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Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ
LDS.org ^ | Dennis B. Neuenschwander

Posted on 01/02/2011 5:46:30 PM PST by Paragon Defender

Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ

By Elder Dennis B. Neuenschwander Of the Seventy

 

 

 

Dennis B. Neuenschwander, “Joseph Smith: An Apostle of Jesus Christ,” Ensign, Jan 2009, 16–22

Adapted from a presentation to the Seventy.

 

 

 

In the Doctrine and Covenants we read that Joseph Smith was “called of God, and ordained an apostle of Jesus Christ” (D&C 20:2). The call of an Apostle is first to witness or testify of Jesus Christ. Old Testament prophets testified of His coming. The New Testament Apostles bore personal witness of Christ’s being and of the absolute reality of His Resurrection. This apostolic witness was the basis of their teaching. “Ye shall be witnesses unto me” (Acts 1:8) was Jesus’s instruction to the original Twelve. Peter testified on the day of Pentecost to the Jews who had gathered “out of every nation” (Acts 2:5) that “this Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses” (Acts 2:32). Similarly, Paul wrote to the Corinthians that Jesus “was seen of me also” (1 Corinthians 15:8). The sure witness of Christ’s being and the reality of His Resurrection is the first pillar of apostolic testimony.

The second pillar is centered on the Savior’s redemptive and saving power. Peter teaches that to the Lord “give all the Prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins” (Acts 10:43).

Without these twin pillars of testimony concerning Christ, there could be no Apostle. Such testimonies are born of experience, divine command, and instruction. For example, Luke writes that Christ showed Himself to the Apostles “alive after his passion … being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God” (Acts 1:3).

How does the Prophet Joseph Smith fit into these apostolic requirements? The answer is “Perfectly.”

The First Vision

Joseph Smith’s apostolic instruction began in 1820. Pondering the questions of religion, he soon found that there was no way to reason or argue one’s opinion to an authoritative conclusion concerning the correctness of the various churches or their doctrines. Short of a divine manifestation, young Joseph could add only one more opinion to the already existing “war of words and tumult of opinions” (Joseph Smith—History 1:10). But Joseph’s questions on religion were answered by the personal and physical manifestation of God the Father and His divine and living Son, Jesus Christ—an experience referred to as the First Vision.

Like that of the original Apostles, Joseph’s experience with Deity was direct and personal. There was no need for the opinion of others or the deliberations of a council to define what he saw or what it came to mean to him. Joseph’s vision was at first an intensely personal experience—an answer to a specific question. Over time, however, illuminated by additional experience and instruction, it became the founding revelation of the Restoration.

As apostolic as this manifestation of Christ’s being, existence, and Resurrection was to Joseph Smith, it was not the only thing Jesus wanted to teach him. The boy Joseph’s first lesson arose from the manifestation of Christ’s absolute, omnipotent, and divine power. Joseph learned firsthand at least one meaning of the redeeming and saving power of Christ when he prayed in the grove. As he began to pray, “Thick darkness gathered around me, and it seemed to me for a time as if I were doomed to sudden destruction” (Joseph Smith—History 1:15). With every bit of energy Joseph had, he began to call upon God to deliver him from the grasp of this enemy.

“At the very moment when I was ready to sink into despair and abandon myself to destruction … , I saw a pillar of light. …

“It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound” (Joseph Smith—History 1:16–17).

Joseph Smith’s confrontation with the adversary is reminiscent of an experience Moses had, about which the Prophet would learn some few years later. Unlike the boy Joseph, however, Moses saw God’s greatness first and then was confronted with the power of the adversary before being delivered from his influence. (See Moses 1.)

The difference in the order of events is significant. Moses was already far into maturity and had much knowledge and influence prior to this event. By displaying His magnificent power to Moses before he faced the adversary, the Lord helped Moses put his life into perspective. After experiencing God’s glory, Moses said, “Now, for this cause I know that man is nothing, which thing I never had supposed” (Moses 1:10). This incident enabled Moses to withstand the temptations of the adversary that followed.

Joseph Smith, on the other hand, was an inexperienced young man, who in his lifetime would repeatedly face adversarial power and the overwhelming problems it brings. By facing the adversary first, then being saved from his assault by the appearance of the Father and the Son, Joseph learned this indelible lesson: as great as the power of evil might be, it must always withdraw with the appearance of righteousness.

