfect victory in the spirit world. He reigns there as supreme a being in his sphere, capacity, and calling, as God does in heaven. Many will ex claim—"Oh, that is very disagreeable! It is preposterous! We cannot bear the thought!" But it is true." | Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses: 7:289-290; see also Joseph Smith Saves - Mormonism Exposed | The Second Coming of Joseph Smith? |
| 1857 (July 26) | Joseph Young (not Brigham Young) on not simply "believing" Joseph Smith, but "believing IN" Joseph Smith: "Why, it is popular by the Christian world to acknowledge Jesus to be the Savior. The Catholics all acknowledge Jesus to be the Savior. The doctrine has become popular in the world, so much so that nearly the whole world now acknowledge that Christ truly was the Savior, the Redeemer, the Son of God; and they believe on him. Will people be persecuted for this? No. You may go into all ranks of society in the world, and they will receive you, if you are a Christian; but you must mind one thing—you must not name "Mormonism" —you must not say that Joseph was a man that you believed in; for the moment you do this you are in jeopardy...Now, brethren, this is a consolation to us all. Believe in God, believe in Jesus, and believe in Joseph his Prophet, and in Brigham his successor. And I add, "If you will believe in your heart and confess with your mouth that Jesus is the Christ, that Joseph was a Prophet, and that Brigham was his successor, you shall be saved in the kingdom of God," which I pray, in the name of Jesus, may be the case. Amen." | Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6 | See Joseph Smith Saves - Mormonism Exposed "Notice how joseph young [not brigham young] said that we must believe that Joseph Smith was prophet of God in our hearts and confess it with our mouths. This is a perversion of Romans 10:9-10 that teaches that salvation comes through belief and confession in the resurrection of Jesus Christ." (2:53 mark of Youtube clip linked) |
| 1857 (March 8) | Worshiping Joseph Smith as "Justifier": "If we can pass the sentinel Joseph the Prophet, we shall go into the celestial kingdom, and not a man can injure us. If he says, 'God bless you, come along here;' if we will live so that Joseph will justify us, and say, 'Here am I, brethren,' we shall pass every sentinel; there will be no danger but that we will pass into the celestial kingdom." | Brigham Young (Journal of Discourses 4:271) | God/Jesus alone justifies us! |
"I look to him. I love him. I seek to follow him." (15th Gordon B. Hinckley, Church News, 12/13/2003, p.3.)
This is a rather stark concession that Mormons are disciples of Joseph Smith.
A definition of a disciple, as defined by Lds "apostle" Bruce R. McConkie -- and as republished by the Mormon Church:
"Anyone who believes the doctrine, teachings, or philosophy of another and who follows that teacher is his disciple. He stands as a learner, a devotee of the one whose concept he accepts." (McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 198, also cited by the Mormon Church in its curriculum study guide – "When Thou Art Converted, Strengthren Thy Brethren: 1974-75" published by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints church in 1974, p. 134)
Mormons are devotees of Joseph Smith!
And neither did Luther; yet you catholics just LOVE to put him to the rack, scourge him with the whip and pierce him in the Iron Maiden!
Posted here - not linked to.
Luther was full of heresy.
Luther was the ultimate heretic. Do you know who he was? Are thinking of Dr King from the civil rights movement.
That’s because mormons believe Joseph Smith succeeded in setting up the “true church” where Jesus Christ failed. In fact they believe it is Joseph Smith jn the afterlife who admits mormons to godhood and his authority supersedes God’s in that instance, because after all they say God is only a man, glorified by the holiness of his own works, and Joseph Smith accomplished what God through His Son could not.
When it comes right down to it the mormons see Joseph Smith as the improved beta version of I AM THAT I AM and that they themselves can upgrade themselves to be better than the guy that was better than God, if they’re obedient and have the magical rites performed.
Joseph Smith was a prophet on earth, after death in their eyes he’s now The Lord.
Christians just like you.../s
Jeff
An hurtful and unloving act towards another child of God does not come from a true follower of Jesus Christ.
John 14
30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
those who are so tonally contained with darkness leave no place for the Light of Christ to shine within them.
If The Savior Stood Beside Me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0Z-M6EOzmY
...how sad that some can not truly receive him!
Which Savior are you referencing?
Jesus, or the "savior" Joseph Smith as referenced by Lds "apostle" Erastus Snow:
"Nor need we wait in our faith and in our expectations till all these great and glorious things shall have been accomplished on the earth before the Prophet Joseph Smith shall come unto us again. He has merely taken another mission in advance of us. He fulfilled the mission given unto him on earth. The Lord was satisfied with his labors here. He lived long enough to endow his brethren with full authority to carry on the work that he had begun on the earth. He took his departure behind the veil. The Lord suffered his enemies to destroy him in the flesh, to take away his life, and he was made an offering—what shall I say? an offering for sin...."
Source: Near Coming of Christ...Joseph Smith's Mission...Another Mission to Be Undertaken...
There ya go: An Lds "apostle" -- speaking in The Tabernacle in Logan, Utah in February 1884...claiming that Smith "was made an...offering for sin"!
And then tell us, Lds, how often have you sung the Mormon hymns "Praise to the Man" -- and "The Seer, the Seer, Joseph the Seer?"
Praise to the Man:
The true Gospel |
The false bad news 'gospel' of Joseph Smith-Centricism as found in 'Praise to the Man' |
| Jesus atoning for the sins of mankind by shedding his blood | All mankind will need to atone for the sin of shedding Joseph's blood -- as if all the earth was guilty of such an act! |
And then look @ the Messianic overtones of the quotes included by Reaganaut in post #122...Here's two of those citations:
"He died for those he loved. He reigns in the realms above." (3rd President John Taylor, Hymns #296, "The Seer, Joseph, The Seer." While this hymn was written in the 18th century, it is still in use as evidenced by its performance by the Mormon Tabernacle Choir during the 175th Semi-Annual General Conference of the LDS Church in October, 2005.)
...He was "a man of sorrows and acquainted with grief." (BYU Professor Robert Millet, Ensign, 9/1994, p.19.)
Why you'd think that Lds proph John Taylor & BYU prof Rbt Millet would be speaking of THE Savior, Jesus Christ. But they weren't: They were inserting Joseph Smith there!
So, far, I've seen SEVEN -- count them SEVEN -- different Mormon hymnals/praise books by 1948 which have had John Taylor's The Seer, the Seer, Joseph the Seer! in them. Depending upon which Mormon hymnbook/praise song book you had --
1948 - Hymn #238
1927 - Hymn #303
1912 - Hymn #286
1908 - Hymn #187
1891 and before - Hymn #290...
...And it looks like it was Hymn #290 in the original Mormon hymnbook -- at least its in the 1851 version:
| 1851 | Sacred Hymns and Spiritual Songs for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints By Brigham YOUNG, Parley Parker PRATT, Franklin D. Richards, pp. 337-338 |
And this hymnbook was revised about every couple of years ...at least I know that by 1891, they had its 20th edition out on it.
| 1891 | Hymn 290: The Seer, The Seer, Joseph the Seer! |
All: Here are the actual lyrics from John Taylor's "The Seer, the Seer. Joseph the Seer!"
I've placed the most open idolatrous lyrics in the largest type below:
Meant to be sung to the tune: The Sea. Times and Seasons, 1 January 1845
************************
Since this is a thread about escaping from the anti-Christian cult of Mormonism, why don’t you 2 boys address Joey Smith the inventor of that pagan religion..
What level heretic would Joey Smith be ???
Ultimate or worse ???
Boys? LOL! You need to click on my name.
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