This lesson was critical in Joseph’s apostolic education. He needed this knowledge not only because of the personal trials that lay ahead of him but also because of the overwhelming opposition he would face in founding and directing the Church.

The boy Joseph went into the grove seeking wisdom, and wisdom he received. His apostolic instruction had begun. Among the great apostolic lessons of this First Vision were both the physical nature of the Savior and Heavenly Father and the initial and fundamental lessons relating to Their power—each a pillar of apostolic testimony.

The Book of Mormon

Joseph Smith’s early apostolic instruction continued with his translation of the Book of Mormon. The Book of Mormon gave Joseph access to “the fulness of the everlasting Gospel” (Joseph Smith—History 1:34), principles that were necessary to understand even prior to the organization of the Church. The Prophet was introduced to numerous “plain and most precious” (1 Nephi 13:26) prophetic and apostolic testimonies regarding the Savior, all of which served as models for him.

Indeed, the Book of Mormon prophets employ over 100 titles in their teachings of Christ, each of which helped Joseph understand the Savior’s divine role.1 By virtue of these teachings, Joseph Smith became intimately acquainted with ancient prophets, giving him insight into the divine purpose of his responsibilities.

The Book of Mormon illuminates the universality of Christ’s Atonement. The Savior’s holy sacrifice is not confined to the borders of the Holy Land of His day or even restricted to the apostolic world of the original Twelve. The Atonement encompasses all of God’s creations—past, present, and future. What an impression Jacob’s teaching of the “infinite atonement” (2 Nephi 9:7) must have made on the mind of young Joseph, especially in contrast to Christian teachings at the time.

The Book of Mormon also introduces the universality of the Resurrection and other doctrines relating to it. Discourses on this doctrine by Lehi, Jacob, King Benjamin, Abinadi, Alma, Amulek, Samuel the Lamanite, and Moroni are all rich sources of instruction.

During the translation of the Book of Mormon, the Prophet received additional valuable personal instruction concerning the redemptive and saving power of Christ. In 1828 Martin Harris persuaded Joseph to lend him the first 116 pages of the Book of Mormon manuscript. When Martin Harris lost those pages, the Prophet felt an enormous despair.2 His mother, Lucy Mack Smith, recorded that Joseph exclaimed: “Oh, my God! … All is lost! all is lost! What shall I do? I have sinned—it is I who tempted the wrath of God. … How shall I appear before the Lord? Of what rebuke am I not worthy from the angel of the Most High?”3

For well over a month the Lord left Joseph in this terrible condition of remorse.4 Then came relief and the apostolic lesson. The Lord told Joseph:

“The works, and the designs, and the purposes of God cannot be frustrated, neither can they come to naught. …

“For although a man may have many revelations, and have power to do many mighty works, yet if he boasts in his own strength, and sets at naught the counsels of God, and follows after the dictates of his own will and carnal desires, he must fall and incur the vengeance of a just God upon him” (D&C 3:1, 4).

These words carefully describe what Joseph Smith had been experiencing. He had learned the exacting nature of the apostolic call and to whom the Apostle, at all cost, owes his loyalty. “Although men set at naught the counsels of God, and despise his words,” Joseph was told, “yet you should have been faithful” (D&C 3:7–8). Joseph Smith had lost access to the plates for a season and had been taught an invaluable lesson. Subsequently, the plates were returned, and his position as translator restored.

How critical were the lessons provided by the translation of the Book of Mormon as Joseph Smith grew in his apostolic calling! The Book of Mormon is the “keystone of our religion”5 because it contains so many prophetic testimonies of Christ and stands as a tangible witness of the Restoration.

Continuing Revelation and Scripture

After finishing the translation of the Book of Mormon in 1829 and organizing the Church in 1830, Joseph Smith had the opportunity to receive continuing apostolic education through the process of translating other scripture. This included three years of translating the Bible and, beginning in 1835, translating the book of Abraham. Joseph Smith’s translation of the Bible expanded his understanding of the role of Old Testament prophets and New Testament Apostles. It also resulted in additional revelation, namely the book of Moses.

The book of Moses provided the Prophet with important knowledge about the Savior’s ministry, including His role in the Creation. “The Lord spake unto Moses, saying: … I am the Beginning and the End, the Almighty God; by mine Only Begotten I created these things” (Moses 2:1). Further, He said, “And worlds without number have I created; … and by the Son I created them, which is mine Only Begotten” (Moses 1:33).

The book of Moses clarified Christ’s relationship to the Father in the premortal existence and reinforced the Prophet’s understanding of the ascendant power of righteousness. One of the most beautiful of all the apostolic lessons that came to Joseph Smith in this revelation was the confirmation of God’s love. It was so different from the harsh, unforgiving, and judgmental personage so many believed God to be; the book of Moses reveals a God of infinite compassion. Enoch saw that the “God of heaven … wept” (Moses 7:28) over those who would not receive Him. Wishing to know how it was possible, Enoch was given an answer that has a familiar biblical feel to it: “I [have] given commandment, that they should love one another, and that they should choose me, their Father. … Wherefore should not the heavens weep, seeing these shall suffer?” (Moses 7:33, 37; see also Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18; Matthew 22:37–39).

Through the translation of the book of Moses, the Prophet also became more acquainted with the redeeming and saving power of the Savior. As the Lord said, this earth was created “by the word of my power” (Moses 1:32) for the purpose of bringing “to pass the immortality and eternal life of man” (Moses 1:39). Many long years before the Savior taught Thomas and the Twelve that “I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me” (John 14:6), He revealed to Moses that “this is the plan of salvation unto all men, through the blood of mine Only Begotten, who shall come in the meridian of time” (Moses 6:62).

The First Vision in the grove, the translation of the Book of Mormon, the revision of the Bible, the revelation of the book of Moses, and the translation of the book of Abraham laid the basic foundation of the Church, largely through the rapidly expanding knowledge and testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith relating to Jesus Christ.

Revelations given to him and compiled in the Doctrine and Covenants contain a wealth of knowledge concerning the Savior. One could research the numerous topics and cross-references of the Topical Guide and Guide to the Scriptures referring to Jesus Christ and still not understand the breadth of information on the Savior that the Prophet Joseph Smith brought to the world. I am grateful to know that Jesus was “in the beginning with the Father” (D&C 93:21). I am grateful to know that He “suffered these things for [me], that [I] might not suffer if [I] would repent” (D&C 19:16).

My Testimony of What the Prophet Revealed

I am grateful for yet one other thing about the Savior’s ministry that stirs my soul deeply. From studying the promises of Malachi, Moroni’s initial visit with Joseph, the Savior’s words to the Nephites, and the visit of Elijah in the Kirtland Temple, I learn that God loves His children and has provided a way for each to return to Him. I know of no doctrine more just, no teaching that gives more hope than that of redemption of the dead. I am so grateful for the revelations that teach me that the Savior’s Atonement reaches to those who have lived, loved, served, and hoped for a better day yet never heard of Jesus or had the opportunity to embrace His gospel. This knowledge alone would be sufficient to convert me to the gospel if I knew nothing else at all. Here, at least for me, is the ultimate testimony of Jesus Christ and His atoning sacrifice.

What, then, can be said of the incomparable saving power of Christ? That which Joseph Smith learned in the Sacred Grove about the power of righteousness overcoming evil foreshadows the final scene. So reveals the Lord:

“I, having accomplished and finished the will of him whose I am, even the Father, concerning me—having done this that I might subdue all things unto myself—

“Retaining all power, even to the destroying of Satan and his works at the end of the world, and the last great day of judgment” (D&C 19:2–3).

Our own testimonies of the Savior are framed by the testimony and teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith. Is it any wonder then that the Prophet taught that “the fundamental principles of our religion are the testimony of the Apostles and Prophets, concerning Jesus Christ, that He died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended into heaven; and all other things which pertain to our religion are only appendages to it.”6

Joseph Smith’s apostolic testimony of the divine reality and the Resurrection of Jesus Christ, as well as his knowledge of the redemptive and saving power of the Savior, can best be seen by the Prophet’s own beautiful, powerful, and succinct witness:

“And now, after the many testimonies which have been given of him, this is the testimony, last of all, which we give of him: That he lives!

“For we saw him, even on the right hand of God; and we heard the voice bearing record that he is the Only Begotten of the Father—

“That by him, and through him, and of him, the worlds are and were created, and the inhabitants thereof are begotten sons and daughters unto God” (D&C 76:22–24).

How grateful I am for the apostolic call of Joseph Smith.

 

 

 

Notes

1. See Book of Mormon Reference Companion, ed. Dennis L. Largey (2003), 457–58.

2. See Lucy Mack Smith, History of Joseph Smith, ed. Preston Nibley (1958), 128–29.

3. History of Joseph Smith, 128, 129.

4. The 116 pages were lost in June 1828. In July Joseph Smith received what is now section 3 of the Doctrine and Covenants. In September the plates were returned to the Prophet. See the historical introductions to D&C 3; 10.

5. History of the Church, 4:461.

6. History of the Church, 3:30.

 

 

 

 

 

 


TOPICS: Breaking News; Other Christian; Theology; Worship
KEYWORDS: braking; cult; heresy; inman; lds; lies; mormon; notbreakingnews; propaganda; religion
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To: DelphiUser
And is I AM aka Heavenly Father? Or Jesus Christ? Where does the Holy Ghost fit in with this?
1,741 posted on 01/05/2011 7:10:24 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: Invincibly Ignorant

Well, thank you Tim McCarver for such a “colorful” analysis.

Ignorance can be cured, stupidity is forever.

IMO, your post is indicative of the latter when considering the numerous times you’ve had things explained to you by the “evil anti’s”.

I conclude that it indicates a tacit refusal to consider the other (”evil anti’s”) position, ergo, your claim to be “neutral” is compromised by your own bigotry.


1,742 posted on 01/05/2011 7:10:59 AM PST by SZonian (July 27, 2010. Life begins anew.)
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To: Invincibly Ignorant
 
Wouldn't that be kinda like ya'll comparing Mormon beliefs to that of Muslims? Cuz I see alot of that goin' on around here too. Thanx.
 
Say the secret word...
 

Oh it’s just another Moron cultie trying to defend their polygamous paedophile false prophet (who, ironically,but not coincidentally, stated without equivocation that he felt more commonality and kinship with MOHAMMAD...than he did with any of the Christian sects of his day...)





In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim,

    “I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’ ”[1]

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.

    · Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

    · Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

    · Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

    · As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.

    · Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]

    · Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.

    · Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

    · Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

    · Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed's followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, believe Mohammed's son was to be their next leader. Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith’s followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith’s own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

    · Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

      “I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4]


 

Endnotes

[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”


1,743 posted on 01/05/2011 7:11:51 AM PST by Elsie
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To: Invincibly Ignorant

OOOooohhh!

Did I post the REFERENCES, too?


1,744 posted on 01/05/2011 7:12:22 AM PST by Elsie
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To: Elsie
I guess. Just means there's more dead air to cover. I'm used to that around here. lol.

Hey, not to change the subject, but I was just thinking when you posted your latest spam a minute ago. If you were around somewhere about 300 ad all you'd have to do is change some names and places and your spam might have worked back then too. :-)

1,745 posted on 01/05/2011 7:13:53 AM PST by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: DelphiUser

What’s your name going to be when you become a god? I Am , Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ, The Holy Spirit, Yahweh and Jehovah are already taken.

If it were me, I’d be seriously thinking about it. KInda like an academy award speech :-)

But then again, I’m just a woman so my name will never be spoken again after my husband uses it to call me out of the grave. If he so chooses.


1,746 posted on 01/05/2011 7:19:16 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: SZonian

Feel better now? I’m under no illusions. I’m used to all of those sharing your beliefs claiming ultimate objectivity.
But Thanx. Since I’m McCarver I guess it was Mr. Buck who called in sick today. :-)


1,747 posted on 01/05/2011 7:21:50 AM PST by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: restornu
So far you have not given me a specific item from the offical Church Doctrine which is contain in the standard works. Bible Book of Mormon Pearl of Great Price, and Doctrine and Covenants Anything else is Sermons, Ponderings and speculations.

But, but...what if The Living Prophet© speaks them? Aren't they as valid as scripture at least until he dies and is replaced?

1,748 posted on 01/05/2011 7:22:30 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: restornu
but any thread that is LDS can be confusing to those who don’t follow closely the RF threads.

Fixed it for you Resty

1,749 posted on 01/05/2011 7:26:25 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: restornu
happy campers are paying campers

And you would know this HOW?

1,750 posted on 01/05/2011 7:27:44 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: Sontagged

Jesus died for the sins of the world.
_____________________________________________

No kid

Jesus died for the people of the world...

to save us from the penalty of death for our sins..

He who knew no sin became sin for us...

and was punished in our place...

Now its up to us to accept of reject whay He did...

But we must decide BEFORE we die...

Once we die its too late...


1,751 posted on 01/05/2011 7:31:49 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: Invincibly Ignorant
Wouldn't that be kinda like ya'll comparing Mormon beliefs to that of Muslims?

Ah, the old "you did it first" Mormon diversion tactic.

There are some Christian beliefs that are similar to muslim beliefs. I don't get all excited about it.

But I do when I'm grouped with violent, ugly, anti-patriotic behavior. Are you defending Tara's accusation or perhaps agreeing with it?

1,752 posted on 01/05/2011 7:35:50 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: T Minus Four; Jim Robinson; All
just unite on the Godly principles

Who gets to pick which god? You?

****

1 Jn.
7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.

1 Jn. 3
11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.

• • •

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

Gal. 5
13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

1 Thes. 3
12 And the Lord make you to increase and abound in love one toward another, and toward all men, even as we do toward you:

So now who is following the Jesus of the Scriptures?

Matt. 5
43 ¶ Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

Luke 6
27 ¶ But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,

• • •

35 But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

1,753 posted on 01/05/2011 7:36:43 AM PST by restornu
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To: Invincibly Ignorant; DelphiUser
Hey II, maybe you can answer my question. DU seems to be too busy. What "vital truth" was missing from the bible. I want more than anything to spend eternity with Jesus but the Mormons say I can't by following the bible alone.

So please, tell me what is insufficient or missing from the bible! Just one little truth!

1,754 posted on 01/05/2011 7:41:08 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: T Minus Four
Many, many over the years have been zotted from all faiths who original purpose was a Free Republic. ??????????????????

Name two (giving you the benefit of the doubt)

***

Just ask the Calvinists for a start!

1,755 posted on 01/05/2011 7:42:49 AM PST by restornu
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To: T Minus Four
But I do when I'm grouped with violent, ugly, anti-patriotic behavior. Are you defending Tara's accusation or perhaps agreeing with it?

The "Ugly" part of it yes. The violence and anti-patriotism, haven't seen it yet. But it works for "ugly." Thanx for asking. :-)

Do Mormon kids strap on bombs and walk into Restaurants?

1,756 posted on 01/05/2011 7:43:16 AM PST by Invincibly Ignorant
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To: restornu

OK, you narrowed it down to Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ. Now pick one please.


1,757 posted on 01/05/2011 7:43:16 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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To: Invincibly Ignorant
We'd learn quickly the motive wasn't to evangelize or to attempt pulling you out of the throngs or your "wicked" cult. I conclude their offerings are efforts to convince themselves they are "right" more than anything.

That's a bit off target, nothing as superficial as that is.

Those that know the truth of who the mainstream Christian Historical Jesus is aren't concerned with being "right" to observers, but to keep other posters from denigrating His attributes to something that He isn't.

In this case, having as an Apostle such as Joseph Smith which Bucolically is impossible and is an attempt by the LDS to co-opt the Son of God as their own while keeping behind the curtain all the official writings that show that their "Jesus" is quite different.

If they would just come out in the open and acknowledge their writings are antithesis to mainstream Christianity they could have their own swell religion and leave ours alone.

1,758 posted on 01/05/2011 7:43:35 AM PST by Syncro
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To: T Minus Four

Where does the Holy Ghost fit in with this?
________________________________________________

The Holy Ghost is now in a state of probation which, if he should perform in righteousness, he may pass through the same, or similar course of things that the Son has”
An account of a sermon delivered by Joseph Smith on 27 Aug 1843(Words of Joseph Smith, p. 245, punctuation and capitalization corrected)

“No member of the godhead dwells in us in the literal sense of the word, but all of them dwell in us figuratively to the extent that we are like them.”
(See Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith pg 275-76)

. ...”the Holy Ghost is now in a state of probation which, if he should perform in righteousness, he may pass through the same or a similar course of things that the Son has” (Words of Joseph Smith, p, 245, capitalization and punctuation corrected)

... “the Holy Ghost is yet a spiritual body and waiting to take to himself a body as the Savior did, or as God did, or the Gods before them took bodies” (Words of Joseph Smith, p. 382, capitalization and punctuation corrected)

Source: The Holy Ghost, by Joseph Fielding McConkie and Robert L. Millet, p. 9, copyright © 1989 Bookcraft, Inc


1,759 posted on 01/05/2011 7:44:05 AM PST by Tennessee Nana
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To: restornu

The Calvinists had a caucus here on FR? Must have been before my time. and they all got booted?


1,760 posted on 01/05/2011 7:44:59 AM PST by T Minus Four ("Vital truths were restored by God through Joseph Smith. I just can't think of one")
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